Ideal Roster For Next Season? Vince Carter Involved?

[raptors999]

Denver has a surplus of bigs but theyre all injured now. Movgov is prob gettable after everyone recovers next season

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[Jack_Bauer]

One player I would want so badly for this team next year is Timofey Mozgov. It's a pipe dream. I know.

Denver has a surplus of bigs but theyre all injured now. Movgov is prob gettable after everyone recovers next season

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This is true, especially if Arthur picks up his player option. Plus, the Raps have a TPE from the Gay transaction, so they wouldn't have to match salaries.

Mozgov and Dudley are two fits I like, the only problem is they will kill any flexibility for summer 2015.

[Raps76]

I'm a little confused when it comes to Vince because stories have recently come out of Dallas stating Vince wants to stay, but stories have also simultaneously come out of Toronto stating talks were had about Vince returning (the link provided in this initial post). I'm one of the majority here that is open to a Vince return but I'm a little worried now.

I was hoping Dallas would miss the playoffs which would be more incentive for him to defect but they've been winning lately and Memphis hasn't. Not so sure anymore about the VC farewell party...

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[JawsGT]

It was never strictly about minutes for me...

It was about:
-Seemingly inconsistent accountability across different players.
-Odd rotation patterns that make it hard to make adjustments.

And those two could clearly be tied together at times.

A thing about the accountability: I'm sure Ross may scratch his head sometimes when he gets pulled in favour of Salmons, who proceeds to make a mistake but stays in the game, and we, as fans can only ask why?

Well, Casey isn't trying to teach something to Salmons. If he makes a mistake, he probably knows it and doesn't need to be pulled in order to understand that a mistake was made. Ross however, may need to be pulled in order for him to understand that a mistake was even made. Plus, he may need to be pulled in order to hammer home the lesson. He is the future, Salmons is not, and maybe the coaching staff are determined to ensure that our sophomores are developing only good and winning habits. If he wants floor time, he'd best learn quick and not make the same mistakes twice. I think he is less likely to make those mistakes over and over again if he gets pulled when he does it.

I certainly have no idea what is going on, and this is just my theory, but I feel I have to give Casey the benefit of the doubt, given how well this team has played and how much they have overachieved.

Now, there are times when he gets pulled when he is playing well, but are we capable of seeing all the things that Casey is looking for? Remember, MU had to tell Ross to get some sleep...he isn't ready yet for more responsibility.

[stooley]

A thing about the accountability: I'm sure Ross may scratch his head sometimes when he gets pulled in favour of Salmons, who proceeds to make a mistake but stays in the game, and we, as fans can only ask why?

Well, Casey isn't trying to teach something to Salmons. If he makes a mistake, he probably knows it and doesn't need to be pulled in order to understand that a mistake was made. Ross however, may need to be pulled in order for him to understand that a mistake was even made. Plus, he may need to be pulled in order to hammer home the lesson. He is the future, Salmons is not, and maybe the coaching staff are determined to ensure that our sophomores are developing only good and winning habits. If he wants floor time, he'd best learn quick and not make the same mistakes twice. I think he is less likely to make those mistakes over and over again if he gets pulled when he does it.

I certainly have no idea what is going on, and this is just my theory, but I feel I have to give Casey the benefit of the doubt, given how well this team has played and how much they have overachieved.

Now, there are times when he gets pulled when he is playing well, but are we capable of seeing all the things that Casey is looking for? Remember, MU had to tell Ross to get some sleep...he isn't ready yet for more responsibility.

I think Casey's methods are certainly up for debate. But given the glaring lack of pertinent information we have as fans, it's pretty damn hard to come to any concrete conclusions.

Given that, it's hard to argue with the results in both player development and winning.

Terrence Ross was barely predicted as a lottery pick, and he's exceeded any expectations I had for him.

Jonas has gotten my hopes way higher than they should be, and he's developed way faster than most of us expected.

Demar's still getting better and Lowry's not butting heads with anyone.

This team has a legit shot at 50 wins. Top 10 off and def, winning record on the road and against the west.

Hard to argue with these kinds of results.

[BigCamB]

One player I would want so badly for this team next year is Timofey Mozgov. It's a pipe dream. I know.

Me too! He is cool. He's even been hitting some threes in his last few games
Won't happen, I think he deserves to be a starter somewhere,he's very good IMO but w/e!

[Mediumcore]

I think Casey's methods are certainly up for debate. But given the glaring lack of pertinent information we have as fans, it's pretty damn hard to come to any concrete conclusions.

Given that, it's hard to argue with the results in both player development and winning.

Terrence Ross was barely predicted as a lottery pick, and he's exceeded any expectations I had for him.

Jonas has gotten my hopes way higher than they should be, and he's developed way faster than most of us expected.

Demar's still getting better and Lowry's not butting heads with anyone.

