How would you kick start things?

[wallz]

[Bendit]

As being a tear it up/ severe remodelling proponent I think I have had as much as I can take with the futility of guessing what MU is going to do. To begin with he has to have dance partners and its really too early to tell who these might be. We have another 3 weeks /or so to go so I shall just pickle myself and watch how things unfold. This is as much about MU's promise as a GM of the Raptors as anything for me since without the head being on mark with his moves this season the fate of this franchise for the long term is going to be in jeopardy if for nothing else...abject boredom.

That said I shall make one observation about your choice of Bennett and Bynum for Gay...I saw a vid of the last draft (where we had zilch picks) and MU's reaction when Bennett was picked. My take seeing him jump out of his chair was the look of incredulity/shock and to me denoting that he was just not worthy of that pick position and possibly that he did not think that highly of the player. Unfortunately Bennett has been less than stellar. Personally I would be looking at someone else.

[Black_jack71]

What I can honestly say is that adding Spencer Hawes does not necessarily add any wins to this team. It is not a "get you over the hump" trade by any means. I wouldn't trade a 1st round pick for him. I wouldn't add him at all. Lets say the Raps are a .500 team without him...so that's 41 wins. I can't see Hawes even necessarily adding a single win, and at best maybe helps get us to around the mid-40s. Remember he'd lose lots of minutes on Toronto too because he can't defend a blind grandma in a wheelchair. Seriously low-impact trade in my opinion.

Sorry, I really don't like Spencer Hawes. He's a backup C who shouldn't have a major role on a great team.

Fair enough. By no means do I think that he is what turns this team into a contender or anything. I still like the fit however, whether it be as a start beside Val to help space the floor a bit better, or as a bit of a scoring punch off the bench for a unit that has lacked it this year. Maybe the 1st is a bit much, if the picks were taken out and it was Fields and Acy for Hawes it be a bit better but in that case I don't think it makes sense for Philly.

Anyhow, like I said just a thought.

[Black_jack71]

As being a tear it up/ severe remodelling proponent I think I have had as much as I can take with the futility of guessing what MU is going to do. To begin with he has to have dance partners and its really too early to tell who these might be. We have another 3 weeks /or so to go so I shall just pickle myself and watch how things unfold. This is as much about MU's promise as a GM of the Raptors as anything for me since without the head being on mark with his moves this season the fate of this franchise for the long term is going to be in jeopardy if for nothing else...abject boredom.

That said I shall make one observation about your choice of Bennett and Bynum for Gay...I saw a vid of the last draft (where we had zilch picks) and MU's reaction when Bennett was picked. My take seeing him jump out of his chair was the look of incredulity/shock and to me denoting that he was just not worthy of that pick position and possibly that he did not think that highly of the player. Unfortunately Bennett has been less than stellar. Personally I would be looking at someone else.

I think the Bennett pick was a surprise for everybody, and don't think it's fair to use that as a tool to judge MU's opinion on a player. Could it not also be viewed as him being happy for a Canadian kid? I know my reaction was similar, as in jumping out of my seat and pacing around the room in shock. That doesn't mean I don't think he deserves that spot. The draft was so weak that it came down to preference.

[Bendit]

I think the Bennett pick was a surprise for everybody, and don't think it's fair to use that as a tool to judge MU's opinion on a player. Could it not also be viewed as him being happy for a Canadian kid? I know my reaction was similar, as in jumping out of my seat and pacing around the room in shock. That doesn't mean I don't think he deserves that spot. The draft was so weak that it came down to preference.

I suppose. Cant argue that which I dont know...just an observation and Bennett's performance so far. The Cavs however have also been fairly brutal in their choices lately with their high picks other than Irving.

[BobLoblaw]

Doesn't Harden like running the point for them anyway? Not sure how much it would affect them if they lost Lin without getting a PG back. But we could always include DJ Augustin!

The thing is that Lin is playing like a man possessed. And it looks like it's coming from a genuine improvement of his long range shot over the summer. As well as a more suitable role, i.e. a 6th man scorer as opposed to asking him to think pass-first. The way Lin is playing and at his salary, I think any team would rather have Lin than Gay.
On top of it, Gay doesn't seem a good fit for the Rockets. And the trade is actually asking for Asik+Lin+1st rounder for Gay.

[BobLoblaw]

As to the OP question, this team needs a big piece, not cosmetic changes. So I'd only make 1 of two types of moves: either tear it down and tank, OR trade for a legit star without losing Valanciunas. The second option seems unlikely.

