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Thread: 2017 Off-season

  1. #1
    Raptors Republic All-Star Maury's Avatar
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    Default 2017 Off-season

    We have several key players hitting free agency in Kyle, Pat, and now Serge.

    The upcoming draft is loaded but we lost one of our picks.

    Who gets resigned, do we make any trades, and is casey our coach heading into the 17/18 season?

    Hopefully we don't have to face these sooner than expected.


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    Raptors Republic Veteran KeonClark's Avatar
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    11/20/16 Lest we forget - The Sacramento Screw Job.
    We will not go quietly in the night. We will rage against the dying light. We will study every buzzer beater with intensified might, because somethin with the NBA doesn't smell right.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    Just as an aside, seems like we hear about "loaded" drafts all the time. At the end of the day, a pick in the low-mid 20s isn't going to change a franchise.

    Remember when Dante Exum, Marcus Smart and Julius Randle were considered franchise talents leading up to the 2014 draft? Or Thomas Robinson, Michael Kidd-Gilchrist or Harrison Barnes leading up to the 2012 draft? Every draft is overhyped beyond control.
    Last edited by Nilanka; Wed Feb 15th, 2017 at 11:39 AM.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran KeonClark's Avatar
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    Just as an aside, seems like we hear about "loaded" drafts all the time. At the end of the day, a pick in the low-mid 20s isn't going to change a franchise.

    Remember when Dante Exum, Marcus Smart and Julius Randle were considered franchise talents leading up to the 2014 draft? Or Thomas Robinson, Michael Kidd-Gilchrist or Harrison Barnes leading up to the 2012 draft? Every draft is overhyped beyond control.
    There's usually a gem or 2 after pick 15..kawhi leonard, draymond, kyle lowry, isaiah thomas etc...but I'm too pissed off about the here and now shittiness of this team to dissect that any further
    11/20/16 Lest we forget - The Sacramento Screw Job.
    We will not go quietly in the night. We will rage against the dying light. We will study every buzzer beater with intensified might, because somethin with the NBA doesn't smell right.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar S.R.'s Avatar
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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    Just as an aside, seems like we hear about "loaded" drafts all the time. At the end of the day, a pick in the low-mid 20s isn't going to change a franchise.

    Remember when Dante Exum, Marcus Smart and Julius Randle were considered franchise talents leading up to the 2014 draft? Or Thomas Robinson, Michael Kidd-Gilchrist or Harrison Barnes leading up to the 2012 draft? Every draft is overhyped beyond control.
    Maybe more interesting then the actual late picks in the next couple years will be the decisions they'll have to make re: which ones to keep. Can't keep all the prospects + incoming picks, gonna have to choose which guys to hang onto and which ones to trade for Kevin Durant.
    "Control DeRozan's catch-shoot game. He rarely passes. Defend the ball. Much of what they do reverses to 1 on 1 play." -- Visitor Locker Room Whiteboard, Air Canada Centre, Feb. 26, 2015

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    Quote S.R. wrote: View Post
    Maybe more interesting then the actual late picks in the next couple years will be the decisions they'll have to make re: which ones to keep. Can't keep all the prospects + incoming picks, gonna have to choose which guys to hang onto and which ones to trade for Kevin Durant.
    screw that, trade Lowry, Demar and JV for Westbrook and sign Durant in free agency...boom championship!

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    Raptors Republic Veteran KeonClark's Avatar
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    Quote JawsGT wrote: View Post
    screw that, trade Lowry, Demar and JV for Westbrook and sign Durant in free agency...boom championship!
    We've already got ibaka. Now if can just get james harden to come off the bench. First we need to find kevin Martin and trade him to Houston.
    11/20/16 Lest we forget - The Sacramento Screw Job.
    We will not go quietly in the night. We will rage against the dying light. We will study every buzzer beater with intensified might, because somethin with the NBA doesn't smell right.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Nilanka's Avatar
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    Quote KeonClark wrote: View Post
    There's usually a gem or 2 after pick 15..kawhi leonard, draymond, kyle lowry, isaiah thomas etc...but I'm too pissed off about the here and now shittiness of this team to dissect that any further
    Right, there are hidden gems to be found in every draft. But I don't think there's a tangible reason to treat the 2017 draft any different from previous drafts.

