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Changing Circumstances: A Tanking Argument

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  • Give Ross minutes and he'll perform. Kids got talent.

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    • Matt52 wrote: View Post
      I'm sorry but in my opinion the Raptors are much more than Valanciunas being good to be taking Miami to game 7 in the Eastern Conference Finals.

      George might have shot 42% from the floor but he shot 45.7% on 2pt FG compared to DeRozan's 46.3%. The difference in shooting is George takes 5.5 extra 3pt attempts per 48 minutes. As for the turnovers, that tends to happen to great players: LBJ 3 TO/g, Durant 3.5 TO/g.
      Kevin Durant scores 28 points per game and Lebron averages 7.3 assists. Plus they have both done have PER's near at around 30. Paul George was 16.8 last season, lower than Gay's PER in Toronto (17.2). What I'm getting at is last year's Paul George was not a significantly better player than last year's Rudy Gay and if you look at the rest of that Pacers squad and look at our team today, the only glaring spot where they are better than us right now is center. Derozan is very different than Stevenson but i wouldn't say Stevenson is better, Lowry is better than George Hill, Amir Johnson is not as good as David West, especially on offense, but the gap isn't huge and Amir closes it a bit more every year. Depth-wise we have their old back power forward, and Novak and Ross should also work well.
      The only aspect where they may have a big advantage is coaching...

      So yah, I think we are Jonas becoming an all-star and Casey spontaneously becoming a great coach away from going deep into the playoffs with a similar model to the Pacers.
      "Victory at all costs, victory in spite of all terror, victory however long and hard the road may be; for without victory, there is no survival."

      -Churchill

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      • Busy day at work today so didn't get a chance to follow the thread closely.. but when comparing Indiana and Toronto's rosters you have to compare the defense of both teams.

        Defense is Indiana's bread and butter. Hibbert is the perfect anchor for that team. JV is still 2-3 years away from being a legitimate anchor for Toronto. I have faith he will get there, but it probably won't happen next year either.

        George/Hill/Stephenson are all better defenders than Gay/Lowry/DD as well.

        Could Toronto get to Indiana's level? I believe so, but I think there needs to be some roster movement for it to be close (ie, DD should not be a Raptor).

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        • I think the Raptors are more offensively equipped than the Pacers. Valanciunas is going to be a wayy better two way player than Hibbert i guarantee you that

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          • I can't wait for summer league. A few monster games from JV should get the fans going. If he turns into a beast this season the Raptors are going to be pretty damn good. I don't think it's such a long shot considering his lifelong domination of international competition.

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            • hateslosing wrote: View Post
              Kevin Durant scores 28 points per game and Lebron averages 7.3 assists. Plus they have both done have PER's near at around 30. Paul George was 16.8 last season, lower than Gay's PER in Toronto (17.2). What I'm getting at is last year's Paul George was not a significantly better player than last year's Rudy Gay and if you look at the rest of that Pacers squad and look at our team today, the only glaring spot where they are better than us right now is center. Derozan is very different than Stevenson but i wouldn't say Stevenson is better, Lowry is better than George Hill, Amir Johnson is not as good as David West, especially on offense, but the gap isn't huge and Amir closes it a bit more every year. Depth-wise we have their old back power forward, and Novak and Ross should also work well.
              The only aspect where they may have a big advantage is coaching...

              So yah, I think we are Jonas becoming an all-star and Casey spontaneously becoming a great coach away from going deep into the playoffs with a similar model to the Pacers.
              Good post.

              I still disagree though but I've already said them all with the exception of Stephenson.

              This is another guy who knows his role and excels. Lock down defender, rebounds, creates, and when we are talking about improvement from deep he is showing REAL and MEASURABLE improvement year over year.

              Toronto's starting wings have nothing on Indiana's. Indiana's compliment each other and are both multidimensional two-way players, and both are just 23 vs. 24/27 when season rolls around.
              Last edited by mcHAPPY; Thu Jul 11, 2013, 08:44 PM.

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              • Matt52 wrote: View Post
                Good post.

                I still disagree though but I've already said them all with the exception of Stephenson.

                This is another guy who knows his role and excels. Lock down defender, rebounds, creates, and when we are talking about improvement from deep he is showing REAL and MEASURABLE improvement year over year.

                Toronto's starting wings have nothing on Indiana's. Indiana's compliment each other and are both multidimensional two-way players, and both are just 23 vs. 24/27 when season rolls around.
                I like Stevenson a lot and he is only getting better. Nice player with a bright future. So at least we agree on something.
                "Victory at all costs, victory in spite of all terror, victory however long and hard the road may be; for without victory, there is no survival."

                -Churchill

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                • Apollo wrote: View Post

                  JV, Johnson and Mr. T doesn't have an sort of advantage over Bosh, Haslem and Andersen at this point in development. That trio is solid on defense and they aren't required to do much on offense for the Heat to put up points. The Heat would torche the Raptors in a seven game series. I'd be surprised if the Raptors got more than one win.
                  My nickname wins. Apollo used Mr. T. Come on Doc endorse my genius.

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                  • planetmars wrote: View Post
                    Busy day at work today so didn't get a chance to follow the thread closely.. but when comparing Indiana and Toronto's rosters you have to compare the defense of both teams.

                    Defense is Indiana's bread and butter. Hibbert is the perfect anchor for that team. JV is still 2-3 years away from being a legitimate anchor for Toronto. I have faith he will get there, but it probably won't happen next year either.

                    George/Hill/Stephenson are all better defenders than Gay/Lowry/DD as well.

                    Could Toronto get to Indiana's level? I believe so, but I think there needs to be some roster movement for it to be close (ie, DD should not be a Raptor).
                    You are right about Indiana's defense.
                    wrong about DD. It would be a mistake to trade him now for some bad pieces without seeing what he can do (cough Mike COnley cough) .

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                    • that terrence ross video just got me SO JACKED UP
                      @sweatpantsjer

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                      • almost smashed the keyboard over my head
                        @sweatpantsjer

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                        • god i love ross
                          @sweatpantsjer

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                          • ceez wrote: View Post
                            god i love ross
                            change your pic to Ross then

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                            • NoPropsneeded wrote: View Post
                              change your pic to Ross then
                              Never
                              @sweatpantsjer

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                              • it's a HOMAGE
                                @sweatpantsjer

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