Overall, I think I value the Raptors current players less than most fans on these forums. I don't think you can expect an Anthony Bennett or good picks for Gay. I'm fine with moving him for expirings + some sweeteners like a late pick or such.

[planetmars]

The thing is that Lin is playing like a man possessed. And it looks like it's coming from a genuine improvement of his long range shot over the summer. As well as a more suitable role, i.e. a 6th man scorer as opposed to asking him to think pass-first. The way Lin is playing and at his salary, I think any team would rather have Lin than Gay.
On top of it, Gay doesn't seem a good fit for the Rockets. And the trade is actually asking for Asik+Lin+1st rounder for Gay.

Yeah I think that's way too much for Gay/Tyler. I was just commenting on if Houston could afford to trade Lin or not, and I still think they would make him available if the right offer came through. I think Harden/Beverly would be adequate if they can upgrade their roster through a trade. Gay would not be someone Morey would go after.

[mcHAPPY]

This is how I kick start things: Call Milwaukee.

Finally, Kohl just went with it.

“To use the word ‘tank’ …,” the former U.S. Senator said, pausing again as he addressed reporters at his team’s Media Day Monday afternoon. “I’ve owned the team for 20-some years and never once did I go into a year saying, ‘Let’s not try and be a good team.’ I’ve always felt that way. So this year’s no different.”

.......

“There are some teams that buy into one kind of philosophy, and I’m not commenting on what other teams do,” Kohl said. “But I don’t believe in not competing. And doing everything you can to be as competitive as you can, and then looking for the breaks along the way that will give you a chance maybe to elevate to a high standard.”

.......

Glancing over at the Bucks’ newly hired assistant general manager who will work with GM John Hammond this season, Kohl continued: “I know David Morway is standing there, he came from Indiana, Indiana’s a really good team this year. Indiana never tanked. Is that right, David?”

Morway, the new guy, wisely and quickly nodded in the affirmative.

“They’ve done it adding pieces here and there,” the owner said, “getting some breaks and so on. All of a sudden, here they are contending for the Eastern Conference championship. And they did it without using that word. And so we want to do it that way.”

.......

An apathetic fan base or a lot of games with empty upper bowls is no way to leverage the public subsidies that will be needed on top of Kohl’s “significant contribution.”

“Naturally you want to be as good as you can be – that helps – in moving towards an arena,” Kohl said Monday. “But I would not want to put that burden on our basketball operations.

“We’re gonna get a facility. I’m confident we’re going to get a facility because it’s an important thing, not only for basketball but for our community. And in order to keep the Bucks, we have to have a facility. And in order to get a facility, we have to keep the Bucks. So it’s like a two-fer: We’re either going to get both in the years ahead or we’re going to have neither.”

Did someone say leverage? As in, say, Seattle?

Put that way, being stuck in the middle competitively is a lot more appealing in Milwaukee than being on the outside looking in.

http://hangtime.blogs.nba.com/2013/0...s-bucks-owner/

Bucks' owner Herb Kohl has repeatedly said the Bucks won't tank to get a star next year. Some pundits say the Bucks need to maintain at least some level of success, so the taxpayers' concerns about paying for a new Milwaukee arena don't deteriorate any more than they already have.

http://wtaq.com/news/articles/2013/o...anager-quoted/

With Milwaukee on the phone you make the following 3 trades (and they have to be done as 3 trades to allow future flexibility in trades i.e. remove the 2 month wait to be packaged with other players in subsequent trades):

Trade 1:
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mqvyn8l

Milwaukee: Amir
Toronto: Udoh

Trade 2:
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mqdkqzn

Milwaukee: DeRozan, Houston 2014 1st round pick
Houston: Ilyasova, Novak, Raps '14 2nd round pick from Milwaukee w/ restrictions removed by TOR
Toronto: Asik

Trade 3:
http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=ms7c52o

Milwaukee: Lowry
Toronto: Ridnour and Giannis 'Po

Honestly, I'd want Giannis more than the Bucks 2014 pick. However if the Bucks said no to the 'Po then it would require their 2014 pick or no deal. Sanders will be back at some point and I think these 3 trades makes the Bucks a playoff team and the 7/8th seed is what Milwaukee is all about. Getting a 2nd 2014 pick would likely help with the fans expected uproar over Tobias Harris 2.0.


