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Thread: do you agree with Jack Armstrong about a lack of a physical presence?

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    Super Moderator Axel's Avatar
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    I disagree with the sentiment that toughness is solely an interior issue.

    Perimeter defenders need to be more physical off-ball. Can't let people make open cuts - need to get a body on them. Force them to really fight through space. Our best defenders, Ross, Carroll, Powell, CoJo (in some order) - none of them are very physical. CoJo might be the most physical player we have on the perimeter.

    On-ball is much harder to be physical in this era because of the fouls. But after the shot/pass release you need to establish your presence.
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    Quote Axel wrote: View Post
    I disagree with the sentiment that toughness is solely an interior issue.

    Perimeter defenders need to be more physical off-ball. Can't let people make open cuts - need to get a body on them. Force them to really fight through space. Our best defenders, Ross, Carroll, Powell, CoJo (in some order) - none of them are very physical. CoJo might be the most physical player we have on the perimeter.

    On-ball is much harder to be physical in this era because of the fouls. But after the shot/pass release you need to establish your presence.
    That, and bumping the roll man as the helper. Wings need to crunch the roll man on PnR then recover. Ours typically barely touch the roller, if they even bother.

  3. #23
    Raptors Republic Superstar Puffer's Avatar
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    It would certainly be nice to see the Raps getting physical around the basket. The only Raptors that regularly boxout are JV, Lowry and Paterson it seems like. Maybe I am missing some action here, but it seems like, on the Raptors board, there are always Raptors standing outside of a ring of opposing players in position to grab the ball. If the team expects JV and Bebe etc to run out to the 3 pt line to contest a shooter or pick up the guy that just blew by DeMarr or Cory or Carroll, then somebody else better be boxing out.

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    Quote Axel wrote: View Post
    I disagree with the sentiment that toughness is solely an interior issue.

    Perimeter defenders need to be more physical off-ball. Can't let people make open cuts - need to get a body on them. Force them to really fight through space. Our best defenders, Ross, Carroll, Powell, CoJo (in some order) - none of them are very physical. CoJo might be the most physical player we have on the perimeter.

    On-ball is much harder to be physical in this era because of the fouls. But after the shot/pass release you need to establish your presence.
    Pretty much zero resistance on the perimeter. One simple pick, not even a hard one, and the opposing offense pretty much gets into their set like it was drawn up on the chalkboard.

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    Super Moderator Axel's Avatar
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    Default do you agree with Jack Armstrong about a lack of a physical presence?

    Quote golden wrote: View Post
    Pretty much zero resistance on the perimeter. One simple pick, not even a hard one, and the opposing offense pretty much gets into their set like it was drawn up on the chalkboard.
    I think zero resistance is pretty darn accurate. JV might be the only defender on the team that plays with any physicality. Gone are the JJ, Hayes and Hansbrough of yesteryear.

    We look like the type of soft team that is caught off guard by the physicality of the playoffs and how much the refs allow. That doesn't bode well for another deep spring.
    Heir, Prince of Cambridge

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    Raptors Republic Icon rocwell's Avatar
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    According Sean Spicer, the Toronto Raptors are most physical team in the NBA.

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    When healthy I'm not concered with our big man rotation. Then, it's hard to be next-level tough when your SF rotation has an average height of 6'6.

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    Raptors Republic Rookie danno's Avatar
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    Quote rocwell wrote: View Post
    According Sean Spicer, the Toronto Raptors are most physical team in the NBA.
    I see what you did there ...

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    Raptors Republic Superstar Superjudge's Avatar
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    I didn't hear Jack, mostly because I don't care anymore, but I know what he means when he speaks of "toughness". It's a mentality, or way of being. You hear about it hear and there, sometimes its just old people pissing and moaning, and others, its legitimate. In this case, totally legit. Toronto, along with a bunch of NBA teams lacks the toughness it needs.... 30 years ago players played for the game, for bragging rights, to see who was the best. Now, they play for stats, and contracts, and ad revenue. Guys don't wanna play tough defence, or take a charge, or meet a guy hard in the lane.... they hate it, they see $$$ being lost as a result of lost games due to injury.

    Blame agents, and blame the money thats in the game now... blame what you want, but the fact is, tough, hard as nails ball will win in the playoffs.... but you are playing a dangerous game if you think you can just turn it on in april or may. So do the Raps lack toughness, hell yes they do.

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    Quote Superjudge wrote: View Post
    I didn't hear Jack, mostly because I don't care anymore, but I know what he means when he speaks of "toughness". It's a mentality, or way of being. You hear about it hear and there, sometimes its just old people pissing and moaning, and others, its legitimate. In this case, totally legit. Toronto, along with a bunch of NBA teams lacks the toughness it needs.... 30 years ago players played for the game, for bragging rights, to see who was the best. Now, they play for stats, and contracts, and ad revenue. Guys don't wanna play tough defence, or take a charge, or meet a guy hard in the lane.... they hate it, they see $$$ being lost as a result of lost games due to injury.

    Blame agents, and blame the money thats in the game now... blame what you want, but the fact is, tough, hard as nails ball will win in the playoffs.... but you are playing a dangerous game if you think you can just turn it on in april or may. So do the Raps lack toughness, hell yes they do.
    the rules have changed a lot too which makes it kind of hard to know how much you're allowed to do in terms of physicality. Until the playoffs, when you're allowed to do whatever the fuck you want as long as the opposition's jersey says "Toronto" on it.

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    Quote KHD wrote: View Post
    the rules have changed a lot too which makes it kind of hard to know how much you're allowed to do in terms of physicality. Until the playoffs, when you're allowed to do whatever the fuck you want as long as the opposition's jersey says "Toronto" on it.
    Gonna disagree with the lack of respect from refs complaint or rules issue. Raps have been near the top of the league in drawing free throws for some time now. That's serious respect from the officials..... on offense.

    Problem is, our guards don't seek the same type of contact on defense, such as fighting through screens, or even just being a a pest and staying in front of their man. That's another form of toughness that's well within the rules. The better word for it might be "grit", which is really just playing hard every night on defense. Those teams that do that consistently in the regular season develop a reputation with the refs and get the benefit of the doubt on close calls.

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    Quote golden wrote: View Post
    Pretty much zero resistance on the perimeter. One simple pick, not even a hard one, and the opposing offense pretty much gets into their set like it was drawn up on the chalkboard.
    DD and KL are just not the tough defender, hard nose players you need to defend the primeter. One can even say they are border line SOFT ... You do need the Tony Allen type guys who don't let the guys pass by them.

    This is our problem. People want to point to Inside toughness but once you are beat so easily on the perimeter, then it is hard.

  13. #33
    Raptors Republic Veteran KeonClark's Avatar
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    Have no fear guys, my sources tell me Ujiri is finalizing a 1 year deal with a player option with some mega power forward named "R. Savage"

    11/20/16 Lest we forget - The Sacramento Screw Job.
    We will not go quietly in the night. We will rage against the dying light. We will study every buzzer beater with intensified might, because somethin with the NBA doesn't smell right.

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    We needed toughness. Danny's little army got punked!

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    Quote lewro wrote: View Post
    We needed toughness. Danny's little army got punked!
    IT and Crowder phony tough vs Tucker and Ibaka REAL tough.

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