Will Toronto Do Better As A TEAM With No Stars?

[Apollo]

"I think Amir Johnson has a lot of the same stuff Keon Clark showed." Except that AMir isn't a cronic marijuana user like Keon. Keon retired in INdiana so he can golf and get high.

I'm talking about Keon's game and how his game was in Toronto. I never mentioned anything about after he left Toronto. I was referring to the Raptors of early last decade and I apologize if that wasn't clear enough.

Keon wanted money and soon as he got some left.

If somebody else offered Amir Johnson more money than Colangelo he probably would have left. It's the nature of the beast. Colangelo prevented that from happening by giving Amir a contract no other GM would probably dare to offer.

Okafar wouldn't be a bad pick up but would mean AMir and Davis get less playing time plus it would kill our cap space.

Davis and Johnson can't guard centers. They need a true center and they're not going to accomplish anything of significance until they get that even if it's not Okafor.

What cap space are you speaking of? The Raptors are capped. It benefits the Raptors' on court product to be far closer to the luxury tax threshold than the salary cap.

If the raps feel fine using weems or derozan as back up three then I think we could get away with current roster.

You think those two can handle the likes of Melo and Deng down low on the block?

Let the young guys play. THe only reason Chris Bosh got so good was because he played alot and was aloud to play through his numerous mistakes.

I agree but when he came in they threw him out there at center, a position he had no business playing and no one knows the long term implications of him taking those beatings early on in his career. DeMar is fine at the 2 and he's going to get lots of PT there. Sonny is a role player and he's never going to be a star. I think people are shooting for the moon with him similar to how people were looking at JaMario Moon after his first seasons. I swear I was reading in some places(other forums) how he was going to be as good as Gerald Wallace. Right.

[Nick]

I can't believe how everybody is all over Apollo for wanting to get Okafor. Its so unbelievably clear that none of you nay-sayers have ever watched Okafor play before. You can't just say somebody sucks because you feel like it, its funny how bad some of your bball knowledge is. Oak-Tree would be an absolutely perfect centre for this team. He's a double-double guy, play's great defence, and is modest. Could of of you geniuses tell me why he would be a bad fit again?

[vinnie_paz]

Emeka Okafor is a PF trapped in a SF Frame is nowere close to being good & id say its an insult to antonio davis to say there alike.

okafor is 6'10 and 255lbs

in 15 seasons davis only averaged more than 9.9 rbds ONCE

in 6 season okafor has averaged more than 9.9 rbds FIVE TIMES.

dondadda, dont play video games and then bring that bullshit knowledge that u have here...

[Frankthetank]

Davis and Johnson can't guard centers. They need a true center and they're not going to accomplish anything of significance until they get that even if it's not Okafor.

"What cap space are you speaking of? The Raptors are capped. It benefits the Raptors' on court product to be far closer to the luxury tax threshold than the salary cap. "

Three years 42 million is alot for a undersized centre with a back problem. And that would kill our cap room for three years compared to chandlers one year 13 million.

"You think those two can handle the likes of Melo and Deng down low on the block? "
Are melo and deng back up three's? Plus thats why Kleiza was signed to match up against big 3's.

"If somebody else offered Amir Johnson more money than Colangelo he probably would have left. It's the nature of the beast. Colangelo prevented that from happening by giving Amir a contract no other GM would probably dare to offer."
The reason BC jumped the gun is because AMir wasn't a restricted free agent so amir would have got a similar contract from another team look at Matthews (utah and portland). I agree young Clark is alot like AMir but I see a desire to become really good that Keon didn't have.
Sonny Weems could become a defensive stopper similar to tony Allen but has the potential to be as good or slightly better offensively as Ronald Murray. SO your right Weems is a role player but he could potentially become one of the best role players ever seen in a raptors uniform.

[vinnie_paz]

A guy who hasn't missed a game in three years, defends and posts a career 13 and 10 sucks? He will do more to earn his $11M salary this season than most guys making that around the league.

the man also is averaging 1.8 blocks a game for his career...

so 13 pts 10 rbds n 1.8 blocks...

yea u dumb raptor fans, okafor is trash !

noah is way better with his 8 pts 8 rbds 1.3 blocks...

[Frankthetank]

Okafor definetly isn't trash. He's a solid centre and if he came in a package for Paul and Okafor then i would be game.
A good trade would be calderon, evans, two first round picks for Paul and Okafor. Probably never happen.

[DoNDaDDa]

okafor is 6'10 and 255lbs

in 15 seasons davis only averaged more than 9.9 rbds ONCE

in 6 season okafor has averaged more than 9.9 rbds FIVE TIMES.

dondadda, dont play video games and then bring that bullshit knowledge that u have here...

he may be listed at 6 10 but i highly doubt it. seems like your the video game player. AI has been listed at 6 1 for the longest time but do u actually think he is.

every team okafor has gone to has been worse then b4 he got there. hes not good, any player can pad stats on a bad team, ask CB4 or wilt the stilt.

if your mearly going to go off a stat sheet then u must think bargs if a fantastic center then aswell.

ive been mearly stating my opinion & have in no way tryed to make this personal & ur comment is just plain ignorent.

