#FireCasey

[LJ2]

Casey says the players have to work on shooting more 3's. Makes no mention of Derozan... all-star shooting guard. smh. Quotes like these make me skeptical.

Didn't read the article but was there any mention of Casey speaking with 2Pat about taking more 3's? Or is it just given at this point that he won't be back next season? That would mean another 3 pt threat gone along with Ross. Good they are asking players to work on their shooting, but they can't really be expecting drastic Lowry type improvements can they? Sounds like they are banking on more internal growth to get past the Cav's.

[mjt20mik]

Didn't read the article but was there any mention of Casey speaking with 2Pat about taking more 3's? Or is it just given at this point that he won't be back next season? That would mean another 3 pt threat gone along with Ross. Good they are asking players to work on their shooting, but they can't really be expecting drastic Lowry type improvements can they? Sounds like they are banking on more internal growth to get past the Cav's.

The thing is if they sign any of the free agents back, they won't really have much cap space to get shooters. I mean Cory and Norm have improved their shooting quite drastically. It would be interesting to see how they develop going forward.

[LJ2]

The thing is if they sign any of the free agents back, they won't really have much cap space to get shooters. I mean Cory and Norm have improved their shooting quite drastically. It would be interesting to see how they develop going forward.

I didn't have the impression that CoJo's shooting had improved as a Raptor. Don't have the stats to back that up however. At some point MU may have to address shooting needs through trades. We have picks and young players which he may want to look at using.

[DanH]

I didn't have the impression that CoJo's shooting had improved as a Raptor. Don't have the stats to back that up however. At some point MU may have to address shooting needs through trades. We have picks and young players which he may want to look at using.

He shot 27% from 3 in 2015-16 and 36% from 3 this year. Seems like an improvement. But it's worth noting he was still very low in volume - up from about 1.4 to 1.7 attempts per game. No evidence he could maintain that improvement with a significant increase in volume (which would certainly be suggested by this new system).

[psrs1]

I agree with what you said, but if you are correct, then Masai appears to be setting up Casey to fail this season. The biggest question is not if Casey can implement a ball movement offense, but rather, will the players have respect for him now? If Lowry comes back, that seems like a dysfunctional situation right from the get-go.

It's just an awkward situation all-around. You don't normally fire a coach after a 50-win regular season, but Casey's ceiling as a coach with this group seems capped in the playoffs. I suspect next off-season will be the year of real change.

How many more next off seasons do we need to wait for?

[3inthekeon]

To be fair though, what's the alternative? If Casey comes out against it, he's fired immediately. I don't read much into what either MU or Casey says to the media, since it's all PR smoke.

Having said that, the more I think about it and consider the various contract situations, maybe it does make sense for Casey to stay and Lowry to leave. At the very least it opens the door to change the style of play with the team's leader and floor-general moving on, and gives Casey a chance to show what he can do with a new system and revamped roster.

If the new system is predicated on passing and 3pt shooting, allowing Lowry to walk is a recipe for failure.

[Superjudge]

There are a few things we know as facts (and yes, I use the term loosely), which when added up, seems to make "keep the core together" (the core being Casey, Lowry and DeRozan) and "culture change" appear mutually exclusive.

Casey
- he seems like a bit of a paradox; his 'pound the rock' mantra and role cards point to stubbornness, yet he seems to give his assistants flexibility to implement different offensive/defensive systems (ie: Greer's defense), but then can't change flow during the season let alone within a game
- one of his greatest strengths seems to be that he is respected by his players, especially the stars and vets, whom he lets play to their strength/preference (ie: ride-or-die with Lowry & DeRozan)
- when asked why the team doesn't pass more, he stated that this roster doesn't have players that are capable of passing

Lowry
- he is a pass-first PG
- he sulked and sucked when the Raptors tried to turn him into Calderon 2.0
- became a star after MU sat down with him, handed the team keys to him, and told him to play the game his way (one has to think either Casey was supportive of this, or was explicitly directed by MU to plan around this)

DeRozan
- he's at his best with the ball in his hands, using ISO or screens to get his own offense first
- has shown glimpses of being able to facilitate, but not often and usually only when he gets frustrated enough not being able to score himself


As hard as I've been on DeRozan in the past, I can't help but think he's the most likely to be able to adapt to a new pass-first culture, especially if the coach holds him accountable to do so.

When I get to Casey and Lowry, I can't help but think one of them has to go, in order for MU's culture change/reset to be implemented. It's easy to point at Casey, but we don't really know all that has transpired behind the scenes between him and MU over the years, especially as it relates to Lowry and tailoring the system to benefit Lowry and DeRozan. I also can't help but think that by firing Casey for playing that style of system, MU would effectively be implicating himself as equally guilty, since he went out of his way to bring in players to fit that system (to compliment Lowry/DeRozan and fill the gaps that their weaknesses created).

