Everything Jakob Poeltl

[enlightenment]

I really don't get this anachronistic fascination we have for post play.

It's effective when there is a mismatch or if the post player is a good passer and draws defenders. Otherwise it's a pretty shitty shot, kinda like long 2 pointers.

The only way its like a long 2 pointer is in that it can lead to 2 points. The effeciency of post play is the explanation. The idea that it simplifies the offense to a game of one-on-one, which if you have a dominating post presence, is like insta-score with little effort on anyones part. Post players demand double teams, even when they aren't that skilled. You can't say the same for mid-range shooters, even when they are elite.

[Barolt]

Everyone's been talking about us integrating JV in our offense more. But what we've seen of our offense since the season ended was Summer League, and we completely ignored our post guys.

So...

Expect more of the same next year.

[KeonClark]

Everyone's been talking about us integrating JV in our offense more. But what we've seen of our offense since the season ended was Summer League, and we completely ignored our post guys.

So...

Expect more of the same next year.

I don't think summer league is a direct indicator of what's gonna happen with casey, ride or die, or the beast from Europe's east

[Scraptor]

The only way its like a long 2 pointer is in that it can lead to 2 points. The effeciency of post play is the explanation. The idea that it simplifies the offense to a game of one-on-one, which if you have a dominating post presence, is like insta-score with little effort on anyones part. Post players demand double teams, even when they aren't that skilled. You can't say the same for mid-range shooters, even when they are elite.

Also quite simply %s go up the closer you are to the basket. Plus a higher likelihood of drawing fouls than on jump shots.

[3inthekeon]

JV Scored 0.87 points per post-up last season, and he's a pretty good post player.

That doesn't sound like an overly efficient play.

[The Great One]

It's summer league and people are freakin out smh. Poeltl is going to be a good player. People needs to relax.

[enlightenment]

JV Scored 0.87 points per post-up last season, and he's a pretty good post player.

That doesn't sound like an overly efficient play.

First of all the stat is points per possession not per post-up. So for instance, with the ppp stat, someone could shoot worse efg% for post ups and still have a higher ppp, which doesn't tell us how efficient the post-up was. I dont actually know how they specifically get a per-possession stat on an event that has its own per-possession frequency.

Plus an important point I made in my post is the relative lack of team effort needed on offence, and the likelihood of opening up opportunities for other teammates, both of which isn't reflected in ppp

[Chr1s1anL]

Its like you guys dig for stuff to complain about. Its "summer league" people.

[3inthekeon]

Kinda figured I'd get an argument so I googled;

"what happened to post-up play nba"

Struck paydirt with this Zach Lowe piece from the 2015 playoffs.

Explains it better than I can, but my point stands. Simply tossing the ball to your big man in the low post is not good strategy anymore, in most cases.

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/we...u-its-rebirth/

[DogeLover1234]

Kinda figured I'd get an argument so I googled;

"what happened to post-up play nba"

Struck paydirt with this Zach Lowe piece from the 2015 playoffs.

Explains it better than I can, but my point stands. Simply tossing the ball to your big man in the low post is not good strategy anymore, in most cases.

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/we...u-its-rebirth/

Ill take a JV post up over a contested midrange shot any day. Also consider that a great post up player draws more attention and opens up guys on the perimeter.

[BrydenB]

Kinda figured I'd get an argument so I googled;

"what happened to post-up play nba"

Struck paydirt with this Zach Lowe piece from the 2015 playoffs.

Explains it better than I can, but my point stands. Simply tossing the ball to your big man in the low post is not good strategy anymore, in most cases.

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/we...u-its-rebirth/

I remember reading that article when it came out, along with pretty much everything else Lowe writes. He speaks about defenses now as a shape that needs to be stretched/broken. For instance you have to guard Steph Curry so far from the basket that it stretches your defense and creates other wholes. I think you have to think of post ups as the same. A Shaq post up in today's NBA would still be destroying teams. You'd have to send a second guy, stretching the shape of the other team, creating opportunities.

Linking this back to Poeltl to get back to the thread topic, he seems like a willing and able passer out of the post. JV got better at this as well. Stretch that shape with post ups, make the D pay.

[3inthekeon]

Ill take a JV post up over a contested midrange shot any day. Also consider that a great post up player draws more attention and opens up guys on the perimeter.

Well considering a contested midrange shot is not much better than a turnover, that kinda goes without saying. And as I've said and the article points out, good passing bigs are more effective posting up, because they can find the open man when doubled, so opponents are also more hesitant to double.

JV is a good post-up player and scored 0.87 points per post-up last year. The Raptors scored around 0.92 points per half court possession.

Sure there are times - if he's being guarded by someone he can bully easily, (when opponents have gone small for instance), but facing a decent traditional big, posting up is not effective strategy in the modern NBA.



S

[rightsideup]

JV Scored 0.87 points per post-up last season, and he's a pretty good post player.

That doesn't sound like an overly efficient play.

I would have guessed about 1.1

[Barolt]

But we scored 1.06 PPP when going to the roll man in the PnR, 5th best in the NBA, and used that play 5th least in the league at 5.4% of our possessions. And that's including the fact that we went to Scola 130 times in the PnR, more than any other big man, and he only scored 0.83 PPP as the roll man.

JV scored 1.27 PPP as the roll man, but we only went to him 101 times all year.

Bismack was 1.18, Pat was 0.93.

[rightsideup]

Its like you guys dig for stuff to complain about. Its "summer league" people.

getting back to yak I thought he got less effective as the games went on. I did not check all the competition but they were heavier older fellows.