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DeMar DeRozan: The new Jrue Holiday?

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  • #76
    I don't really see how trading DD for picks, which would likely be non lottery picks, help make the Raptors contenders. And if Ujiri doesn't see a high ceiling and chooses to go another direction (I'm taking this to mean blow the team up) then everyone is trade bait not just DD.

    I feel like trading DD would be most beneficial by trading for an proven player. Wing or guard.

    Comment


    • #77
      YoungGunRaptor wrote: View Post
      I too wish this could be the case. I think he is still growing as a player, and I am sure that he can still become a better defender and 3 point shooter. He already is growing. He's hit 60 treys this season on 30% shooting, whilst averaging around 1.1 steals per game. His assists and rebounding have gone up alongside his PPG. His Turnovers and FG% are down, but...

      When Durant comes here, we will know what to expect from Derozan. He can definitely average 16-18 ppg on 45+% shooting alongside KD. As a sophomore, Demar averaged 17.2 on around 47% shooting. Keep this in mind: AB was our first option then, and Demar had NO three point range or defense.

      What's to say he can't remain in Toronto as a first class Robin to whatever Batman Masaii brings in?
      Wait, what?
      The name's Bond, James Bond.

      Comment


      • #78
        white men can't jump wrote: View Post
        Sacre is nothing special. The deal is essentially DeMar for a 1st rounder. Adding Sacre doesn't make any kind of real difference.
        Yeah. If the trade specifically included Sacre, then I agree.

        The pick is definitely the gold, but the Raptors need to find a serviceable backup for JV. Hayes doesn't have to go, but I would love to have another legitimate 2 way player coming off the bench behind JV. Over an 82 game season, I think it would really prove to be beneficial. I mentioned Jordan Hill earlier, and I think that he would be an ideal fit for the team as a backup PF/C.

        Obviously if this situation were to actually occur, we would have to capitalize on the fact that the SG position is the weakest its been in years, overall talent wise, and the chance exists to bring in more than just a draft pick for Derozan. Many people believe he has been the 2nd best SG in the league this season. Im sure that we can bring in quality role player(s) for Derozan.
        Last edited by YoungGunRaptor; Sun Apr 6, 2014, 10:38 PM.
        I know this may be a bit controversial but I think the Raptors have proven that they're the best team in the NBA from Canada
        -random Facebook user. 2016

        Comment


        • #79
          I have never hated on derozan.

          When Rudy Gay was here I said he was redundant and it would be better to start Ross as he has a different skillset.

          Before Rudy was here I said he was a one dimensional ineffecient mid range shooter and a minus defender who had likely reached or was close to his peak.

          I was wrong he has developed into someone who now rebounds, facilitates, plus positive yet still nowhere near great defense.

          Now you would need to answer two questions, when considering trading him.

          1.) Has he peaked?

          2.) Are their better fits?

          You tell me that Ross wouldn't thrive if we managed to acquire a legitimate low post player like Greg Monroe?

          Can you honestly say JV wouldn't benefit operating in the post if their was Ross in one corner and another Sniper on the other side?

          I get people love DeRozan, and that he loves the city. I certainly would not give him away for pennies on the dollar. But if someone makes the "godfather" offer...you take it
          For still frame photograph of me reading the DeRozan thread please refer to my avatar

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          • #80
            i still dont get why so many people hate on DD

            he;s 24 and a all-star that is only making 9.5mil
            Abbas wrote:

            First of all i was my own source

            Comment


            • #81
              YoungGunRaptor wrote: View Post
              Not necessarily. The pick is definitely the gold, but the Raptors need to find a serviceable backup for JV. Hayes doesn't have to go, but I would love to have another legitimate 2 way player coming off the bench behind JV. Over an 82 game season, I think it would really prove to be beneficial. I mentioned Jordan Hill earlier, and I think that he would be an ideal fit for the team as a backup PF/C.

              Obviously if this situation were to actually occur, we would have to capitalize on the fact that the SG position is the weakest its been in years, overall talent wise, and the chance exists to bring in more than just a draft pick for Derozan. Many people believe he has been the 2nd best SG in the league this season. Im sure that we can bring in quality role player(s) for Derozan.
              Sacre has been mostly a 3rd stringer for a bad LA team. You could basically sign just about any 7 footer at a minimum deal and get the same kind of production. Sacre is not a very strong defensive player, and it's not just because he's on an all offence team. If he wasn't Canadian, I don't think his name would come up at all.

