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Thread: Dwane Casey's inability to draw up crunch time plays

  1. #41
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    "Our clutch time ORTG this year ranks 21st (overall offence is 5th)."

    I mean all samples are small at this time of year, but this sample is particularly small. Not as bad as Barolt's very handpicked Demar clutch time stat in his main page story, but still probably too small to have any sort of meaning.

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  3. #42
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    The ISO issue isnt crunch time but almost half a quarter. Dont mind Demar taking the last shot in a close game. Dont like him taking that shot after 5 consecutive minutes of 5 on 1

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    Raptors Republic Starter BadDinosaur's Avatar
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    Quote Other Scott wrote: View Post
    "Our clutch time ORTG this year ranks 21st (overall offence is 5th)."

    I mean all samples are small at this time of year, but this sample is particularly small. Not as bad as Barolt's very handpicked Demar clutch time stat in his main page story, but still probably too small to have any sort of meaning.
    It has little meaning when it comes to projections, but it reflects perfectly of what has transpired so far this season.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Scraptor's Avatar
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    Clutch time per nba.com is the last five minutes of the fourth within 5 points. We're 23rd in the league on offence, 19th on D, and 24th net.

    Contenders in the top 10: Warriors 1, Spurs 4, Cavs 8.
    Celtics are 9th, Rockets 23rd and the Thunder are 30th with an amazing -49.8 rating.

    By way of comparison, we were 8th in the NBA last year. Three of our most clutch guys (Tucker, Joseph, Patterson) are gone.
    http://stats.nba.com/players/clutch-...mID=1610612761

    Still, sample size is small.

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    Raptors Republic Starter BadDinosaur's Avatar
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    Quote Scraptor wrote: View Post
    Clutch time per nba.com is the last five minutes of the fourth within 5 points. We're 23rd in the league on offence, 19th on D, and 24th net.

    Contenders in the top 10: Warriors 1, Spurs 4, Cavs 8.
    Celtics are 9th, Rockets 23rd and the Thunder are 30th with an amazing -49.8 rating.

    By way of comparison, we were 8th in the NBA last year. Three of our most clutch guys (Tucker, Joseph, Patterson) are gone.
    http://stats.nba.com/players/clutch-...mID=1610612761

    Still, sample size is small.
    Interestingly enough, JV had the best defensive rating of any Raptor in the clutch last year (that is still on the roster and with a relevant sample size). And it's a sample of 30 games in his case. I mean, he kind of always looked better in the clutch to me on D than over the entire game, but I didn't realize he was that good. One more thing the coaching staff needs to look at when looking for a closing lineup.

  9. #46
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    Quote BadDinosaur wrote: View Post
    ... One more thing the coaching staff needs to look at when looking for a closing lineup.
    They have so much other stuff to look at I can pretty much guarantee they'll never get around to looking at that.

  10. #47
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    Quote Other Scott wrote: View Post
    "Our clutch time ORTG this year ranks 21st (overall offence is 5th)."

    I mean all samples are small at this time of year, but this sample is particularly small. Not as bad as Barolt's very handpicked Demar clutch time stat in his main page story, but still probably too small to have any sort of meaning.
    Yeah, that's why I quoted the past two full seasons as well - the offensive drop off is a trend, though not to the degree we've seen so far this year.

  11. #48
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    Quote Scraptor wrote: View Post
    Clutch time per nba.com is the last five minutes of the fourth within 5 points. We're 23rd in the league on offence, 19th on D, and 24th net.

    Contenders in the top 10: Warriors 1, Spurs 4, Cavs 8.
    Celtics are 9th, Rockets 23rd and the Thunder are 30th with an amazing -49.8 rating.

    By way of comparison, we were 8th in the NBA last year. Three of our most clutch guys (Tucker, Joseph, Patterson) are gone.
    http://stats.nba.com/players/clutch-...mID=1610612761

    Still, sample size is small.
    Quote DanH wrote: View Post
    Yeah, that's why I quoted the past two full seasons as well - the offensive drop off is a trend, though not to the degree we've seen so far this year.
    This is the thing - this team in the clutch about meets my expectations for this roster. They've had an inflated (imho) ORTG the last couple of years through drawing fouls, a short-sighted strategy that everybody knows is not dependable when the whistles go away - which happens in crunch time and in the playoffs. Here's a shocker - that's when this team's offence drops off, which we all knew already.

    The only new frustration this year is there was supposed to be some sort of self-awareness of that fact around the team, which led to adjusting the offence for this season. We've seen that played out some games and not so much some games, but it's early. But we definitely haven't seen it in clutch time yet, that's playing out the way it always has, which is okay but not great. If the new offence is worth doing, it's not worth doing in the first 3 quarters and not the 4th - arguably the 4th and the playoffs are where it's needed most. The first 3 quarters of regular season games were fine otherwise (very good, actually). Just plain silly to adjust the play there and not elsewhere.