This team has a legit shot at 50 wins. Top 10 off and def, winning record on the road and against the west.

Hard to argue with these kinds of results.

Thank-you for being the voice of reason around here. Casey is producing while everyone keeps talking about what a bad job he's doing like they have any insight about what the thought process that goes into running a team and grooming young players. If this team is a mess like it was under Triano, I'd say bitch away, but Casey is producing with a roster of no name players and still the complaining. Complete grass is greener on the other side situation.

Excellent point about T. Ross not being on anyones radar on draft day, and if memory serves me correct, it was Casey that was pulling for the Raptors to draft him.

[phiLLy]

That being said, been thinking of some extra pickups:

I think the Lakers are extremely interesting in terms of players we could pick up. Their whole team, other than Kobe, is essentially a FA next season. Some of their players have been playing pretty well too, and I'm thinking they could be quite valuable to us off the bench?

Points/Rebounds/Assists/Steals/Blocks on FG%/3PT%/FT%

Kent Bazemore (G) - 760K
13.1/3.1/3.3/1.3 on 45/37/64 @ 28MPG

I mean, a good defender, i'm sure his stats are a little inflated, but, for a cheap price, could be considered?

Wesley Johnson (GF) - 916K
8.9/4.1/1.5/1.1/1.0 on 43/37/78 @ 28MPG

Haven't really paid attention to him either, likewise with all these LAL players, their stats are likely a little inflated, but he doesn't seem to be too bad for the price either.

Xavier Henry (G) - 916K

10/2.7/1.2/1.0 on 42/35/66 @ 21MPG

Will be coming off surgery, so his price could be potentially around the same.

Jodie Meeks (SG) - 1,550,000

15.4/2.6/1.8/1.4 on 46/40/86 @ 33MPG

Shoots quite well, though, I believe he's lacking a little bit in the defensive aspect.

Chris Kaman (C) - 3,183,000

10.5/5.9/1.5/0.3/1.0 on 50/0/77 @ 19MPG

Plays pretty decently given his minutes, good size, grabs boards. Not a great defender I believe though?

Jordan Hill (PF/C) - 3,500,000

9.2/7.3/0.6/0.4/0.8 on 55/0/67 @ 20MPG

Great rebounder, seems to play good D, good size.

Nick Young (G) - 1,100,000 (PO @ 1.2M)

17.2/2.6/1.4/0.7 on 43/37/83 @ 28MPG

Has a player option, but, only @ 1.2M, could look elsewhere.

Doesn't defend too well, takes too many jump-shots, a bit of a knucklehead. But, he scores, and he does it decently. Not too efficient, but, seems like he can be a bit of a spark-plug off the bench for some instant offence?

Shittier Nate Robinson? LOL.

Kendall Marshall would be amazing, but he's got a Team Option, and it'd be stupid for the Lakers to not pick that up.

Yes, I know I just randomly chose the Lakers, and pulled their players, but, they came to my mind because of all their short contracts, lol. It's essentially players that have gone 25 - 52 in the Western Conference, lol.

[BigCamB]

I've said this before but I really like Xavier Henry because he's elite at getting to the foul line, 9th in the entire league in FTA/48. Whenever I watched the lakers he practically lived there with his fearless drives and strength. He can shoot the three as well.
I Think he'd be a great bench player. His injuries are concerning but then that will keep the price down like you suggested.

Hill is a pretty good big. It's baffling to me the way D'Antoni treated him this season.

I wouldn't go anywhere near Kaman or Young.

[white men can't jump]

I've said this before but I really like Xavier Henry because he's elite at getting to the foul line, 9th in the entire league in FTA/48. Whenever I watched the lakers he practically lived there with his fearless drives and strength. He can shoot the three as well.
I Think he'd be a great bench player. His injuries are concerning but then that will keep the price down like you suggested.

Hill is a pretty good big. It's baffling to me the way D'Antoni treated him this season.

I wouldn't go anywhere near Kaman or Young.

Yeah, injuries are definitely a concern. He is, after all, having his left wrist (shooting hand) surgically repaired due to a torn ligament. Not particularly encouraging. If you sign him, you probably gotta sign someone else you know can play in front of him off the bench as well.

*Oh, and knee surgery for a cartilage abnormality in his right knee...don't even know wtf to make of that.

[white men can't jump]

Jodie Meeks is the other guy on LA I might look at. He's a very good shooter. His D might be a little weak, but honestly not sure how weak. Might be passable. I feel like I remember him not being too bad there when he was on Philly.

[ReubenJRD]

I really like this lineup. Only problem would be is tennis doesn't slip our backup pg is a little weak. Vince meh either way. Thanasis why not take a chance if we can grab him in 2nd if he deserves mins he would get if not he sits on bench. Eijm ditto.

The bigs in this would be ideal if we could maintain that. I almost feel like there wouldn't be enough mins to go around.

