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  • #31
    Shaolin Fantastic wrote: View Post
    That all bench unit is not going to work against good teams. Fool's gold right now.
    Yeah but we blew out two bad teams, so it's good that our starters didn't need to play more minutes. I would be perfectly happy seeing more blowouts against bad teams that leads to more rest for our main guys.

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    • #32
      Bledsoe would fit in so well

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      • #33
        With our young bench straight gettin' it done it, it's easy to see how great we could potentially be...if we could hit our 3s.

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        • #34
          Masai's roster already flexing its superb depth. The only question mark is sharpshooting.

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          • #35
            Shaolin Fantastic wrote: View Post
            That all bench unit is not going to work against good teams. Fool's gold right now.
            Another inaccurate proclamation
            9 time first team all-RR, First Ballot Hall of Forum

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            • #36
              KeonClark wrote: View Post
              Another inaccurate proclamation
              The young guys are so much fun to watch, knowing how they've put in the work and been developed in house by the organization, I swear it's like watching your kids grow up seeing these guys produce in game situations.

              Mix all that in with a quick-trigger Lowry 3 or a deep turnaround DeMar J and those moments are almost jarring, "Oh yeah, there's the old Raptors I've been watching for the past 4 years!" It's underrated how much this team has actually changed since last season.

              Masai's a great GM, I hope eventually we get to see him working with a top 10 player.
              "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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              • #37
                Idk, gotta agree with Shaolin here. This all-bench unit is fine and dandy now, but when starting players' minutes increase in the playoffs, and the other team gameplans for you, we're gonna get our asses kicked. I certainly wouldn't want a lineup of Poetl-CJ-Wright-Vanvleet-OG out there against a bench unit led by Giannis or Wall/Beal even for 2 minutes.

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                • #38
                  Ball wrote: View Post
                  Idk, gotta agree with Shaolin here. This all-bench unit is fine and dandy now, but when starting players' minutes increase in the playoffs, and the other team gameplans for you, we're gonna get our asses kicked. I certainly wouldn't want a lineup of Poetl-CJ-Wright-Vanvleet-OG out there against a bench unit led by Giannis or Wall/Beal even for 2 minutes.
                  Who's saying the all bench mob should be used in the playoffs though? And you're not agreeing with him. The bold is the opposite of what Shaolin said - "Fool's gold right now."
                  If we knew half as much about coaching an NBA team as we think, we"d know twice as much as we do.

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                  • #39
                    Shaolin Fantastic wrote: View Post
                    That all bench unit is not going to work against good teams. Fool's gold right now.
                    That all-bench unit is not likely to blow out good teams with deep benches like ours. But...

                    * They defend tenaciously.
                    * On the defensive end, they have length, speed, and multiple players who can defend multiple positions.
                    * While they don't have any all-star level players, they have players who could start on some teams (Miles has previously started, and neither Poeltl nor Siakam has looked out of place when injuries resulted in them starting for us).

                    Will some of them cool down? One could argue that Miles, due to his recent 3 point shooting, already has. Even so, our bench is going to give low-talent or low-motor bench units fits, and assuming that they continue to play full out - will require even the better benches of the league to show up with their A game.

                    Our bench is unlikely to win us a playoff series by themselves, but I'm confident that they won't lose us a series either, and if they enable us to keep minutes down for Derozan/Lowry/Ibaka over the course of the year, we should be in better shape for the playoffs than we've ever been with this group.

                    I do hope they continue to keep playing like they have, though; it's so much fun to watch.

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                    • #40
                      The all-bench unit has had all the trouble scoring I expected it would, which should make it a non-feasible lineup long term, at only 98 ORTG. The insane thing is how incredible they've been defensively - they are posting an 85 DRTG over 50 minutes played (they are the most used lineup on the team because the starters keep changing). That's crazy. And definitely not something I (or I'd bet many others) foresaw with a lineup stocked with young players, including a rookie, an undersized PG, and a shooting specialist who is mediocre defensively.

                      Now, if they can be that good defensively consistently, hey, more rest for Lowry is great. I'd be shocked if they kept it up though. Then again, I wouldn't be shocked if they managed a ~100 DRTG (which is really good), and if they keep the offence at ~100 as well, that's a lineup you can use to eat minutes against most teams.
                      twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                      • #41
                        TheWaterboy wrote: View Post
                        ...
                        * They defend tenaciously.
                        * On the defensive end, they have length, speed, and multiple players who can defend multiple positions....

                        Our bench is unlikely to win us a playoff series by themselves, but I'm confident that they won't lose us a series either, and if they enable us to keep minutes down for Derozan/Lowry/Ibaka over the course of the year, we should be in better shape for the playoffs than we've ever been with this group.
                        This. From what they have shown I think it is safe to say you have a high energy, high motor, lengthy and tenacious group. Even as rotations shorten in the playoffs Casey has guys he can call on to wear down members of the opposing team while shortening the minutes of the starting five leading up to and even during the playoffs. I think it can safely be said that uninjured Lowry, DeMar, Ibaka and JV would be important in any playoff success. The back half of the rotation is going to be key in that at the same time they will force the opposing team to expend high levels of energy.

