TANK vs ANTI TANK - SUPER THREAD - The Because I Can't Keep Track Edition

[Axel]

Risk of injury applies to every player in the league (not just draft picks). Using Oden as a reason to avoid the "luck" of the lottery isn't accurate. I could just as easily point to Andrew Bynum and say "see, that's why we shouldn't explore trades".

Or free agency since Cleveland signed him. Guess we are left with no means to make any moves. We are stuck with this roster forever!!

[Nilanka]

well what's with all the claiming it will take (insert number of years here) for (insert event here) to happen.

Guestimations. No different from claiming we're currently sitting on a playoff roster.

[white men can't jump]

Guestimations. No different from claiming we're currently sitting on a playoff roster.

Not just a playoff roster, but a roster we can build from...

[Fully]

Ah okay, I get it now. The top of the draft is harder because there's more good players to choose from.


















Ladies and Gentlemen.... The anti-tankers are here!

[white men can't jump]

Ah okay, I get it now. The top of the draft is harder because there's more good players to choose from.

Haha, yeah...I got a kick out of that rationale too.

[Axel]

[peanutwoozle]

Portland? I thought we were talking about Sacramento?

No one thinks drafting is easy but your logic that it's more difficult at the top because there are more options just doesn't make any sense. Best way to maximize your chances of drafting the right player is to have as many options available as possible. Top of the draft is where the best players are usually drafted. There's absolutely no logic to your arguments.

It is harder to tell in the Lottery if someone is going to work out or not, here's an example, lets say you are at your draft position, there are a bunch of talented guys there, and one guy who is about 10x as talented as the rest, you draft him, and he ends up not being good in the NBA at all, while all of the other guys projected around that spot go on and have great careers. That is something nobody can see coming, it is a harder choice to make. Later on in the draft, it might be a little easier to spot talent while there is not a lot of talent left on the board, it might be easier to spot one there

I trust Masai with later picks, but I don't know if I can trust him in an Oden/Durant or T-Rob/rest of lottery situation.

[Nilanka]

It is harder to tell in the Lottery if someone is going to work out or not, here's an example, lets say you are at your draft position, there are a bunch of talented guys there, and one guy who is about 10x as talented as the rest, you draft him, and he ends up not being good in the NBA at all, while all of the other guys projected around that spot go on and have great careers. That is something nobody can see coming, it is a harder choice to make. Later on in the draft, it might be a little easier to spot talent while there is not a lot of talent left on the board, it might be easier to spot one there

It doesn't sound like you even an ounce of trust in Masai's scouting abilities at all.

[CalgaryRapsFan]

To be honest, I wouldn't consider Acy or Ross to be part of the "core" yet.....i see those guys as role players right now.

Do you believe there is an elite player in this draft that is capable of leading any lottery team to a championship anytime within the next 7 years??

I don't see a Tim Duncan in this draft. Lebron couldn't do it in 7 years in Cleveland! He left for Miami to be with 2 other superstars remember?

Who do you think will be in the core after this year? Then ask yourself if you think those players (i imagine some who haven't proven to be good or elite against NBA competition) will lead you to a championship.

There is uncertainty....If we trade Lowry and Gay and some of the other veterans, we could possibly be a high lottery pick with the players i mentioned above still on the team (DD, JV, TR, QA). Wouldn't you agree that this would be a good outcome for tankers? Is this tanking? The lines get blurred the further you go into rebuilding.

I guess my point is that we have some good pieces here! It's Masai's job to get the RIGHT pieces and TALENT in here.

I actually laid out a 'tanking' plan a few days ago, with 4 'must trade' players: Gay, Lowry, Novak and Hansborough. So yes, I would completely agree with your approach and believe it would be in line with the proper rebuild team-building I (and most other pro-tankers) have been promoting for months, which gets lumped in as the unethical, karma-killing evil that is "tanking".

I'm not saying that DeRozan or Amir absolutely should stay, but nor am I saying they should go. Given that they are both good players and are under contract, there's certainly no urgency surrounding them.

Trading those other players would likely result in a sufficient "tank" for my purposes. Of course, I would explore their (ie: DeRozan & Amir) trade value now, at the deadline, during the draft and in the offseason... but that's just good management. I'd be fine with either/both of them staying or going, depending what the trade return would be.

[mcHAPPY]

Not just a playoff roster, but a roster we can build from...

Every competitive team is built on overpaid inferior talent with poor coaching and few tradable assets all the while being in the upper quarter of team payrolls.... Right?

[peanutwoozle]

I actually laid out a 'tanking' plan a few days ago, with 4 'must trade' players: Gay, Lowry, Novak and Hansborough. So yes, I would completely agree with your approach and believe it would be in line with the proper rebuild team-building I have been promoting for months, which gets lumped in as "tanking".

I'm not saying that DeRozan or Amir absolutely should stay, but nor am I saying they should go. Given that they are both good players and are under contract, there's certainly no urgency surrounding them. Trading those other players would likely result in a sufficient "tank" for my purposes. Of course, I would explore their trade value now, at the deadline, during the draft and in the offseason... but that's just good management. I'd be fine with either/both of them staying or going, depending what the trade return would be.

I'd switch Tyler with Amir for the one that must be traded. He is starting too look like a Jamario Moon/Sonny Weems now.

[mcHAPPY]

*confession time*
I tried I really tried the tanking process but i just cant. (two games) I cant force my self to like losing and then be happy about it. it's not who i am I ugggh no point in explaining it. but ima say it before yall do... I am the first one to hop off the tank.
ight, you guys can call me names now.

Start following NCAA ball.

You'll feel better.

[S.R.]

Every competitive team is built on overpaid inferior talent with poor coaching and few tradable assets all the while being in the upper quarter of team payrolls.... Right?

I can't believe Bryan Colangelo shared his policies and procedures handbook with you.

[magoon]

I'd switch Tyler with Amir for the one that must be traded. He is starting too look like a Jamario Moon/Sonny Weems now.

Do you actually watch the games? Amir is the team's glue-guy. There's a reason he has the highest plus-minus on the team: he's got good basketball IQ, knows how to read the floor (a skill that few bigs possess), and combines that with being a good rebounder and tertiary scoring threat.

Seriously, so many Raps fans have a hard-on for Hansbrough and he is not that good. I give full credit to Psycho T for hustling his ass off, but at the end of the day talent matters and T doesn't have enough to be worth more than his relatively small contract. If he has perceived value, then ship him, because that was the point of signing him in the first place.

[CalgaryRapsFan]

I'd switch Tyler with Amir for the one that must be traded. He is starting too look like a Jamario Moon/Sonny Weems now.

It's all about trade value though, from my perspective.

Hansborough is on a relatively cheap, high-value contract right now, with a team option for next season (the team could keep him or let his contract expire - different teams will value each aspect of the option). Amir, on the other hand, is making $7M this season and next, so it could be harder to make deals with him.

I would definitely be much more open to trading Amir than DeRozan though, once you get beyond the initial 'should trade' group.


The important thing is that common ground has been discovered between pro and anti tankers!