I think what you could do here, is if Ennis doesn't fall, I'd rather spend the money to re-sign Vasquez over Davis, and use the pick on a centre, who I'm hoping is Willie Cauley-Stein who I think eventually drops because of his injury in the tournament (then again, could make argument for stock rising with needing help inside vs. UConn [A small argument at that]).

So, it would go:

PG: Lowry/Vasquez/De Colo.
...
C: Valanciunas/Rookie with 1st rounder/Hayes.

Also, I'd personally like to try and keep Novak. There's not a single specialist, and that to me is important for contending teams.

[ReubenJRD]

That being said, been thinking of some extra pickups:

I think the Lakers are extremely interesting in terms of players we could pick up. Their whole team, other than Kobe, is essentially a FA next season. Some of their players have been playing pretty well too, and I'm thinking they could be quite valuable to us off the bench?

Points/Rebounds/Assists/Steals/Blocks on FG%/3PT%/FT%

Kent Bazemore (G) - 760K
13.1/3.1/3.3/1.3 on 45/37/64 @ 28MPG

I mean, a good defender, i'm sure his stats are a little inflated, but, for a cheap price, could be considered?

Wesley Johnson (GF) - 916K
8.9/4.1/1.5/1.1/1.0 on 43/37/78 @ 28MPG

Haven't really paid attention to him either, likewise with all these LAL players, their stats are likely a little inflated, but he doesn't seem to be too bad for the price either.

Xavier Henry (G) - 916K

10/2.7/1.2/1.0 on 42/35/66 @ 21MPG

Will be coming off surgery, so his price could be potentially around the same.

Jodie Meeks (SG) - 1,550,000

15.4/2.6/1.8/1.4 on 46/40/86 @ 33MPG

Shoots quite well, though, I believe he's lacking a little bit in the defensive aspect.

Chris Kaman (C) - 3,183,000

10.5/5.9/1.5/0.3/1.0 on 50/0/77 @ 19MPG

Plays pretty decently given his minutes, good size, grabs boards. Not a great defender I believe though?

Jordan Hill (PF/C) - 3,500,000

9.2/7.3/0.6/0.4/0.8 on 55/0/67 @ 20MPG

Great rebounder, seems to play good D, good size.

Nick Young (G) - 1,100,000 (PO @ 1.2M)

17.2/2.6/1.4/0.7 on 43/37/83 @ 28MPG

Has a player option, but, only @ 1.2M, could look elsewhere.

Doesn't defend too well, takes too many jump-shots, a bit of a knucklehead. But, he scores, and he does it decently. Not too efficient, but, seems like he can be a bit of a spark-plug off the bench for some instant offence?

Shittier Nate Robinson? LOL.

Kendall Marshall would be amazing, but he's got a Team Option, and it'd be stupid for the Lakers to not pick that up.

Yes, I know I just randomly chose the Lakers, and pulled their players, but, they came to my mind because of all their short contracts, lol. It's essentially players that have gone 25 - 52 in the Western Conference, lol.

I wouldn't mind taking a run at either Nick Young or Bazemore as back-ups; these are two guys that don't lack confidence, or ever will. Jordan Hill would be a nice pick-up too, but, he's more a of a 4 then a 5. The difference is mainly in his size.

[OldSkoolCool]

The majority of our team has good chem and I think there is a good base here that you keep together to grow the culture for the young kids you add. Lowry, Ross, Val, Amir and Pattman are my core.

1) Use Salmon's buyout on Draft Day - Salmons + pick #59 to OKC for Perkins + Perry Jones III +/- future second. OKC does it for cap relief, we buy out Perkins and take a flier on PJ3 whom I think is on a good developmental track and could be a good player within a couple of seasons, play him off the bench at SF.

Lowry/De Colo/Stone
Ross/????
Fields/PJ3
Amir/Patterson/TH
JV/Vonleh/Hayes

Hmmm been thinking about this....I like the Salmons idea, as well as retaining everyone except Vasquez. But I'm flip flopping on Vonleh.

PJ3 really helps our SF position, and I do think he can be at least a quality backup defensive specialist guy who could play well off the ball, also he has no cost to aquire. However I'm thinking we need a lot of help at our wing rotation.

I have a few ideas.

1) If Milwaukee drafts Wiggins: DD for Pachulia+Giannis or DD+S&T Vasquez for Mayo+Giannis

- I think Milwaukee does either one if they have Wiggins. DD is a current all star to put beside a 'superstar' and really help with the building of their team.
- We do it because Giannis is looking like a very good player, both defensively and offensively.
- Our bench would still be a disaster still
- We would get immediately worse, but would be able to reach much higher as Giannis+Ross+Val develop

2) Cleveland: Waiters and Kyrie are not the best pairing, Waiters is going to be a very good 6th man (something we need). DD for Waiters+S&T Miles

- They do it to fix the Waiters/Kyrie problem while getting an all-star SG to replace him, pretty good deal if you ask me.
- We do it for the sake of having a legit bench (Waiters + Miles) that will feature a 6th man of the year/all star guy who will probably be better than DD.
- Still have the issue of starting SF. Can Fields return to form? Is PJ3 ready/able?
- This move keeps us on an improving trend, will make us better than the current roster...but will it be enough to be a contender?