              I feel like people are undervaluing DeMar, and overvaluing a 2014 pick. I don't care if you hate his game, he's a good player on a very good value contract, and this draft is not as strong as it was made out to be. There are maybe some players after the top 4-5 who have an obvious chance (and just a chance) to be as good or better than DeMar, but that's a pretty terrible return value-wise.

              It's gotta be a strong deal for DeMar. Multiple picks, or a top 10 pick and a solid prospect. In my mind, I'd want a couple of young assets so you have a couple of chances to get someone surpassing DeMar, and if you are getting just picks, add a serviceable (ideally young with upside) player who should actually fit in your top 9-10, in case both picks/prospects don't develop as hoped.
              Last edited by white men can't jump; Sun Apr 6, 2014, 11:02 PM.

              Comment


              • #82
                The " stop hating on DeMar, playa hatazzzzzzs" crowd need to chill out.

                Comment


                • #83
                  thead wrote: View Post
                  I have never hated on derozan.

                  When Rudy Gay was here I said he was redundant and it would be better to start Ross as he has a different skillset.

                  Before Rudy was here I said he was a one dimensional ineffecient mid range shooter and a minus defender who had likely reached or was close to his peak.

                  I was wrong he has developed into someone who now rebounds, facilitates, plus positive yet still nowhere near great defense.

                  Now you would need to answer two questions, when considering trading him.

                  1.) Has he peaked?

                  2.) Are their better fits?

                  You tell me that Ross wouldn't thrive if we managed to acquire a legitimate low post player like Greg Monroe?

                  Can you honestly say JV wouldn't benefit operating in the post if their was Ross in one corner and another Sniper on the other side?

                  I get people love DeRozan, and that he loves the city. I certainly would not give him away for pennies on the dollar. But if someone makes the "godfather" offer...you take it
                  This is the key. "Godfather" has to be pretty damn amazing for a young guy who just made his first all-star game, could still improve a bit (even if only slightly) and is on a very reasonable contract for what he's done this year. Like...damn amazing.

                  Example that I might be ok with (random off the top of my head):

                  Orlando sends one of their 2014 1st rd picks (likely the Knicks pick they own through Denver), Orlando's 2015 or 2016 1st rounder, and Victor Oladipo for DeMar.

                  I don't think that's at all likely, given they're high on Oladipo, and have Afflalo under contract...but it'd have to be a home run type of offer where you have 2-3 young pieces any of which can be as high an impact player (or close to it) as DeMar, and even if none are but they're all solid, you get 2-3 good young pieces for one.

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    BigCamB wrote: View Post
                    The " stop hating on DeMar, playa hatazzzzzzs" crowd need to chill out.
                    The "people hating on the people hating on the people hating Demar, playa hatazzs" crowd needs to chill out quick.
                    The Baltic Beast is unstoppable!

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Not sure why we are singling out DD in a "would you trade him?" thread. I mean, the answer is simple: everybody is available for the right price.

                      Secondly, the Jrue Holiday / Sixers analogy isn't really all that great. The only similarity is the idea of trading a player in the first year he became an all-star, with the idea that he supposedly has reached his maximum trade value. Again, the same answer: the right price.

                      And it will take us years to see how that Jrue Holiday trade actually works out for Philly - who knows if they really maximized value or got fleeced again, since it's all about future potential for them. The other thing about Philly is that they were pretty much in a bad situation. They had lost Iggy for basically nothing (Bynum) and in the same trade they got tricked by Orlando into tossing in Nikola Vucevic - a very nice 2-way centre on a late round rookie contract. So really, the Sixers had almost no choice but to blow it up. They made a nice recovery with the MCW draft pick last year - which will probably end up being the best move they ever did.

                      The Raps situation is completely different. They have already assembled a starting 5 that is balanced (offensively and defensively), that is still relatively young, with much upside side potential in Ross and JV. Financially, they have decent flexibility with Ross/JV on rookie contracts and both DD and Amir looking like they are on value contracts. Lowry's contract, age, future health and continued level of production is the huge decision they need to make.