After this, get Cleveland and Charlotte on the phone.

Trade 4:

Cleveland: Asik
Toronto: Bynum, 2014 Orlando 2nd round pick, 2015 Memphis top 5 protected
*waive Bynum*

Trade 5:

Charlotte: Gay
Toronto: Gordon, Biyombo, and Detroit's 2014 pick top 8 protected ('15 top 1, '16 unprotected)

Bobcats/Hornets are not bringing back the purple/teal without some success. They are going to be doing all they can to shed the Bobcat label and being competitive. Starting the year 7-7 with young players such as Kemba, MKG, and Zeller already on the roster makes the loss of a likely 9-15 lottery pick easier to stomach as well as a likely playoff appearance to add to bottom line.
http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/10...d-color-scheme


PG: Ridnour, Augustine, Buycks
SG: Ross, Gordon, Stone
SF: 'Po, Fields, Daye
PF: Hansbrough, Udoh, Acy
C: JV, Gray, Biyombo

That should be good enough for the at least top 3 worse record in the league and 96% chance at a top 5 pick.


DRAFT NIGHT:

Chicago is due to pay luxury tax again this season. The Bulls are currently $7,540,428 over the threshold and are not likely at all to get under it. This, then, puts them in line for the repeater rates should they pay luxury tax again in either of the next two seasons.

The Bulls' projected total expenditure this season after tax is due to be $91,234,177. The same payroll with the same hypothetical tax threshold, when subject to repeater tax, would result in a total expenditure of $98,774,605. This again demonstrates the effectiveness of the repeater tax. A team now only a mere few million over the luxury tax, then, is starting to get incredibly expensive, to the point that being one good player over the threshold puts it at a near nine-figure payroll. (Imagine if Chicago had Omer Asik's $14.8 million to contend with next season, too. Add that in and run the same numbers. Chicago did. And that is why the Bulls let him walk.)

The Bulls could potentially pay this nearly nine-figure repeater tax amount. Even if they often do not spend as such, they are a big-market, high-revenue team. A smaller-market team, however, could not. Given its self-imposed payroll restrictions, Chicago likely cannot either.

http://www.sbnation.com/2013/11/21/5...-chicago-bulls

The one team that would really help itself by trading for Asik is his old team, the Bulls. That would scare a few competitors, starting with the East-leading Pacers. But owner Jerry Reinsdorf is dead set against reacquiring Asik because it would mean having to pay future luxury tax. “If he does that, then he won’t make money and the first thing Jerry always wants to do is make money,” said one rival owner.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/ba...icle-1.1526800

Trade 6:

OKC: own 2nd round pick
Toronto: Perkins and OKC 1st

Trade 7:

Chicago: Hansbrough, OKC 1st
Toronto: Sacramento 1st (~6), Thornton, Hayes, Outlaw
Sacramento: Boozer, Detroit 1st (~10th), Charlotte 1st (~15), worse of SAC/ORL 2nd rd pick

Why?
Chicago solves all luxury/repeater tax issues while creating flexibility to revamp roster.
Sacramento gets a professional veteran who can produce next to Cousins, rids dead weight, and adds 3 draft picks instead of 1 (I read recently they were looking to get draft picks and unload dead weight contracts).
Toronto adds a top draft pick while taking on a lot of garbage contracts which expire in 2014-15.


Draft picks:

2014:
1st round - Toronto, Sacramento
2nd round - 1 of Sacramento, Orlando

2015:
1st round - Toronto, Memphis
2nd round - Toronto

2016:
1st round - Toronto, New York/Denver
2nd round - none


2014-15 roster:
PG: Buycks, Stone
SG: Ross, Thornton,
SF: 'Po, Fields, Outlaw
PF: Hayes, Acy
C: JV, Biyombo, Perkins

+ 2 top 6 picks and an early 2nd round pick.

2015-16 roster:
PG:
SG: Ross
SF: 'Po
PF:
C: JV

+3 2014 draft picks
+3 2015 draft picks
+ ~$35M in cap space


Now, sit back and watch it all unfold.

[TSF]

Evan Turner and Thaddeus Young for Rudy and the 2016 Knicks/Nuggets pick. Knicks will suck but the Nuggets won't, so the pick won't be as valuable as it looks.