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    Quote Nilanka wrote: View Post
    Right, there are hidden gems to be found in every draft. But I don't think there's a tangible reason to treat the 2017 draft any different from previous drafts.
    Agreed. Or expect any pick, especially outside the top 5, to come in and immediately fill a roster need. Rookies are rarely major contributors.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Maury's Avatar
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    I'm gonna say this is Cory's last season as a raptor. We need the cap room and he's proven to be expendable.


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    Quote JawsGT wrote: View Post
    screw that, trade Lowry, Demar and JV for Westbrook and sign Durant in free agency...boom championship!
    Cause that pairing has proven to win championships in the past....

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    Things are very interesting now with the Ibaka trade. Obviously he was not traded as a rental. I don't think Masai makes the deal if that is the case (as he has said) and there is strong connections between work in Africa and Lowry/Serge sharing the same agent. I think you get Ibaka and Lowry for $50m combined. I think Lowry gets same amount as DeRozan annually ($27m) and Serge gets around $23m (Ryan Anderson got $20m last year so that seems right).

    With those assumptions, you have about $106,000,000 tied up in 11 players: DeRozan, Lowry, Ibaka, Carroll, Yahkob, Bebe, Caboclo, Delon, Siakam, Powell, and FvV.

    The magic number is $122m (or whatever the luxury tax is as determined around July 1st).

    That leaves about $16M for 4 roster spots and the new mid-level will be around $8m.

    I think Joseph and Valanciunas are gone this summer for draft picks (current year possible and future). Joseph is Canadian but once you get past that he is more than expendable. Jonas is great but he doesn't fit the style of play the team desires and, 5 years in, Casey still won't close a game with him. I hope Okafor doesn't end up in New Orleans - I think JV can make a nice impact next to Anthony Davis (and in the Western Conference).

    Patterson is possible to return assuming he is willing to take a small discount, say around $11M per year. He is a Casey fav, apparently loves Toronto, and has turned down more money 3 years ago to stay in a favorable situation. Lightning strike twice?

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    Quote Odin wrote: View Post
    Things are very interesting now with the Ibaka trade. Obviously he was not traded as a rental. I don't think Masai makes the deal if that is the case (as he has said) and there is strong connections between work in Africa and Lowry/Serge sharing the same agent. I think you get Ibaka and Lowry for $50m combined. I think Lowry gets same amount as DeRozan annually ($27m) and Serge gets around $23m (Ryan Anderson got $20m last year so that seems right).

    With those assumptions, you have about $106,000,000 tied up in 11 players: DeRozan, Lowry, Ibaka, Carroll, Yahkob, Bebe, Caboclo, Delon, Siakam, Powell, and FvV.

    The magic number is $122m (or whatever the luxury tax is as determined around July 1st).

    That leaves about $16M for 4 roster spots and the new mid-level will be around $8m.

    I think Joseph and Valanciunas are gone this summer for draft picks (current year possible and future). Joseph is Canadian but once you get past that he is more than expendable. Jonas is great but he doesn't fit the style of play the team desires and, 5 years in, Casey still won't close a game with him. I hope Okafor doesn't end up in New Orleans - I think JV can make a nice impact next to Anthony Davis (and in the Western Conference).

    Patterson is possible to return assuming he is willing to take a small discount, say around $11M per year. He is a Casey fav, apparently loves Toronto, and has turned down more money 3 years ago to stay in a favorable situation. Lightning strike twice?
    casey isn't going to be here after the first round exit this year. highly doubt they're going to make a move because JV doesn't fit a stone-age offence.

