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Wrong about the "Superstar" to win a championship

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  • #16
    JimiCliff wrote: View Post
    Sure, this might be true.

    But...to my eyes, the most important factor in the Spurs taking the title this year was the offensive system that was only recently put into place. Remember, Duncan, Parker and Manu hadn't won in seven year, and before last year, they hadn't even really come close in about five - in spite of the fact the that they were obviously younger in each of those years.

    To me, the Spurs looked more like a college team with the way that they were moving the ball, constantly curling off of screens + cutting backdoor...night and day when compared to conventional, iso-heavy, "horns"-centric NBA offences.

    My hope is that...

    a) This shift in philosophy was as instrumental in the Spurs winning this title as all of the reasons Matt mentioned above,

    and

    b) Others have been taking note, and we've just witnessed the beginning of a gestalt shift in the way NBA teams approach their offence.
    Definitely agree. Did the final remnants of AI- and TMac- eras of ISO ball just end? I sure hope so.

    I've made numerous comments on these forums about the need for ball and player movement not "my-turn, your-turn" offense comprised of contested jump shots.

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    • #17
      mcHAPPY wrote: View Post
      Definitely agree. Did the final remnants of AI- and TMac- eras of ISO ball just end? I sure hope so.

      I've made numerous comments on these forums about the need for ball and player movement not "my-turn, your-turn" offense comprised of contested jump shots.
      For sure. Myself as well. The ugly, un-answered question that was looming over all of our heads, though, was: "Sure, it looks pretty - but can it actually win?" And until now, it hadn't - at least, not since the Bulls started winning titles.
      "Stop eating your sushi."
      "I do actually have a pair of Uggs."
      "I've had three cups of green tea tonight. I'm wired. I'm absolutely wired."
      - Jack Armstrong

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      • #18
        As has already been alluded to....the one true superstar on the Spurs is Coach Pop. The other conventional wisdom item made to stand on its head is the "good defense will beat a good offense". This is truly the first time since I have been watching pro ball that I witnessed the opposite. An amazing display in last night's game from end of the first qtr on (considering how the Heat started the game) that the Spurs took offense to another level. On a personal level....that beat down of a "bastardized" team was sweet to see. I hope the loss will discourage these free agent super teams on steroids being formed.

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        • #19
          Bendit wrote: View Post
          As has already been alluded to....the one true superstar on the Spurs is Coach Pop. The other conventional wisdom item made to stand on its head is the "good defense will beat a good offense". This is truly the first time since I have been watching pro ball that I witnessed the opposite. An amazing display in last night's game from end of the first qtr on (considering how the Heat started the game) that the Spurs took offense to another level. On a personal level....that beat down of a "bastardized" team was sweet to see. I hope the loss will discourage these free agent super teams on steroids being formed.
          It will be interesting to see where Melo lands this summer.

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          • #20
            Interesting?...you mean like Melo-drama? Yeah I am looking forward to the to 'n fro espn froth to be soon displayed. Whichever team decides to splurge for him (incl. the Knicks) shall rue the move...with one caveat....that he truly subjugates himself to the team, coach and system.

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            • #21
              Spurs really proved how important depth is, and utilizing said depth properly.
              @sweatpantsjer

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              • #22
                Fear Austin Daye in 2015!!

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                • #23
                  2 questions this offseason:

                  Will the Heat be able to bolster their ridiculously bad depth?

                  Will Austin Daye, fresh off winning a ring, make the Spurs roster next year?
                  The name's Bond, James Bond.

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                  • #24
                    The NBA is simply easier when you have a superstar playing for you. Despite the Spurs knocking out the Heat the way they did, James still had a pretty awesome series. Everyone else in Miami just sucked.

                    You get a star player, and other players want to play with that guy. Despite San Antonio's success who wants to play there?

                    You get a superstar you could add around them and it's probably easier to maintain as long as the superstar is happy. It could take years to create a system like Pop/Buford have and when coaches and GM's are always on the hot seat it makes it difficult to have continuity. If MU doesn't do anything in the 4 years he has left does he get resigned? Do the fans and the board want to keep him around if he can't get to the 2nd or 3rd round?

