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Thread: ESPN Eastern conference projections

  1. #41
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    Quote golden wrote: View Post
    Disagree about stretching the floor being the main reason Sully's here. Sullinger is a versatile scorer and one of his biggest strengths is offensive rebounding and then finishing it nicely around the basket. Those OREB/putback skills complement DD & Lowry's low FG% game well, just like when we had the JV/Amir frontcourt.

    Sure, we will see some Sully in the corner, and maybe even JV in the corner from time to time, but I suspect we also see a lot of Sully/Lowry screen & roll, with Sully hunting for OREBs off the Lowry miss.
    Offensive rebounding is great and I definitely expect he will get his chances there. But in terms of fit on the floor, he has to spend a lot of time on the outside to leverage the strengths of the better players around him (JV and DD primarily). If Sully gets minutes with that Lowry+bench unit, he should definitely be setting screens and crashing the boards full time, but with the starters he should primarily be a jump shooter opening up the floor for the others (not exclusively, but primarily).

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Chr1s1anL's Avatar
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    I think Sully was mostly brought in for his rebounding, screen setting and play making skills. His big body is going to get Lowry/Deebo great looks. That Deebo/Amir hand off that we use to see might be back but, with Sully. Also we needed a forward that could do more than just shot when he gets the ball off the flare screen. Sully gives you a triple threat(drive, pass and shoot).

    Kid is a really good passer.




    Last edited by Chr1s1anL; Tue Jul 26th, 2016 at 10:44 AM.
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  3. #43
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    Quote DanH wrote: View Post
    Offensive rebounding is great and I definitely expect he will get his chances there. But in terms of fit on the floor, he has to spend a lot of time on the outside to leverage the strengths of the better players around him (JV and DD primarily). If Sully gets minutes with that Lowry+bench unit, he should definitely be setting screens and crashing the boards full time, but with the starters he should primarily be a jump shooter opening up the floor for the others (not exclusively, but primarily).
    But does he really open up the floor when he shoots the 3 at 28% or whatever? I wouldn't run out to guard him there if that's the percentage he shoots. Looks like from the stats you posted he's a good midrange shooter so maybe he should forget the 3s and stick to that. Scola shot the 3 at 40 something percent for a good bit of the season and he still couldn't give us spacing. So I don't see how Sullinger missing more 3s than hitting them is going to space the floor. Maybe if he had a history of being a good 3 point shooter like Patterson that would be a different story. If I were guarding the Raptors I would love for Sullinger to continue to think he's Kyle Korver and keep jacking up 3s. Sometimes you're left open for a reason.
    I relish negativity and disappointment. It is not healthy. Somebody buy me a pony.

  4. #44
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    Quote GLF wrote: View Post
    But does he really open up the floor when he shoots the 3 at 28% or whatever? I wouldn't run out to guard him there if that's the percentage he shoots. Looks like from the stats you posted he's a good midrange shooter so maybe he should forget the 3s and stick to that. Scola shot the 3 at 40 something percent for a good bit of the season and he still couldn't give us spacing. So I don't see how Sullinger missing more 3s than hitting them is going to space the floor. Maybe if he had a history of being a good 3 point shooter like Patterson that would be a different story. If I were guarding the Raptors I would love for Sullinger to continue to think he's Kyle Korver and keep jacking up 3s. Sometimes you're left open for a reason.
    Again, though, he exclusively shot from above the break the past few seasons. The Raptors' offensive system pushes a lot of PF 3 point shots into the corner (Scola took 50% of his threes from the corner, Patterson took 40% of his from there). Sullinger took 2% of his threes from the corner. That's not a typo, two percent.

    Corner threes are 22' from the rim. Above the break threes are 24'. Sullinger shot 44% from 20-24 feet last year. And 29% on shots from >24 feet (not including his three half-to-full court heaves). So that will make a huge difference for him.

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  6. #45
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    As for Sully being able to provide spacing Scola didn't - Scola could hit threes but wouldn't take them. Sully takes them even when he can't hit them (especially prior to last season) - if the Raps start finding him in the corner where he can hit them, I doubt willingness to shoot (and therefore to make the defence defend him out there) will be an issue for Sully.

  7. #46
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    Quote DanH wrote: View Post
    Again, though, he exclusively shot from above the break the past few seasons. The Raptors' offensive system pushes a lot of PF 3 point shots into the corner (Scola took 50% of his threes from the corner, Patterson took 40% of his from there). Sullinger took 2% of his threes from the corner. That's not a typo, two percent.

    Corner threes are 22' from the rim. Above the break threes are 24'. Sullinger shot 44% from 20-24 feet last year. And 29% on shots from >24 feet (not including his three half-to-full court heaves). So that will make a huge difference for him.
    I saw you say that but I didn't realize our system pushes a lot of corner 3's for our PFs. If he truly does shoot 44% from around that range then I take what I said. He definitely isn't afraid to shoot that's for sure. It's crazy that only 2% of his 3s were from the corner though. I wonder why Boston never figured that out and changed that
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  8. #47
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    Quote DanH wrote: View Post
    Offensive rebounding is great and I definitely expect he will get his chances there. But in terms of fit on the floor, he has to spend a lot of time on the outside to leverage the strengths of the better players around him (JV and DD primarily). If Sully gets minutes with that Lowry+bench unit, he should definitely be setting screens and crashing the boards full time, but with the starters he should primarily be a jump shooter opening up the floor for the others (not exclusively, but primarily).
    Sure, this is what you wish could/would happen, but the reality is that this is Lowry & DD's team. And once they realize that Sullinger can set good screens, rebound their misses and reset their broken plays with decent passing, you'll see a lot more Sully hand-off PnR just like Christian is saying. It allows Lowry/DD to call their own number more often without dragging down the team offensive efficiency. Premeditated drive & kickouts to shooters just isn't in Lowry/DD's DNA and Casey can't change that either. Nor is passing to the rolling big.