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                        • #42
                          Ball wrote: View Post
                          Idk, gotta agree with Shaolin here. This all-bench unit is fine and dandy now, but when starting players' minutes increase in the playoffs, and the other team gameplans for you, we're gonna get our asses kicked. I certainly wouldn't want a lineup of Poetl-CJ-Wright-Vanvleet-OG out there against a bench unit led by Giannis or Wall/Beal even for 2 minutes.
                          This is putting the cart so far ahead of the horse.

                          Nobody would suggest going as deep into the rotation as they are now in the playoffs, basketball 101 is you don't do that and no one is thinking that would happen - this is a weird assumption to make.

                          Giving the young guys minutes now is part of their multi-year development, a plan which this organization is executing really, really well. From that perspective, you're giving them as much responsibility and as many minutes as they can handle in NBA game situations - that's why there's no Patterson, CoJo, or Carroll on this team this year (they tried to keep Tucker). That is where they are at in their development right now, and it's awesome that they've been able to handle it so far - a lot of people thought they would be a weakness heading into the season but instead they've been a great success so far and finding some way to argue against that with a "Yeah but!" just seems kind of weird.

                          Any time the 5 young guys can't handle a game situation, Kyle or DeMar will be on the floor. That adjustment has happened already. And once the playoffs role around, the rotation will likely cut down to 7-8 deep as it does for everybody in the NBA. In the meantime, it's great to see Casey, who for the past several seasons refused to let the bench play without one of Lowry or DeMar running the unit at ALL times, is trusting the young guys to play together and *it's working*. A significant positive this early in the season. Who knows how long it will sustain? Hopefully all year, but sure it's not guaranteed. They're young.
                          "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                          • #43
                            S.R. wrote: View Post
                            This is putting the cart so far ahead of the horse.

                            Nobody would suggest going as deep into the rotation as they are now in the playoffs, basketball 101 is you don't do that and no one is thinking that would happen - this is a weird assumption to make.

                            Giving the young guys minutes now is part of their multi-year development, a plan which this organization is executing really, really well. From that perspective, you're giving them as much responsibility and as many minutes as they can handle in NBA game situations - that's why there's no Patterson, CoJo, or Carroll on this team this year (they tried to keep Tucker). That is where they are at in their development right now, and it's awesome that they've been able to handle it so far - a lot of people thought they would be a weakness heading into the season but instead they've been a great success so far and finding some way to argue against that with a "Yeah but!" just seems kind of weird.

                            Any time the 5 young guys can't handle a game situation, Kyle or DeMar will be on the floor. That adjustment has happened already. And once the playoffs role around, the rotation will likely cut down to 7-8 deep as it does for everybody in the NBA. In the meantime, it's great to see Casey, who for the past several seasons refused to let the bench play without one of Lowry or DeMar running the unit at ALL times, is trusting the young guys to play together and *it's working*. A significant positive this early in the season. Who knows how long it will sustain? Hopefully all year, but sure it's not guaranteed. They're young.
                            As much as it pains me to say this, Casey deserves a lot of credit in (1) preparing the kids for the limelight, and (2) trusting them with the responsibility. If I were coaching this team, I wouldn't dream of trotting out a lineup of Wright, Fred, OG, Siakam and Poeltl. But they've more than held their own, rewarding Casey for believing in them.

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                            • #44
                              Nilanka wrote: View Post
                              As much as it pains me to say this, Casey deserves a lot of credit in (1) preparing the kids for the limelight, and (2) trusting them with the responsibility. If I were coaching this team, I wouldn't dream of trotting out a lineup of Wright, Fred, OG, Siakam and Poeltl. But they've more than held their own, rewarding Casey for believing in them.
                              Another place to give casey credit: the old "players become worse when they're here other than DD and lowry" thing. A quick look around the nba other than Capri pants 2.0 in BK, has Patterson, biyombo t ross, lou will all struggling to have the same impact they did on a 56 win raptor team
                              9 time first team all-RR, First Ballot Hall of Forum

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                              • #45
                                If OG continues to develop, and Casey sticks with two full line-ups, bringing OG to the starting unit might provide good overall balance.

                                Lowry, Derozan, OG, Ibaka and JV - OG brings the D that Lowry and DD show only periodically, but OG needs to work on the 3 to spread the defence for the reset of unit

                                Wright, Norm, Miles, Siakam and Poeltl - puts Norm back in a more comfortable spot coming off the bench. Together the unit is solid defensively and well balanced offensively.

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