                    With Pops and Buford they had Robinson and Duncan and won early. When you win you have an easier time keeping your staff and it's easier to maintain that continuity. Utah had Sloan for the longest time and a system that worked. But it was easy to keep Sloan because he was a winner.. and he was a winner because he had one of the greatest PG's and PF's of all time on his roster.

                    It's very difficult but it would be easier to simulate the Heat than the Spurs.. and the Spurs in my opinion only have what they have because they were at one time like the Heat.

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                    • #25
                      planetmars wrote: View Post
                      The NBA is simply easier when you have a superstar playing for you. Despite the Spurs knocking out the Heat the way they did, James still had a pretty awesome series. Everyone else in Miami just sucked.

                      You get a star player, and other players want to play with that guy. Despite San Antonio's success who wants to play there?

                      You get a superstar you could add around them and it's probably easier to maintain as long as the superstar is happy. It could take years to create a system like Pop/Buford have and when coaches and GM's are always on the hot seat it makes it difficult to have continuity. If MU doesn't do anything in the 4 years he has left does he get resigned? Do the fans and the board want to keep him around if he can't get to the 2nd or 3rd round?

                      With Pops and Buford they had Robinson and Duncan and won early. When you win you have an easier time keeping your staff and it's easier to maintain that continuity. Utah had Sloan for the longest time and a system that worked. But it was easy to keep Sloan because he was a winner.. and he was a winner because he had one of the greatest PG's and PF's of all time on his roster.

                      It's very difficult but it would be easier to simulate the Heat than the Spurs.. and the Spurs in my opinion only have what they have because they were at one time like the Heat.
                      It will interesting to see how the Spurs (and Pop) do once their own big-3 retire. Jazz/Sloan weren't the same once Malone/Stockton left. Jackson has only ever won with all-time greats on the roster.

                      I think it's safe to say that to sustain a truly great and successful team, you must have star players and a star head coach. An interesting study/debate would be how well one can do without the other. Roster stability, depth, and knowing/accepting your role are also key contributors.

                      There are many different strategies to get there, with many examples of each strategy both succeeding and failing being available for reference, but the end goal for effective team building is universal.

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                      • #26
                        I wonder how much this is going to make LeBron think about Miami. After that series he has to be having Cleveland flashbacks.

                        I really hope the biggest take-away from this Finals for the Raps is the Spurs highly evolved team ball. I did not like the prevalence of iso ball in the Brooklyn series - a team playing like that has a low playoff ceiling.

                        But for all the "Spurs = team" talk, didn't this series also make it obvious that "Miami = team"?? LeBron can't, and never could, win the Finals by himself. Miami has had 2 seasons of stellar, league-leading team-oriented defense, and two championship rings because they, as a team, were firing on all cylinders and executing at a high level. They didn't lose because of their primary superstar LeBron, the most pronounced drop off was in Shane Battier and the role players (and the uselessness of additions like Beasley and Oden).
                        "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                        • #27
                          Duncan is still a top-20 player in this league, parker is a superstar, ginobili got his game back, and leonard is on the verge. Add to that the greatest coach of all time.

                          No superstars?

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                          • #28
                            KHD wrote: View Post
                            Duncan is still a top-20 player in this league, parker is a superstar, ginobili got his game back, and leonard is on the verge. Add to that the greatest coach of all time.

                            No superstars?
                            Agreed. Duncan played ridiculously well throughout the season, Parker's a top-3 point guard currently, Manu is literally the best 6th man a team could have, and Leonard is slowly ascending to stardom.

                            I count 4 players on this team that played like All-Stars throughout the season into the playoffs. Maybe none of them are legit superstars, but oh my, they are literally on the tier right below.

                            I think the Spurs did prove that systems play is essential in today's game, but they didn't in any way, do it without top-notch talent.

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                            • #29
                              And the Spurs have maintained their top notch talent and have won many titles with them.
                              The name's Bond, James Bond.

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                              • #30
                                Letter N wrote: View Post
                                Duncan used to be a superstar, he's just old
                                Parker is a superstar, he just doesn't play that much
                                Leonard could become a superstar, he's just young
                                Bonner is a superstar, he's the Red Rocket!
                                Add to that Manu and their great Coach and an organization that no one else in NBA has been able to do what they do !!!

                                Looking at Spurs and thinking we can just do what they do is FOOLISH ... That group is special and that Organization is a Special one.

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