    Anyway, end of the day the most this team can aim for is top 10 in these situations. Those teams mentioned above have MVP calibre players in Durant, Curry, Lebron, and Kawhi, and there's a top 5 GOAT coach in Popovich. The Raptors are not going to be competing in that group with Casey and DeRozan, no matter what they do to the playbook.
    "Control DeRozan's catch-shoot game. He rarely passes. Defend the ball. Much of what they do reverses to 1 on 1 play." -- Visitor Locker Room Whiteboard, Air Canada Centre, Feb. 26, 2015

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    Raptors Republic Veteran JimiCliff's Avatar
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    The problem, of course, is that in the playoffs, every quarter is the fourth quarter (and the fourth quarter is, like, the twentieth quarter).
    "Stop eating your sushi."
    "I do actually have a pair of Uggs."
    "I've had three cups of green tea tonight. I'm wired. I'm absolutely wired."
    - Jack Armstrong

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    Quote JimiCliff wrote: View Post




    The problem, of course, is that in the playoffs, every quarter is the fourth quarter (and the fourth quarter is, like, the twentieth quarter).
    Play offence in the 4th like you do in the first 3 quarters and play defence in the first 3 quarters like you do in the 4th and all the problems are solved. Shut this thread down, we're done here.
    "Control DeRozan's catch-shoot game. He rarely passes. Defend the ball. Much of what they do reverses to 1 on 1 play." -- Visitor Locker Room Whiteboard, Air Canada Centre, Feb. 26, 2015

  16. #51
    Raptors Republic Icon rocwell's Avatar
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    Quote JimiCliff wrote: View Post




    The problem, of course, is that in the playoffs, every quarter is the fourth quarter (and the fourth quarter is, like, the twentieth quarter).
    I don't look at Raptors early-season stats anymore... Remember those days when Raps were the best offensive team in the history of the NBA? Good times. Ha.

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  18. #52
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    Quote JimiCliff wrote: View Post




    The problem, of course, is that in the playoffs, every quarter is the fourth quarter (and the fourth quarter is, like, the twentieth quarter).
    11/20/16 Lest we forget - The Sacramento Screw Job.
    We will not go quietly in the night. We will rage against the dying light. We will study every buzzer beater with intensified might, because somethin with the NBA doesn't smell right.

  19. #53
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    Quote KeonClark wrote: View Post
    I'll dumb it down for you next time Keon
    "Stop eating your sushi."
    "I do actually have a pair of Uggs."
    "I've had three cups of green tea tonight. I'm wired. I'm absolutely wired."
    - Jack Armstrong

  20. #54
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    Quote S.R. wrote: View Post
    Those teams mentioned above have MVP calibre players in Durant, Curry, Lebron, and Kawhi, and there's a top 5 GOAT coach in Popovich. The Raptors are not going to be competing in that group with Casey and DeRozan, no matter what they do to the playbook.
    Yep. But I think there is value in doing what you say you're going to do, and playing the right way, even if the outcome is ultimately meaningless in the near term.

    We are basically locked in for three years. Assuming we hang on to Poeltl and Norm and OG, do we want them to develop the same bad habits or get locked into the same scenarios? Will Poeltl become a spectator like JV? Will Norm and OG emulate the iso ball-pounding of DeMar?

    That's what bugged me so much when Masai dialled back the culture change comments to just "a little bit"/"not a drastic change". It said that we weren't really serious about change. And the latest ride-or-die comments just reinforce that.

    If we know we're not competing for a championship then at least play some smart, aesthetically pleasing basketball, and lay the groundwork for our supposed winning culture. We're capable of it, because we saw it earlier in the season.

  21. #55
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    Quote Scraptor wrote: View Post
    Yep. But I think there is value in doing what you say you're going to do, and playing the right way, even if the outcome is ultimately meaningless in the near term.

    We are basically locked in for three years. Assuming we hang on to Poeltl and Norm and OG, do we want them to develop the same bad habits or get locked into the same scenarios? Will Poeltl become a spectator like JV? Will Norm and OG emulate the iso ball-pounding of DeMar?

    That's what bugged me so much when Masai dialled back the culture change comments to just "a little bit"/"not a drastic change". It said that we weren't really serious about change. And the latest ride-or-die comments just reinforce that.

    If we know we're not competing for a championship then at least play some smart, aesthetically pleasing basketball, and lay the groundwork for our supposed winning culture. We're capable of it, because we saw it earlier in the season.
    powell is already emulating the ball-pounding of Demar, and Poeltl is probably going to once again be one of the least passed-to players in the NBA.

    This team plays ugly, individualistic basketball and they're not even that good at it anymore.

    in three years they will have next to nothing to build upon if they keep dwane casey.

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