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        enlightenment wrote: View Post
                        The "people hating on the people hating on the people hating Demar, playa hatazzs" crowd needs to chill out quick.
                        Nope, because I'm not hating. At least bring something intelligent to the discussion instead of saying "lol everyone hates DeMar, haters" People around here always talk about this team making a significant move for once like multiple picks, a big time player etc if they're going to make a big jump and that internal growth of the current core will not be enough. If the raptors want to make a big move, surely DeMar is the most valuable asset the raptors have to include in such a move. Who else is there?
                        Of course if you believe in the he current core then that's fine as well, I am very comfortable with it as well..but it's just a legit discussion and nothing personal against DeMar. It's not even to do with hating his game either.

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          What a poile of crap of crap I'm reading in this thread, with this "we're just discussing ways to improve the team (like you have a fucking clue), and not hating on DeMar". For the most part it's the same people who've been pissing on him forever, and saying all off-season how he would never improve significantly. He proved them all wrong, in spades, and they should stfu the next time they think about spewing their expert opinions on future prospects of a player. If they weren't saying that before, they're the ones jumping all over his bad moments, and constantly whining about his long 2s. Get off of this high fucking horse about not singling out DD and only bringing him up as the most likely asset to improve. You're full of shit. You love every opportunity to dump on him, and love such a thread to downplay his many true benefits o this team.

                          Character. Ever hear of that word? Think it's important in players, and team building? Ever improving skills aside, this young MAN oozes PROFESSIONAL character. In he ways he's approaches his job. Ross is primed to take over his spot? WTF do you know about Ross's approach to being a profssional NBAer, and whether o not he be like the many highly skilled BOYS who never become pro basktball MEN lke DD? From stories of the GM hauling him aside and tellin him to ake bete care of himself and get the rest (not partyin, not staying up all night playing video games), he ain't close to being a pro yet. All the skills in the world won't get him far unless he can get it through his skull to o be a respnsible pro, like never stops showing.

                          The history of the NBA i littered with more skilled players that never get it, than those like DeMar. Seriously. Why do you think guys like Hayes and Magloire have long careers, despite all the more "skilled" kids coming out of college every year?

                          There's a ret deal more value to a young 24 yar old DeMar than his fucking stats and long 2s. The young man is a KEEPER for a team trying to build a nevr say die, always hav to improve, culture, but y'll want to fantasize about getting some untried kids that could be highly skilled flameouts in a few years, or even cancers that destroy the chemistry being built on this young team at the moment. You havent a fucking clue about the character of these improvements your "expertise" is discussing. He's a great young man, dedicated to hard work, improving, winning, loyal to the team and city, only 24, and on a very good contract. WTF?? Get behind him, support him, instead of constantly nitpicking him, and "looking for ways to zimprove the team" by getting rid of him.

                          It's not "THE fan base" that's twisted. It's a significant portion of the RR fanbase that are fucked up.

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            I like DD. I want to keep him, but, it's a business. If trading DD helps us get further, in the future, and MU is presented with a good offer, you just have to take it.

                            I don't think MU should actively shop DD, he's an All-Star, on a great contract. However, if people come calling about him, he should entertain the offers.

                            If we keep him, I'm happy, if we trade him for a great return, I'm also happy.

                            People need to stop with the "DD Haters", and this, and that. Remember, basketball is a business. It's a sport. You're in it to win, not to appease your fan-base by trying to keep players that they like, while sacrificing your ability to win.

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              chico wrote: View Post
                              What a poile of crap of crap I'm reading in this thread, with this "we're just discussing ways to improve the team (like you have a fucking clue), and not hating on DeMar". For the most part it's the same people who've been pissing on him forever, and saying all off-season how he would never improve significantly. He proved them all wrong, in spades, and they should stfu the next time they think about spewing their expert opinions on future prospects of a player. If they weren't saying that before, they're the ones jumping all over his bad moments, and constantly whining about his long 2s. Get off of this high fucking horse about not singling out DD and only bringing him up as the most likely asset to improve. You're full of shit. You love every opportunity to dump on him, and love such a thread to downplay his many true benefits o this team.

