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ESPN's Raptors Offseason Report Card - D+

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  • #31
    mountio wrote: View Post
    Comments above .. not sure Im buying your breakdown .. which in most position by position analysis is essentially making the argument that the same set of guys one year later is better than they were one year prior. That might be true (might not) - but I wouldnt give a team high marks in the offseason for that ... since you could do nothing and improve quite a bit by your measure...
    Augustine/Buycks > JL3/Telfair

    Agree - although its marginal, and you are comparing backups here .. so not going to have much impact anyways
    I think Augustine had a bad year in a situation that did not suit him. He was much better his first 4 years. I made assumption he will return closer to his first 4 year form. Buycks might do little to nothing but that would put him on par with JL3 and Telfair.

    DD/Ross/Fields > DD/AA/Ross
    Even though Im a big Ross fan ... I dont get this one how we can say our offseason improved at this position, when we had all of these 3 last year
    Fields is better than AA. AA was Mr. Inconsistent and was downright dreadful if you remove about 5 games. If Fields gets his jump shot back, then it is a no brainer but even without it he does enough to make a positive impact - rebounding, defense, creating space. I believe Raps ORtg is 108 with him on court.

    Gay/Novak/Daye = Gay, Fields, Kleiza, Pietrus
    ok
    I'm basically saying Novak/Daye is equal to Fields because Kleiza and Pietrus were insignificant.

    Amir/T/Q > Amir, Bargnani, Q
    Disagree. AB might be bad, but hes better than Hansborough
    I agree AB is much more talented but I think Hansbrough has a much more positive impact on the court. Stats aren't the be all and end all but they certainly are a good thing at backing up the eye test:

    http://www.thenbageek.com/players/compare?utf8=%E2%9C%93&player_ids[]=314&player_ids[]=115

    JV/Gray in '14 > JV/Gray in '13
    Ok .. but again, cant really credit our offseason for this
    No but this reply was a little side tracked from original topic and a response to Mediumcore asking are Raptors better than last year. There was no intention to credit the offseason or MU. Although some credit could go to the coaching staff and Alex McKechnie.

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    • #32
      Grade's probably a little harsh but the analysis isn't terrible. From a pure "player in-player out" standpoint, the team isn't really any better off. Getting rid of Bargs is addition by substraction but adding guys like Augustin and Hansbrough (who crippled Indy in the playoffs off the bench) and Buycks and Daye is not improving the team in any material way. Now, I like the short term, low money deals cause they are so much better than the cap-crippling contracts the last guy gave out but, in truth, these moves were made in the context of a capped out, high salary roster, for a team with no draft picks. In that context, the moves are fine but against a straightforward basketball analysis, they are less than meh.

      While I understand the awful situation the team finds itself isn't Ujiri's fault, I can't say I'm too excited at this point. I really don't care for this group of players and don't think there is much here beyond Valanciunas and..... well, Valanciunas. Doesn't seem like much if any actual progress has been made, although, in fairness, I'm not sure what could have been done given the cap situation and the lack of assets. Still, if you love the status quo and another 30-something win season, I'd have thought you'd give this team an A+. If you were looking for a more drastic recreation, D+ doesn't sound that far off.

      I remain more optimistic than usual given the front office overhaul. But I've been a Raptor fan for 18 years. My expectations are tempered. This roster helps keep them in check.

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      • #33
        aaron.in.toronto wrote: View Post
        It is pretty simple they are looking to see if;

        (A) We got better and we will "for sure" make the playoffs with a chance to advance

        Or

        (B) We got rid of our core players to give us a legit shot at the 1st overall selection in next years draft

        Period, end of story, we will ( in their opinion) be stuck in the no man's land with no real shot at either goal.
        I agree. Perhaps the only way we could have gotten a better grade using this analysis is if we had to start dumping players for expiring contracts and draft picks, i.e. option B. It would be hard to think of the possibilty of moving any players on this roster and getting a return that would be significant enough to put us into option A.

        However, I think the team has improved on multiple fronts. Front office, coaching staff, and our bench have all improved, and the return we got for Bargs was pretty damn good all things considered. This team SHOULD definitely be better next season. Although no significant player additions were made, we know here the significance of removing Bargs and BC. At least a C+ in my mind, even if we lose more games than we did last year.

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        • #34
          ESPN eh? meh.
          Mamba Mentality

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          • #35
            Lalaland

            These guys segregate the off-season from the rest of the year and give a grade on the moves. Why then do they not give a grade based on pre-season to trade deadline? Why do they not give a grade on off-season to trade deadline? It's like in their own little world the only relevant moves happen in the off-season and teams do not strategically hold off on certain pursuits to capitalize on timing. They don't care about the full picture and opt to glorify two months of moves in some cases determined based on years of work.

