Everything 2017 Off-Season

[KeonClark]

Noooo why is he defending Carroll???

Trade value is at an all time low. Slagging him would be idiotic

[Mack North]

Trade value is at an all time low. Slagging him would be idiotic

It was still tough to listen to that, boldfaced lie or not!

[tDotted]

Technically, there are 29 losers every season. So what are we going to do to help our chances of winning a ring?

1. Continue building around good, but not great players.
2. Try and land great players through the draft, and build from there.

Perhaps the 2004 Pistons represent a 3rd option. But I'm willing to write them off as an anomaly, rather than consider them a useful blueprint to team-building.

1) I would argue that unless your team is actually built to make it to the Finals then 'not winning a ring' doesn't really make you a loser. There are other ways to gain success from the season ie. player development, instilling a play style, building culture etc.

2) You might see the 04 Pistons as an anomaly but the 'Tank 4 Ringz' model so many fans propose is probably even less likely than that.

[Nilanka]

1) I would argue that unless your team is actually built to make it to the Finals then 'not winning a ring' doesn't really make you a loser. There are other ways to gain success from the season ie. player development, instilling a play style, building culture etc.

2) You might see the 04 Pistons as an anomaly but the 'Tank 4 Ringz' model so many fans propose is probably even less likely than that.

The conversations boils down to whether or not you can win a ring without a superstar? If you agree that a superstar is needed, how do you get that superstar?

[Nilanka]

"Not continue to pound pound pound..."

"We tried it..."

Wow....

Is that not telling...?

Pound the rock baby!!!

https://twitter.com/JLew1050/status/861969123303206914

"Not continue to pound" - Masai

But I swear we were all about pound the rock?

Could be in reference to the constant pounding of the ball in our predictably stagnant offence. Everyone is guilty of it, DeRozan, Lowry, Cojo, Jonas, etc.

[Apollo]

That usually leads to a car accident

How many times does it happen with someone who knows what they're doing?

[mjt20mik]

Could be in reference to the constant pounding of the ball in our predictably stagnant offence. Everyone is guilty of it, DeRozan, Lowry, Cojo, Jonas, etc.

Good point. We do that a lot.

[tDotted]

The conversations boils down to whether or not you can win a ring without a superstar? If you agree that a superstar is needed, how do you get that superstar?

I don't believe one is 100% necessary for a title.. though I think the 'superstar' moniker is pretty subjective anyway.

[KeonClark]

The conversations boils down to whether or not you can win a ring without a superstar? If you agree that a superstar is needed, how do you get that superstar?

Yes you need a superstar, most likely. But put it this way: the league has say a half dozen superstars right now. Only lebron and durant were chosen ones who went early and lived up to the hype. The others (curry, westbrook, Harden and leonard) were drafted 7, 4, 3 and 15 and we're not expected to be this good. So racing to the bottom is not the only way. Shrewd drafting, player development and good ol fashioned luck is huge

[The Great One]

Yes you need a superstar, most likely. But put it this way: the league has say a half dozen superstars right now. Only lebron and durant were chosen ones who went early and lived up to the hype. The others (curry, westbrook, Harden and leonard) were drafted 7, 4, 3 and 15 and we're not expected to be this good. So racing to the bottom is not the only way. Shrewd drafting, player development and good ol fashioned luck is huge

And LeBron didn't even a championship during his first stint in Cleveland. KD didn't win a ring in OKC. Denver didn't win a championship with Melo.

[Nilanka]

Yes you need a superstar, most likely. But put it this way: the league has say a half dozen superstars right now. Only lebron and durant were chosen ones who went early and lived up to the hype. The others (curry, westbrook, Harden and leonard) were drafted 7, 4, 3 and 15 and we're not expected to be this good. So racing to the bottom is not the only way. Shrewd drafting, player development and good ol fashioned luck is huge

This applies to any strategy, whether tanking, retooling, or pushing all-in. None of it works without shrewd drafting and luck.

[Primer]

Who is the most recent superstar that was drafted?

What level of success has this superstar reached?

These are two questions the tank crowd doesn't seem to be asking themselves.

[DanH]

That was an awesome press conference.

[Nilanka]

And LeBron didn't even a championship during his first stint in Cleveland. KD didn't win a ring in OKC. Denver didn't win a championship with Melo.

KD likely would've won a ring had OKC ownership shelled out the cash to keep that core together.

As for Melo, debatable whether he's considered a superstar. And to clarify, in no way does anyone suggest that landing a superstar is all it takes. You still need to surround the star with secondary/tertiary pieces, and implement a system that fits that group well. Not easy, by any means.

But my argument is, why attempt steps 2, 3, 4, 5, etc. of the team-building process, if you haven't completed step 1 (all-world talent acquisition).

[S.R.]

I don't believe one is 100% necessary for a title.. though I think the 'superstar' moniker is pretty subjective anyway.

It's a complex debate, but just to add you don't just need "a" superstar, looking at the history of NBA championships it's one of just 2 or 3 superstars in their primes at any given point who end up winning 90% of the championships. Forget a Bargnani, you can get an Anthony Davis, a Chris Paul, an Andrew Wiggins, etc. out of the draft and it's still not enough superstar to get it done.

I'm not averse to tanking, it's just also a slim chances prospect. I don't think it's time for it yet, if you have other options give those a shot first.