                              Character. Ever hear of that word? Think it's important in players, and team building? Ever improving skills aside, this young MAN oozes PROFESSIONAL character. In he ways he's approaches his job. Ross is primed to take over his spot? WTF do you know about Ross's approach to being a profssional NBAer, and whether o not he be like the many highly skilled BOYS who never become pro basktball MEN lke DD? From stories of the GM hauling him aside and tellin him to ake bete care of himself and get the rest (not partyin, not staying up all night playing video games), he ain't close to being a pro yet. All the skills in the world won't get him far unless he can get it through his skull to o be a respnsible pro, like never stops showing.

                              The history of the NBA i littered with more skilled players that never get it, than those like DeMar. Seriously. Why do you think guys like Hayes and Magloire have long careers, despite all the more "skilled" kids coming out of college every year?

                              There's a ret deal more value to a young 24 yar old DeMar than his fucking stats and long 2s. The young man is a KEEPER for a team trying to build a nevr say die, always hav to improve, culture, but y'll want to fantasize about getting some untried kids that could be highly skilled flameouts in a few years, or even cancers that destroy the chemistry being built on this young team at the moment. You havent a fucking clue about the character of these improvements your "expertise" is discussing. He's a great young man, dedicated to hard work, improving, winning, loyal to the team and city, only 24, and on a very good contract. WTF?? Get behind him, support him, instead of constantly nitpicking him, and "looking for ways to zimprove the team" by getting rid of him.

                              It's not "THE fan base" that's twisted. It's a significant portion of the RR fanbase that are fucked up.
                              You need to take a chill pill.

                              It's just shooting the shit.

                              No one said we need to get rid of him. No one is claiming to be an expert.

                              People have mentioned possible consequences. People have mentioned the fact that the draft is a lot of luck.

                              And at one point DD was an unproven kid. In fact, he was a horribly raw prospect with almost zero NBA level skills beyond decent athleticism. So trading him could bring in guys who flame out, or aren't good for chemistry...it could also bring in kids who can surpass what he does on the court. It could bring guys of equal or higher character and talent.

                              People can discuss whatever they want. If you don't like it, don't read it. People are just talking possibilities. Obviously opinions will vary. Most people seem to think his value is extremely high. And most acknowledge that trading him only makes sense in certain scenarios. Why does that piss you off?

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                chico wrote: View Post
                                What a poile of crap of crap I'm reading in this thread, with this "we're just discussing ways to improve the team (like you have a fucking clue), and not hating on DeMar". For the most part it's the same people who've been pissing on him forever, and saying all off-season how he would never improve significantly. He proved them all wrong, in spades, and they should stfu the next time they think about spewing their expert opinions on future prospects of a player. If they weren't saying that before, they're the ones jumping all over his bad moments, and constantly whining about his long 2s. Get off of this high fucking horse about not singling out DD and only bringing him up as the most likely asset to improve. You're full of shit. You love every opportunity to dump on him, and love such a thread to downplay his many true benefits o this team.

                                Character. Ever hear of that word? Think it's important in players, and team building? Ever improving skills aside, this young MAN oozes PROFESSIONAL character. In he ways he's approaches his job. Ross is primed to take over his spot? WTF do you know about Ross's approach to being a profssional NBAer, and whether o not he be like the many highly skilled BOYS who never become pro basktball MEN lke DD? From stories of the GM hauling him aside and tellin him to ake bete care of himself and get the rest (not partyin, not staying up all night playing video games), he ain't close to being a pro yet. All the skills in the world won't get him far unless he can get it through his skull to o be a respnsible pro, like never stops showing.

                                The history of the NBA i littered with more skilled players that never get it, than those like DeMar. Seriously. Why do you think guys like Hayes and Magloire have long careers, despite all the more "skilled" kids coming out of college every year?

                                There's a ret deal more value to a young 24 yar old DeMar than his fucking stats and long 2s. The young man is a KEEPER for a team trying to build a nevr say die, always hav to improve, culture, but y'll want to fantasize about getting some untried kids that could be highly skilled flameouts in a few years, or even cancers that destroy the chemistry being built on this young team at the moment. You havent a fucking clue about the character of these improvements your "expertise" is discussing. He's a great young man, dedicated to hard work, improving, winning, loyal to the team and city, only 24, and on a very good contract. WTF?? Get behind him, support him, instead of constantly nitpicking him, and "looking for ways to zimprove the team" by getting rid of him.

                                It's not "THE fan base" that's twisted. It's a significant portion of the RR fanbase that are fucked up.
                                Hey Salmon.

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