    Same reason why we saw Scola starting, because his IQ and versatility complemented DD/Lowry's un-predictability as a bail-out / glue guy on offense. Same reason why Carroll is struggling, because he can't read Lowry/DD's tendencies and is often being forced to drive the ball to bail them out and recover a possession. Sullinger's IQ & versatility should give him a good chance to mesh with Lowry/DD better than most, beyond being solely a stretch big as the best way to "fit".

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Chr1s1anL's Avatar
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    Quote GLF wrote: View Post
    I saw you say that but I didn't realize our system pushes a lot of corner 3's for our PFs. If he truly does shoot 44% from around that range then I take what I said. He definitely isn't afraid to shoot that's for sure. It's crazy that only 2% of his 3s were from the corner though. I wonder why Boston never figured that out and changed that
    I think Boston wanted to take advantage of his passing skills. By putting him at the top of the 3 point line so he could see the whole court and make plays.

    I think we will see DD/Sully hand off PnR with Sully having the option to fade to the corner of roll to the rim.
    @Chr1st1anL

  10. #49
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    Quote Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    I think Boston wanted to take advantage of his passing skills. By putting him at the top of the 3 point line so he could see the whole court and make plays.

    I think we will see DD/Sully hand off PnR with Sully having the option to fade to the corner of roll to the rim.
    Good point.
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  11. #50
    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer Chr1s1anL's Avatar
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    Raptors are that Indianna team that couldn't beat LBJ in Miami.
    @Chr1st1anL

  12. #51
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    Quote Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    Raptors are that Indianna team that couldn't beat LBJ in Miami.
    o_0...? There are no similarities between the Raptors and that Indiana team in strategy, composition, or accomplishments.

    The Pacers had a better coach in Vogel, a true superstar in Paul George, David West, and Roy Hibbert anchoring their defense before he fell off a cliff in Los Angeles this season. Prior to the Paul George injury, they won 28 playoff games over 4 seasons

    2011: 12th in Def Eff 1st Round [L 4-1 to Bulls]
    2012: 10th in Def Eff ECS [W 4-1 over Magic, L 4-2 to Heat]
    2013: 1st in Def Eff ECF [W 4-2 over Hawks, W 4-3 over Knicks L 4-3 to the Heat]
    2014: 1st in Def Eff ECF [W 4-3 Hawks, W 4-2 Wizards, L 4-2 to the Heat]
    2015: 8th in Def Eff **Missed Playoffs**
    2016: 3rd in Def Eff 1st Round [L 4-3 to Raptors]

    **How Vogel managed to craft a top 10 defense without Paul George is nothing short of remarkable. They vaulted back up to 3rd with him this year.

    The Raptors have no superstar, Casey at the helm, and in their 3 year span of playoff appearances have won 13 playoff games.

    2014: 9th in Def Eff 1st Round [L 4-3 to Nets]
    2015: 23rd in Def Eff 1st Round [L 4-0 to Wizards]
    2016: 11th in Def Eff ECF [W 4-3 over Pacers, W 4-3 over Heat, L 4-2 to Cavs]

    One season of playoff relevance doesn't put the Raptors on par with what those Pacers did during their heyday. They have to prove that they can make more than one deep playoff run.
    Last edited by Sinbad; Tue Jul 26th, 2016 at 05:57 PM. Reason: Context

  13. #52
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    Quote Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    Raptors are that Indianna team that couldn't beat LBJ in Miami.
    That's not bad at all.

    If Vogel keeps Hibbert on the floor at the end of Game 1 in 2013, the Pacers probably win that series and go on to the Finals. That series was a real grueling battle. I don't think the Raptors were at that level last season. Should be taking a big step next season.

    Side note: Does this mean Bismack is the new Hibbert? Huge series against the eventual champs but then fizzes out in later years? Very very possible. And a another potential breakout year for DeMar?? (Paul George). Fantastic.

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    Quote 007 wrote: View Post
    I don't think losing Scola will be an issue lol
    A lot of outsiders believe the loss of Biz will

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    Quote rightsideup wrote: View Post
    A lot of outsiders believe the loss of Biz will
    Some days it will and some it won't, of course if we lose JV again to a good chunk of time it would be more difficult to replace.

    I am hoping that our rooks (Pascal/Poeltl) will catch on quickly because we are going to need a good contribution again from everybody to return to the Eastern Conference Finals.

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    Quote rocwell wrote: View Post
    I actually feel bad for Nets fans
    All 14 of them?

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    Quote Joey wrote: View Post
    All 14 of them?

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    Quote golden wrote: View Post
    Nets projected to be last in the East and the Celtics get another top 3 pick. sheesh.
    Means less if make another Jaylen Brown pick.

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    Quote psrs1 wrote: View Post
    Means less if make another Jaylen Brown pick.
    Not really possible in next year's draft. Moreover, are we already declaring busts without a single game played.

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    Quote rightsideup wrote: View Post
    Personally, I think Teague is under rated because he deserves to be. I don't think anyone knows how many games or what you are going to get out of Jefferson, but Sully is pretty much a younger version of him and cancels any advantage Al brings in a match up vs. Tor.

    If DeMar or Kyle or God forbid both Damar and Kyle can show up against Indiana then I think it should be a fairly one sided match up if we see them in the playoffs.

    The other big component is how the team will play under Nate Macmillan. Have to think that he's a step down from Vogel.

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