Perhaps by keeping Casey and demanding he change his system, MU is separating himself from his coach (and possibly the core players on the roster), so that if the team isn't any more successful it's easier to retool (coaching staff and/or roster) without admitting his own failing.

blah blah blah.

[Puffer]

blah blah blah.

etc., etc, etc,!

[psrs1]

There are a few things we know as facts (and yes, I use the term loosely), which when added up, seems to make "keep the core together" (the core being Casey, Lowry and DeRozan) and "culture change" appear mutually exclusive.

Casey
- he seems like a bit of a paradox; his 'pound the rock' mantra and role cards point to stubbornness, yet he seems to give his assistants flexibility to implement different offensive/defensive systems (ie: Greer's defense), but then can't change flow during the season let alone within a game
- one of his greatest strengths seems to be that he is respected by his players, especially the stars and vets, whom he lets play to their strength/preference (ie: ride-or-die with Lowry & DeRozan)
- when asked why the team doesn't pass more, he stated that this roster doesn't have players that are capable of passing

Lowry
- he is a pass-first PG
- he sulked and sucked when the Raptors tried to turn him into Calderon 2.0
- became a star after MU sat down with him, handed the team keys to him, and told him to play the game his way (one has to think either Casey was supportive of this, or was explicitly directed by MU to plan around this)

DeRozan
- he's at his best with the ball in his hands, using ISO or screens to get his own offense first
- has shown glimpses of being able to facilitate, but not often and usually only when he gets frustrated enough not being able to score himself


As hard as I've been on DeRozan in the past, I can't help but think he's the most likely to be able to adapt to a new pass-first culture, especially if the coach holds him accountable to do so.

When I get to Casey and Lowry, I can't help but think one of them has to go, in order for MU's culture change/reset to be implemented. It's easy to point at Casey, but we don't really know all that has transpired behind the scenes between him and MU over the years, especially as it relates to Lowry and tailoring the system to benefit Lowry and DeRozan. I also can't help but think that by firing Casey for playing that style of system, MU would effectively be implicating himself as equally guilty, since he went out of his way to bring in players to fit that system (to compliment Lowry/DeRozan and fill the gaps that their weaknesses created).

Perhaps by keeping Casey and demanding he change his system, MU is separating himself from his coach (and possibly the core players on the roster), so that if the team isn't any more successful it's easier to retool (coaching staff and/or roster) without admitting his own failing.

Good post. I'm not in love with Casey. That said Casey is going to be back and probably Lowry too. MU and MLSE I think likes winning 50 games and getting top 4 seed. We are sort of on a treadmill of being a solid regular season team and an inconsistent playoff team--perhaps better than the treadmill under the Colangelo era.

[special1]

Good post. I'm not in love with Casey. That said Casey is going to be back and probably Lowry too. MU and MLSE I think likes winning 50 games and getting top 4 seed. We are sort of on a treadmill of being a solid regular season team and an inconsistent playoff team--perhaps better than the treadmill under the Colangelo era.

"We are sort of on a treadmill of being a solid regular season team and an inconsistent playoff team--perhaps better than the treadmill under the Colangelo era."


Perhaps?? lol......Really?


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[Fully]

Good post. I'm not in love with Casey. That said Casey is going to be back and probably Lowry too. MU and MLSE I think likes winning 50 games and getting top 4 seed. We are sort of on a treadmill of being a solid regular season team and an inconsistent playoff team--perhaps better than the treadmill under the Colangelo era.

Yes, perhaps the past four seasons of winning basketball and hosting a first round playoff series has been better than watching Rudy Gay and Andrea Bargnani co-lead a 38 win team. Perhaps.

[Puffer]

Yes, perhaps the past four seasons of winning basketball and hosting a first round playoff series has been better than watching Rudy Gay and Andrea Bargnani co-lead a 38 win team. Perhaps.

Another Raptors Fan goes over the top.

[psrs1]

Yes, perhaps the past four seasons of winning basketball and hosting a first round playoff series has been better than watching Rudy Gay and Andrea Bargnani co-lead a 38 win team. Perhaps.

For sure it's better but it's nice to dream of going to NBA finals and based on my observations that may not be the goal of MLSE. I don't have the answer but like most posters on this forum I would love to see us get to NBA finals. The only plausible scenario I see at this point is if LBJ gets a serious injury . Matt52 used post on different strategies in this regard .

[3inthekeon]

For sure it's better but it's nice to dream of going to NBA finals and based on my observations that may not be the goal of MLSE. I don't have the answer but like most posters on this forum I would love to see us get to NBA finals. The only plausible scenario I see at this point is if LBJ gets a serious injury . Matt52 used post on different strategies in this regard .

What exactly would MLSE have done differently if their goal WAS to get to the finals?

[psrs1]

What exactly would MLSE have done differently if their goal WAS to get to the finals?

Signed a FA PF last off season and go into tax would have been one consideration. Clearly Pascal Siakam as starting PF put us in the position of having to trade TR to get a legitimate PF.