Toronto trades: Amir, Rudy, and Lowry.
Toronto Receives: Hedo Turkoglu, Jameer Nelson, Goran Dragic, Tobias Harris, Andrew Nicholson

Orlando trades: Hedo Turkoglu, Jameer Nelson, Tobias Harris, Andrew Nicholson.
Orlando receives: Rudy Gay and Kyle Lowry

Phoenix trades: Goran Dragic
Phoenix receives: Amir Johnson

For Toronto: We take on two bad contracts, but one expires this year, and Jameer can be flipped next year to a needy contender. We get rid of Rudy, acquire two good prospects without sacrificing a draft pick, and a Dragic-Derozan-Harris-Nicholson-Jonas starting lineup with Ross off the bench and a good pick next year is appealing.

For Orlando: They get out of their bad contracts (Hedo especially) and upgrade the positions of those bad contracts with younger, better players. Lowry-Afflalo-Rudy-Harkless-Nicholson with Oladipo off the bench is not a team to take lightly, and Lowry can help make all these young pieces better.

For Phoenix: They have Dragic for 7.5 million for three years at their strongest position. Amir at a weaker position, with all that he does, for 6.5 million and two years is a whole lot more appealing.

[JawsGT]

Evan Turner and Thaddeus Young for Rudy and the 2016 Knicks/Nuggets pick. Knicks will suck but the Nuggets won't, so the pick won't be as valuable as it looks.

Toronto trades: Amir, Rudy, and Lowry.
Toronto Receives: Hedo Turkoglu, Jameer Nelson, Goran Dragic, Tobias Harris, Andrew Nicholson

Orlando trades: Hedo Turkoglu, Jameer Nelson, Tobias Harris, Andrew Nicholson.
Orlando receives: Rudy Gay and Kyle Lowry

Phoenix trades: Goran Dragic
Phoenix receives: Amir Johnson

For Toronto: We take on two bad contracts, but one expires this year, and Jameer can be flipped next year to a needy contender. We get rid of Rudy, acquire two good prospects without sacrificing a draft pick, and a Dragic-Derozan-Harris-Nicholson-Jonas starting lineup with Ross off the bench and a good pick next year is appealing.

For Orlando: They get out of their bad contracts (Hedo especially) and upgrade the positions of those bad contracts with younger, better players. Lowry-Afflalo-Rudy-Harkless-Nicholson with Oladipo off the bench is not a team to take lightly, and Lowry can help make all these young pieces better.

For Phoenix: They have Dragic for 7.5 million for three years at their strongest position. Amir at a weaker position, with all that he does, for 6.5 million and two years is a whole lot more appealing.

I'm confused. Looks like you traded Rudy twice, and have Nicholson in both the Raps and Magic's starting lineups following the trades.

[TSF]

No? Rudy goes to Orlando. I screwed up typing Orlando's projected starting five, it's supposed to say Vuvecic instead of Nicholson. So Dragic-DD-Harris-Nicholson-Jonas for Raps, Lowry-Afflalo-Rudy-Harkless-Vuvecic for Magic.

[torch19]

Raptors send Lowry, DeRozan, Hansbrough & future 2nd round pick to Bulls.

Bulls send Carlos Boozer, Tony Snell, Marquis Teague (or) Erik Murphy & 2014 1st round pick via Charlotte -- protected 1-10 in 2014, 1-8 in 2015, unprotected in 2016 -- to Raptors.

Raptors send Gay & the lower of Toronto's 2016 first round pick (or) New York's 2016 first round pick to Bobcats.

Bobcats send Gordon, Haywood & less favorable 2014 first round pick -- via Detroit or via Portland -- to Raptors.

Raptors cut Austin Daye.


Sent from my C6506 using Tapatalk

[BobLoblaw]

Raptors send Lowry, DeRozan, Hansbrough & future 2nd round pick to Bulls.

Bulls send Carlos Boozer, Tony Snell, Marquis Teague (or) Erik Murphy & 2014 1st round pick via Charlotte -- protected 1-10 in 2014, 1-8 in 2015, unprotected in 2016 -- to Raptors.

Raptors send Gay & the lower of Toronto's 2016 first round pick (or) New York's 2016 first round pick to Bobcats.

Bobcats send Gordon, Haywood & less favorable 2014 first round pick -- via Detroit or via Portland -- to Raptors.

Raptors cut Austin Daye.


Sent from my C6506 using Tapatalk

I wouldn't do the second one, it looks like you are giving them the better pick.

I'd do the 1st one.