Game #45: Toronto Raptors 109 - Minnesota Timberwolves 115

[MixxAOR]

Damn, Lowry wanted that one bad. Delon was good, DeRozan pretty good, just needed someone other than Lowry to hit a couple late and they could have had it.

Does Miles only get 20 points or go 1-7? Is there nothing in between?

according to Pacers fans yeah that's pretty much him. He's like Ross.

[Maury]

according to Pacers fans yeah that's pretty much him. He's like Ross.

I would say he’s more consistent than Ross (lol). He’s also more of a steadying presence especially for the young guys. They’re always looking for him and everyone on the team clearly believes he can make any shot they can get for him. Gross definitely lost the trust of the team sometimes especially in the playoffs. Down 3 with 5 seconds left and I think most people here would be pretty comfortable getting CJ a shot and living with the result. The same cannot be said for Tross.

[MixxAOR]

I would say he’s more consistent than Ross (lol). He’s also more of a steadying presence especially for the young guys. They’re always looking for him and everyone on the team clearly believes he can make any shot they can get for him. Gross definitely lost the trust of the team sometimes especially in the playoffs. Down 3 with 5 seconds left and I think most people here would be pretty comfortable getting CJ a shot and living with the result. The same cannot be said for Tross.

I don't know. He's pretty all over the place imo. Defensively might be worse than Ross

[G__Deane]

The refs were unbelievably biased but at this point, not sure what you can do. It's blatant and the NBA is OK with it or mandates it. And this was two teams with no superstars to get the regular biased calls.

But the Raps gave up 17 defensive rebounds to the Spurs followed by 15 to the Timberwolves. No one boxes out or will rebound except JV and Lowry. Nogueira needs to see only limited minutes or garbage time imo. Poeltl needs to play but he's so friggin soft still.

Hating the loss with so many days off now.

[Demographic Shift]

In this till the end....Everyone has bad nights and tonight the crew of Scott Foster had one of those ...So too did the Raps defensive rebounding have a bad night.... Raps did battle through the Thibs sliding defensive scheme that trapped and doubled DD and Kyle to an extent.. but with at least 30% of the calls they might have negated that with a win......But have a good look as thats what they are going to see in the playoffs for defense... for the whistle.. who knows even quarter to quarter what these guys are going to do.

On to Atlanta...

Good news here is that there are 3 days between games.... Practice time....

Kalamian and Casey have to deterimne if its effort or the scheme that is causing the Raps to give up so many defensive boards and the resulting second chance points that are gashing them over the past few games. You can adjust the scheme.. and use the carrot and stick of minutes to amp up the effort to box out....

Do they really need another shooter ?
They are out there..... Mirotic... Lou Williams.... Marvin Williams are available.... and if you make a move for one of them.... it will most likely be a roster player as they don't have the low firsts they can trade right now....

Lou Williams is an expiring deal..... Mirotic makes some sense as it relegates Siakam a rung down... but I think his Team Option contract vests if he is dealt and has one more year beyond this one at 12M. Marvin the Martian would be 2 more years beyond this one at 15M$ so he is likely a no go....

Is shooting enough an issue to make a deal at the deadline...or do they stand pat on the trade front ..and focus on fixing the rebounding with scheme tweaks or a swift kick in the ass with a hard boot and soldier on ?

[JawsGT]

really disappointed with this loss. We aren't winning enough against the best teams for my liking, although I should only be concerned with Boston and Cleveland I guess. That being said, if the refs allowed JV to play last night, I think we win that one. Blows my mind that a guy who can get o boards like Poeltl doesn't seem to be able to box out and protect the defensive glass. And a high motor guy like Siakim should be able to get more defensive boards too IMO. Gotta body up, but the bright side is these guys are young and got both the opportunity and time to learn and improve.

[golden]

Damn, Lowry wanted that one bad. Delon was good, DeRozan pretty good, just needed someone other than Lowry to hit a couple late and they could have had it.

Does Miles only get 20 points or go 1-7? Is there nothing in between?

We need to use Miles like Korver coming off screens as a 1st option more often, instead of mostly drive and kick stuff. Also, somebody has to tell Miles that he is never, ever, ever allowed to shoot the ball after even 1 dribble. Miles after 1 dribble is either a brick or a turnover. It's uncanny how his shooting drops off when he puts the ball on the floor.

And I know Lowry had a great game, but it does feel like he's starting to regress back into 'not trusting my teammates' way of thinking. Hopefully, it's just him trying to make the all-star team and he gets back into the team ball movement mindset again.