Roster 1)

Lowry/De Colo
Ross/LaVine?
Giannis/PJ3/Fields
Amir/Pattman/TH
JV/Hayes/Pachulia

Roster 2)

Lowry/De Colo
Ross/Waiters
PJ3/Miles/Fields/KJ McDaniels
Amir/Pattman/TH
JV/Hayes/TH

I like roster 1 in terms of potential in the future. I don't know how far back we would get set, depends on how much JV and Ross improve to cover ~10 of the usage of DD efficiently, but the potential is there to be a top team in the East. Very few holes if Giannis progresses as expected outside of our bench. That can be build through late drafting of 6th man type guards. (maybe not LaVine, but slotted him in)

I like roster 2 in terms of winning immediately and continuing to build on success. SF position is a fustercluck though unless someone steps up. Games would most likely finish with a lineup of Lowry+Ross+Waiters with Waiters being interchangeable if defensive length needed. Small team and could cause problems...

[imanshumpert]

Hmmm been thinking about this....I like the Salmons idea, as well as retaining everyone except Vasquez. But I'm flip flopping on Vonleh.

PJ3 really helps our SF position, and I do think he can be at least a quality backup defensive specialist guy who could play well off the ball, also he has no cost to aquire. However I'm thinking we need a lot of help at our wing rotation.

I like Perry Jones too, but only if we're giving up squat to get him (ie. cheap FA signing or flipping a vet like Hayes' expiring for him).

I have a few ideas.

1) If Milwaukee drafts Wiggins: DD for Pachulia+Giannis or DD+S&T Vasquez for Mayo+Giannis

- I think Milwaukee does either one if they have Wiggins. DD is a current all star to put beside a 'superstar' and really help with the building of their team.
- We do it because Giannis is looking like a very good player, both defensively and offensively.
- Our bench would still be a disaster still
- We would get immediately worse, but would be able to reach much higher as Giannis+Ross+Val develop

Both of those trade scenarios are terrible. For starters, both of them have us taking back bad contracts. In the first deal, we're now stuck paying 5M a season for a decent backup centre for the next 2 years, and in the second one we're paying Mayo slightly less than what DeMar makes for the next 3 (and Mayo has been garbage all season). You're giving up a 23-4-4 all-star SG on an affordable contract for a prospect and the opportunity to absorb bad salary. We don't even increase our financial flexibility (Mayo/Zaza would have next to zero value in any trade), and it's not like Po is some surefire star prospect. He has great physical tools and has played OK as a rookie, but anyone being really realistic about his potential would probably put his ceiling somewhere around Nicolas Batum not Durant like some delusional people have been saying. So we're trading DeRozan and absorbing bad salary for the chance to maybe get Nicolas Batum? No thanks.

2) Cleveland: Waiters and Kyrie are not the best pairing, Waiters is going to be a very good 6th man (something we need). DD for Waiters+S&T Miles

- They do it to fix the Waiters/Kyrie problem while getting an all-star SG to replace him, pretty good deal if you ask me.
- We do it for the sake of having a legit bench (Waiters + Miles) that will feature a 6th man of the year/all star guy who will probably be better than DD.
- Still have the issue of starting SF. Can Fields return to form? Is PJ3 ready/able?
- This move keeps us on an improving trend, will make us better than the current roster...but will it be enough to be a contender?

First of all I'd like an explanation of the bold. Waiters isn't even better than Ross let alone DeRozan. DeMar scores more efficiently despite being the focal point of his teams' offence and taking more shots. DeRozan is a better rebounder and better playmaker (you might want to argue that Waiters is better than breaking down defences, but the fact remains that DeRozan produces more assists while turning over the ball less despite seeing frequent double teams). DeRozan is a VASTLY superior finisher at the rim (nearly 70% at the rim compared to 52%), better at drawing fouls, and at least as good if not a better defensive player. Additionally, unlike Waiters, DeRozan is not undersized for his position.

There is nothing to suggest that Waiters is going to ever be better than DeRozan other than your own personal bias. I've already explained this to you before in another thread, but by every objective measure, Waiters is not and never will be better than DeRozan is right now.

Not to mention this trade doesn't even fix our problem at SF. This is just you replacing a player you don't like (DeRozan) with one you do like (Waiters). Makes no sense and thank God you're not the GM of our team because the Cavs would accept that and laugh all the way to the bank.