[blackjitsu]

Wow, why are you dragging Wilt into this? You are right Okafor is a tad under 6-9

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/...or-3810/stats/

but I disagree a bit with the whole padding stats thing. Your still competing against NBA
defenders, rebounders, etc., from opposing teams. Your numbers may spike a bit but a
good rebounder is going to be a good rebounder no matter the quality of team. Scoring
on a bad team can go either way depending if you are a guard, etc., but you can assess
that looking at FG%.

Okafor is a solid, not spectacular, slightly undersized 5. On a team with long Forwards who can give him weak side help I think he'd do well. If you look at the 4's we are considering Amir, Bargs, Davis, etc., I think he would do well.

[KakashiPrince]

no stars?...hmm how about the 2003 championship Detroit ?

[Apollo]

Three years 42 million is alot for a undersized centre with a back problem. And that would kill our cap room for three years compared to chandlers one year 13 million.

Where are the back problems? Yeah, in first first couple seasons but he hasn't missed a game in three years and I've read nothing and heard nothing that's suggested he has been suffering with back problems since. People do heal you know.

Cap room is overrated. How much money would you like to see the Raptors spend on a team? The cap number or $15M more than that? Which is better for the team, spending less or spending more? Teams seek out massive cap space when they want to totally rebuild. Colangelo doesn't operate that way and that's not even touching on the topic of the Raptors needing to outbid everyone else a great deal to land free agents.

Okafor definetly isn't trash. He's a solid centre and if he came in a package for Paul and Okafor then i would be game.
A good trade would be calderon, evans, two first round picks for Paul and Okafor. Probably never happen.

You couldn't even swing that in a video game.

he may be listed at 6 10 but i highly doubt it. seems like your the video game player. AI has been listed at 6 1 for the longest time but do u actually think he is.

every team okafor has gone to has been worse then b4 he got there. hes not good, any player can pad stats on a bad team, ask CB4 or wilt the stilt.

if your mearly going to go off a stat sheet then u must think bargs if a fantastic center then aswell.

ive been mearly stating my opinion & have in no way tryed to make this personal & ur comment is just plain ignorent.

Height is something that can give a player an edge over his opponent but at the end of the day talent and IQ prevails. Okafor is not small. He's big but not a 7 footer. He's proven to be a very good defender at the center spot. He's strong, smart and tough. If size determined things Ben Wallace would have no rings and Shawn Bradley would be a hall of famer.

Okafor is bigger than Antonio Davis and Davis went to an all-star while representing Toronto and was one of the main reasons they took Philly to game 7 of round two. I remember no one suggesting Davis couldn't play center because of his size because Davis obviously could play center very well at his size. I thought it was obvious that Okafor is a good center.

[Apollo]

no stars?...hmm how about the 2003 championship Detroit ?

Ben Wallace started at center for the east that year. Big Ben started the next year as well. Two years after that Big Ben, Sheed and Billups all made the game. They had at least three stars. Not flashy but stars none the less.

[mo-sales]

I support trading for Okafor. What is the idea in principle? Just to snag him with the TPE? I wonder if BC could get a pick as well.

I suppose with Paul on the block, Collison is likely to stay. A scenario I have been predicting for months by the by.

If the raps grabbed Okafor, what do they do with Bargs? Shifting him to the four makes the most sense, but then there is a serious logjam at the PF and I don't think Bargs should be relegated to backup center minutes. I would rather develop Amir and especially Davis over throwing out a Bargs/Okafor front court.

Trading Bargs now makes little sense as his value is likely only to go up once the season starts as he for better or worse is the number one option. Regardless of whether the raps win or lose with him getting more touches, his numbers will increase along with his value.

I like the idea of trading Bargs for a point guard as he seems to be the raps most expendable player and if BC could Kahn Kahn into giving him up I would do jumping jacks. Unless there was a move to bring in an all star caliber point guard though, trading for Okafor doesn't make the most sense as he is 28, soon to be regressing all the while making more money and the raptors are at least a year away from anything other than a 1st round exit.

[RaptorsFan4Life]

This thread needs a poll....

[Apollo]

I support trading for Okafor. What is the idea in principle? Just to snag him with the TPE? I wonder if BC could get a pick as well.

I mentioned earlier if Paul is leaving then a rebuild is imminent and how I read they would try to handcuff Okafor to Paul. They would not need to do that if someone else came along offering expiring contracts. The Raptors have enough in Evans and Banks, enough to make the numbers work. Dealing Okafor for expirings gives them more freedom in moving Paul. I'm sure the Raptors might have to sweeten the pot but the base would be the expiring contracts.

[vinnie_paz]

ive been mearly stating my opinion & have in no way tryed to make this personal & ur comment is just plain ignorent.

umm yea ok... go back and read

all i said was :

okafor is 6'10 and 255lbs

in 15 seasons davis only averaged more than 9.9 rbds ONCE

in 6 season okafor has averaged more than 9.9 rbds FIVE TIMES.

dondadda, dont play video games and then bring that bullshit knowledge that u have here..."

how can listing facts be ignorant... you probably use that word everytime you dont agree with someone....

i like how you completely disregard the rebounding facts that prove okafor has been a better rebounder than davis in a era where the league is more fast paced and rebounds are harder to come by.

back in antonio davis' days, the leading rebounders were getting 15+ rbds a game...

but you're right IM ignorant b/c I USE FACTS...