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Front office drama: "I never tried to fire Casey." - Colangelo

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  • #16
    Steven Simmons is a no-talent hack. He is awful on The Reports. Hodge & Arthur carry that show.

    But, I wouldn't put anything past our idiot GM either.

    I choose not to believe Simmons' report because so many other TO media members are connected at MSLE and nobody corroborated the story.

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    • #17
      Employee wrote: View Post
      I don't know how often teams go from missing the playoffs to winning a championship in a year. At this point making the playoffs is a big step and you build from there.
      That's true when you're expecting to take constant steps forward like the Thunder with Durant, the Bulls with Rose, the Clippers with Griffin, etc. It's not true when you're looking at a roster with all of its key players (save one) in their prime, capped out, with no pick, which is staring down 8th place like the holy grail.

      My broader point is that the benchmarks are no longer 'make the playoffs; then make the playoffs and win; then, try to get yourself to conference finals and give yourself a chance; then, with luck, win a ring' - the bar is now 'get the 8th seed..... hopefully'. Apparently, people are cool with that. Hence my avatar....

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      • #18
        I wonder if Simmons will lose his access to the Raptors like Feschuk apparently did. Don't want to cross Bryan, or else...

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        • #19
          Yeah, I don't buy the drama. Also, have to consider BC is all about image, PR, and using it to keep his job.

          If he doesn't fire Casey, it somewhat ties their fates together. As long as Casey is the head coach, and with the team built as is, it's Colangelo's "vision", and it makes it harder to cut him out of the picture. He can sell ownership on letting things play out for one more year, because removing him likely means a lot of instability after a solid 3-4 years of such instability. Next season, results aside, should be a stable year with most of the core roster returning. Only two or three spots need to be filled, and only the 3rd big might be a starter.

          If he fires Casey, he's saying his "vision" isn't working already. And then how does he sell his extra year to ownership? Asking them to basically be patient, while he looks for a new coach that hopefully fits the roster in his view? He'd be causing more instability after selling a process that was supposed to build a real "foundation". And he'd be showing an incredible lack of foresight, since he hired Casey with a flawed roster, and that means that moves made after his hiring should've suited Casey's coaching style.

          So yeah, firing him shows that he has no clue what he's doing, and it shows it to ownership right now. Selling patience, and another year for both him and Casey, is the only option where ownership can still under any circumstance assume that BC might have any clue what he's doing. And if it works, then the franchise can move into it's most stable era, possibly ever. If it doesn't, it invites a shakeup at a better time, so players don't wonder if things could've worked after a crappy year, and BC has no way to justify his track record in Toronto nor any way to convince them he could do better moving forward.

          I feel like at this point, their fates are tied together.
          Last edited by white men can't jump; Thu Apr 18, 2013, 03:23 PM.

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          • #20
            BC Season Predictions and Results

            12-13 - We are going to be a playoff team with an accelerated rebuild - NOPE
            11-12 - We are going to be competitive - NOPE, we are in rebuild mode
            10-11 - Oh man, we thought we could build around CB
            09-10 - We are going to build around Chris Bosh - NOPE


            Time for someone with a vision.

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            • #21
              NoBan wrote: View Post
              Steven Simmons is a no-talent hack. He is awful on The Reports. Hodge & Arthur carry that show.

              But, I wouldn't put anything past our idiot GM either.

              I choose not to believe Simmons' report because so many other TO media members are connected at MSLE and nobody corroborated the story.
              Um, Eric Koreen and Bruce Arthur both corroborated the story in December. And again this morning on Twitter (Koreen, anyway).
              Definition of Statistics: The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures.

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              • #22
                I am still pissed that there was no strategic management of last season's end weeks (some people call it tanking) so we might have had a shot at a player like Lilliard. Does anyone remember who N. Jersey played in one of those last games against the Raps...nobodies...when they had already traded their draft pick. Wouldnt have surprised me if their thinking was that having a higher pick go to Portland in effect weakens the Raps. How would Lilliard looked on the Raps and still have our pick this year? This is the NBA and teams like the Raps can realistically only get their best thru the draft.