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    Quote KHD wrote: View Post
    casey isn't going to be here after the first round exit this year. highly doubt they're going to make a move because JV doesn't fit a stone-age offence.
    Casey is owed $12m after this season for two more years. Personally, I don't think he is going anywhere, unfortunately.

    But with all that said, JV isn't going to be moved because of not fitting a stone-age offense. He is going to be moved because keeping him puts the Raptors with a very large tax bill. The style of play is geared around high usage for Lowry and DeRozan. With the addition and retention of Ibaka, I think the C spot can be manned by Poeltl and Bebe.

    If you can get a lotto pick for JV on draft night and one of Jackson, Tatum, or Isaac are available, I think you have to do it for a few of reasons:
    1) luxury tax implications
    2) star potential of lottery pick
    3) rookie deals are becoming more and more valuable due to bang for the buck.

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    Quote Odin wrote: View Post
    Casey is owed $12m after this season for two more years. Personally, I don't think he is going anywhere, unfortunately.

    But with all that said, JV isn't going to be moved because of not fitting a stone-age offense. He is going to be moved because keeping him puts the Raptors with a very large tax bill. The style of play is geared around high usage for Lowry and DeRozan. With the addition and retention of Ibaka, I think the C spot can be manned by Poeltl and Bebe.

    If you can get a lotto pick for JV on draft night and one of Jackson, Tatum, or Isaac are available, I think you have to do it for a few of reasons:
    1) luxury tax implications
    2) star potential of lottery pick
    3) rookie deals are becoming more and more valuable due to bang for the buck.
    He's damn sure gone if the choice is between Casey or Lowry, which, if they flame out, seems pretty likely.

    All these style of play comments mean little to me considering how badly coached this team is.

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    Raptors Republic Hall of Famer white men can't jump's Avatar
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    Quote KHD wrote: View Post
    He's damn sure gone if the choice is between Casey or Lowry, which, if they flame out, seems pretty likely.

    All these style of play comments mean little to me considering how badly coached this team is.
    Add to that the money they'd have to eat for the rest of Casey's contract is really peanuts to giants like Bell and Rogers. Especially when you add the possible tradeoff of losing Lowry....

    -Keep player who costs a shitload more but helps generate absurd revenues by leading us to playoff basketball
    -Keep cheaper coach and quite possible miss playoffs without Lowry, thus missing out on the playoff revenues every franchise covets

    It's really a no-brainer.

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    Quote KHD wrote: View Post
    He's damn sure gone if the choice is between Casey or Lowry, which, if they flame out, seems pretty likely.

    All these style of play comments mean little to me considering how badly coached this team is.
    Team has been coached badly for a long time yet Masai has given Casey 2 extensions through it all.

    I'll believe Casey gone when I see it.

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    Quote Odin wrote: View Post
    Team has been coached badly for a long time yet Masai has given Casey 2 extensions through it all.

    I'll believe Casey gone when I see it.
    the second MLSE thinks Lowry (and thus playoff / good team $$) might leave, casey will be out the door so fast it'll make your head spin.

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    agreed

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    Quote white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    Add to that the money they'd have to eat for the rest of Casey's contract is really peanuts to giants like Bell and Rogers. Especially when you add the possible tradeoff of losing Lowry....

    -Keep player who costs a shitload more but helps generate absurd revenues by leading us to playoff basketball
    -Keep cheaper coach and quite possible miss playoffs without Lowry, thus missing out on the playoff revenues every franchise covets

    It's really a no-brainer.

    I agree with the premise and I can't emphasize enough how much I'd like Casey canned.

    However, Masai has shown great loyalty to Casey. There is obviously more to the personal and professional relationship than meets the eye to fans.

    Also, there are a lot of trade offs for Lowry in leaving:
    - lower annual raises,
    - starting over at 31,
    - uncertainty

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