            Would you grade a kid based on the first half hour of a one hour exam? Would you blast the painters doing your house because the primer coat doesn't go with the style of the house? Would you bop the sales clerk in the nose because he took you credit card and wouldn't give it back--- Because he was ringing in the stuff you were purchasing? Of course you wouldn't. If real life operated like these guys we would be living in caves and eating leaves.

            The Raptors deserve an incomplete because it's clear MJ just took over and is only rolling up his sleeves.

            And that right there is my rant for the day.

            Comment


            • #36
              Apollo wrote: View Post
              These guys segregate the off-season from the rest of the year and give a grade on the moves. Why then do they not give a grade based on pre-season to trade deadline? Why do they not give a grade on off-season to trade deadline? It's like in their own little world the only relevant moves happen in the off-season and teams do not strategically hold off on certain pursuits to capitalize on timing. They don't care about the full picture and opt to glorify two months of moves in some cases determined based on years of work.

              Would you grade a kid based on the first half hour of a one hour exam? Would you blast the painters doing your house because the primer coat doesn't go with the style of the house? Would you bop the sales clerk in the nose because he took you credit card and wouldn't give it back--- Because he was ringing in the stuff you were purchasing? Of course you wouldn't. If real life operated like these guys we would be living in caves and eating leaves.

              The Raptors deserve an incomplete because it's clear MJ just took over and is only rolling up his sleeves.

              And that right there is my rant for the day.
              So very true. For all they know, the players we acquired could flourish in this system and do very well. Too early to grade our off season

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              • #37
                Why do we pay attention to ESPN? It's not even on tv in this country..
                If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

                Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.

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                • #38
                  I rather have ESPN talk shit bout the raps than ignore us all togather
                  What they got to say now? Nothing they can say now. Mobbin' on the low. Winnin' on the low
                  The city embraced me, made me feel at home. The only difference [between Compton and Toronto] for me is the cold. -DeMar
                  No Where Near the South Side #WeTheNorth

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                  • #39
                    lilmamba_ wrote: View Post
                    I'd rather have ESPN talk shit bout the raps than ignore us all together
                    Nah I'd rather have ignore.
                    Twitter - @thekid_it

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                    • #40
                      isaacthompson wrote: View Post
                      Nah I'd rather have ignore.
                      why?? when a team gets develops hate theres a reason, toronto raptors the new pain in the ass, rather have that than having them fools act like toronto doesnt have a nba team at all
                      What they got to say now? Nothing they can say now. Mobbin' on the low. Winnin' on the low
                      The city embraced me, made me feel at home. The only difference [between Compton and Toronto] for me is the cold. -DeMar
                      No Where Near the South Side #WeTheNorth

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        lilmamba_ wrote: View Post
                        why?? when a team gets develops hate theres a reason, toronto raptors the new pain in the ass, rather have that than having them fools act like toronto doesnt have a nba team at all
                        Well yeah, but does it make a difference? Even if we turn the whole ship around this year, they'll still have the same pundits writing about us. They'll only rave about us if we go 82-0.. Canada is like a foreign land to ESPN.
                        Twitter - @thekid_it

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                        • #42
                          Please, somebody look up what grade ESPN gave the Lakers for last off-season. Pretty sure it was an A or A+. So much for off-season grades. lol.

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                          • #43
                            isaacthompson wrote: View Post
                            ... Canada is like a foreign land to ESPN.
                            that's so awesome. i mean, yeah, like, ESPN probably views canada as another country or something 'tarded, right?
                            TRUE LOVE - Sometimes you know it the instant you see it across the bar.

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                            • #44
                              The team won less than 35 games last year, had 0 draft picks this summer and their marquee off season acquisition was Tyler Hansbrough on a potentially one year deal.... Was everyone expecting an A+?

                              Ease up on the self pity guys - the D+ grade is probably a little on the low side but the truth is we had a very underwhelming off season for a team that was on the outside of the playoff picture looking in. I get why everyone is saying that Ujiri's moves this summer are more about setting the team up with flexibility as we move towards the trade deadline and off-seasons beyond but that's not what the grade is for.

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                              • #45
                                depends on how the scores are calculated. If it's purely on team improvement to win games in November, they deserve an F.

                                If the scores are calculated with rebuilds and tanking in he mix...than they deserve at least a C

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