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                • #23
                  jimmie wrote: View Post
                  Um, Eric Koreen and Bruce Arthur both corroborated the story in December. And again this morning on Twitter (Koreen, anyway).
                  My bad. The report is probably true then. That's a bit of a can of worms then, innit? Problems:

                  GM without power to make coaching staff decisions
                  GM willing to uproot any potential stability after building a roster of young players
                  GM looking for a scapegoat despite failures pre-dating coach's tenture
                  GM out of sync with ownership AND coaching staff
                  Key players assembled by the same GM are locked in for at least 2 more years

                  Ooof.

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                  • #24
                    I think we can all agree here that BC is a guy that wouldn't give up this easily

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                    • #25
                      Bendit wrote: View Post
                      I am still pissed that there was no strategic management of last season's end weeks (some people call it tanking) so we might have had a shot at a player like Lilliard. Does anyone remember who N. Jersey played in one of those last games against the Raps...nobodies...when they had already traded their draft pick. Wouldnt have surprised me if their thinking was that having a higher pick go to Portland in effect weakens the Raps. How would Lilliard looked on the Raps and still have our pick this year? This is the NBA and teams like the Raps can realistically only get their best thru the draft.
                      NJ's draft pick was protected so they were tanking in an attempt (hope) that they'd keep it.

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                      • #26
                        Bendit wrote: View Post
                        I am still pissed that there was no strategic management of last season's end weeks (some people call it tanking) so we might have had a shot at a player like Lilliard. Does anyone remember who N. Jersey played in one of those last games against the Raps...nobodies...when they had already traded their draft pick. Wouldnt have surprised me if their thinking was that having a higher pick go to Portland in effect weakens the Raps. How would Lilliard looked on the Raps and still have our pick this year? This is the NBA and teams like the Raps can realistically only get their best thru the draft.
                        Even if they got the 6th pick, the Raptors would have drafted Barnes, not Lillard. So the chase for Nash would have still happened... Fields would have been signed... Lowry would have been traded for the 2013 pick... and Bryan would have still had a hard on for Gay. Nothing would have changed except we would have had Barnes instead of Ross neither of which would have gotten a lot of minutes.

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                        • #27
                          planetmars wrote: View Post
                          Even if they got the 6th pick, the Raptors would have drafted Barnes, not Lillard. So the chase for Nash would have still happened... Fields would have been signed... Lowry would have been traded for the 2013 pick... and Bryan would have still had a hard on for Gay. Nothing would have changed except we would have had Barnes instead of Ross neither of which would have gotten a lot of minutes.
                          Why do you say that? I always thought that Lillard was top on their board.

                          *And I say that as someone who wasn't high on him in the draft.
                          Last edited by white men can't jump; Thu Apr 18, 2013, 06:53 PM.

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                          • #28
                            slaw wrote: View Post
                            Maybe. When the team was 4-17 Colangelo went on TV during a game and said it wasn't a talent issue, which pointed the finger squarely at the coaching staff. Then, just to cover his bases, he also took that opportunity to throw his #5 overall pick and future of the franchise under the bus, back over him, and then park on his legs.

                            It wouldn't surprise me in the least if Colangelo was politicking all season and blaming various people for his failures. It's been his M.O. for 5 years and it's worked. He's ran through a laundry list of coaches and players only to fail with every single Frankenstein monster he's created, yet, here he is and there is no indication he is going anywhere.

                            My guess would be that they'll keep BC for one more year, he'll keep Casey, the team will start slow and Casey will be gone mid-season. Then, Colangelo can blame next season's failure on having to bring in a new coach who needs a full training camp. And back on the merry-go-round we go....
                            Couldn't disagree more. I don't this BC called out the coaching staff at all but the players not being able or willing to execute the game plan during the opening stretch of the season. I think he was right frankly. I at no time has BC throw Val under any bus.

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                            • #29
                              planetmars wrote: View Post
                              I wonder if Simmons will lose his access to the Raptors like Feschuk apparently did. Don't want to cross Bryan, or else...
                              Is it crossing Bryan or just blatantly lying? I would ban him too.

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                              • #30
                                CT2010 wrote: View Post
                                ...at no time has BC throw Val under any bus.
                                I remember the interview and I don't remember BC doing that either. The team finished 30-29 since the 4-19 start. Colangelo is a born salesman, so there's a good chance he's going to stay. Personally, I don't care if BC stays or gets fired. The rebuild is done and these are the players (for the most part) that'll try to get the team in the playoffs next year. Anybody they hire will not make any major changes in terms of personnel. Casey's job would be another matter.
                                Last edited by Michel G; Thu Apr 18, 2013, 10:27 PM.

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