[The Great One]

Rebounding and shooting are becoming a major concern.

This team could use another shooter. CJ Miles is starting to remind me of T-Ross. Inconsistent shooter who takes a lot of ridiculously tough 3's.

I also don't understand why Siakam has the green light to shoot 3's? he is becoming a liability out there. There's a reason why he's always wide open.

[Cross]

..Blows my mind that a guy who can get o boards like Poeltl doesn't seem to be able to box out and protect the defensive glass. And a high motor guy like Siakim should be able to get more defensive boards too IMO...

offensive rebounding is basically about taking blind spots of defenders, reading the game and quickness. Motor and long arms are bonus.
defensive rebounding is more about positioning, boxing-out, center of gravity in lower part of body and brute strengh. and it's team issue - if guards/wings are allergic to boxing-out it ain't gonna end well anyway.

that's why orebs do not mean drebs by default

[golden]

Rebounding and shooting are becoming a major concern.

This team could use another shooter. CJ Miles is starting to remind me of T-Ross. Inconsistent shooter who takes a lot of ridiculously tough 3's.

I also don't understand why Siakam has the green light to shoot 3's? he is becoming a liability out there. There's a reason why he's always wide open.

Vince.

[Mitch P]

Trade or stand pat? Depends on whether you think this is our best chance to go to a final. It might be.....Boston and Philly are projecting to get a lot better next year and in subsequent years. Cleveland is very vulnerable. This would be complete sacrilege on this site but...do you trade an OG or Siakam or Poeltl for a Lou Williams? Probably not OG and Siakam because both have improved our wing defence immensely but you would have to offer something that another team might see as a future rotation player. Throw in CJ Miles or Bebe or FVV.

That was me playing Devil's advocate. I personally would rather hang on to the youngsters, watch them develop and hope that we can somehow stay ahead of Boston and Philly. But I could see the other argument

[JawsGT]

Trade or stand pat? Depends on whether you think this is our best chance to go to a final. It might be.....Boston and Philly are projecting to get a lot better next year and in subsequent years. Cleveland is very vulnerable. This would be complete sacrilege on this site but...do you trade an OG or Siakam or Poeltl for a Lou Williams? Probably not OG and Siakam because both have improved our wing defence immensely but you would have to offer something that another team might see as a future rotation player. Throw in CJ Miles or Bebe or FVV.

That was me playing Devil's advocate. I personally would rather hang on to the youngsters, watch them develop and hope that we can somehow stay ahead of Boston and Philly. But I could see the other argument

The Raps are 4-8 vs the following to this point: GSW, HOU, SAS, MIN, OKC, BOS, CLE, WAS and MIA. Including the raps, thats the 10 best teams in the league right now. Over the remainder of the season, we have 12 more games against 7 of those teams, as we are done with GSW and SAS. Even split of home and road games.

That 4-8 record just isn't good enough IMO, and we would have to go 8-4 in the remainder just to break even (obviously). Personally, I'd like to see a winning record against those teams by seasons end but that will be tough.

So, it does look like this team could use some more help. And I tend to view this problem exactly like you do. And I wouldn't want to trade for a rental of any sort. I wouldn't be willing to sacrifice assets unless the player coming back will be here for multiple seasons and clearly makes us better where we are presently weak.

That being said, I am in the no-trade camp. As good as BOS seems to be, I don't fear them even with the return of Hayward. Of course, BOS could make numerous moves to make them even more formidable than even their present roster if healthy, but you don't make moves based on that possibility. Philly, I think, will need another full season or two before they become a legitimate threat, if at all. And I have alot of confidence in our young guys to continue to improve, so I'm willing to play this season out as is, see where we go in the playoffs and take it from there. But it's difficult for me to believe that Siakim, Wright, Poeltl, OG and Norm can't improve enough to minimize some of our weaknesses. Even Demar, I believe, hasn't had his best season yet and I do think JV has some room to grow as well.

[S.R.]

Several of those losses to top 10 teams were quite close.

[Shaolin Fantastic]

Yep that record against top teams is highly problematic.

I really hope we're not just flat-track bullies, where we can easily beat anyone who's worse than us but can't get wins against the teams at or above our level.

Still think this team needs to go get another heavy hitter to make a serious run at the finals.

[The Great One]

Reminds me of the team that got swept by the Wizards. 50+ win team but had a losing record against winning teams.

Raps need a shooter a rebounder. Is Drummond still on the block? there's no way they would trade Drummond for JV straight up now. But what about JV + another youngster for Drummond?