Everything Bargnani

[heinz57]

But how is he a good three point shooter? His career average is 37.4%, 36.2% this season. People keep saying he's a good three point shooter but the numbers don't back up the statement.

people need to stop thinking of him as a 3 pt shooter, and more as a finesse big.

[pistol pete]

But how is he a good three point shooter? His career average is 37.4%, 36.2% this season. People keep saying he's a good three point shooter but the numbers don't back up the statement.

It doesn't matter, as long as opponents think he's a threat from 3p range, thus adjusting their defence, thus allowing him other options.

[Apollo]

How the crap is Kevin Love taking 46% of his shots from beyond the arc while hauling down more than double the number of rebounds that Andrea does? He must run right into the paint after chucking it from 3pt range...

That was his efficiency. I edited the post to make it more clear. He has however taken more attempts than Bargnani this season.

It doesn't matter, as long as opponents think he's a threat from 3p range, thus adjusting their defence, thus allowing him other options.

It matters because it's not correct to call him a good three point shooter. He's not.

[ab7]

That was his efficiency. I edited the post to make it more clear. He has however taken more attempts than Bargnani this season.



It matters because it's not correct to call him a good three point shooter. He's not.

Well i rather have the big one that he is dropping at the end of games than shooting it more to have a better %
funny thing is i dont think that any other big man have a play for them to shoot a tree in the cluch

by the way its easy to have a better % when u shoot it more i like is overal game

[Apollo]

funny thing is i dont think that any other big man have a play for them to shoot a tree in the cluch

Yes, most teams don't look to their big men in the clutch but is that a defense for Bargnani or just a general statement? Look at the success stories around the league. You'll rarely see Duncan, Garnett or Gasol take the last shot. Shaq's number was rarely called with seconds left either.

[Roughhide]

I definately agree with Barg not being a great three - point shooter, most of the threes he hits are the ones that the team needs to pull themselves out of their defensive slumps at the end of games that give them the slight edge - up on their opponent. In the midst of games though, his three point shooting is spotty and all is washed over for critics if he makes one important, game - clinching three. He has improved vastly though with his creativity off the bounce and he has perfected pump - fake foul draw giving him 2 free points a few times a game.

[yertu damkule]

i guess it partly depends on one's definition of 'good.' his 3pt% is above average, even if it's just barely so. i don't have a problem defining his 3pt shooting as 'good,' as long as 'good' doesn't become 'great.' i also tend to think people consider his 3pt% as 'better' than it really is because there's usually an unspoken '...for a big man' caveat at the end of 'bargnani is a good ('great?') 3pt-shooter.'

his 3pt shooting (attempts) are down marginally over years past, but the issue i have is most people seem to assume that it's because he's taking more shots in the post (or at least close range). the truth is that he's actually taking more mid- & long-range 2's (the least efficient shot in the game), while only slightly more post attempts (i.e. shots at rim or inside 10ft combined ; he's actually taking fewer shots at the rim than last year, but almost double the # of attempts inside 10ft) than in the past. so, not only is his 3pt shooting (from an efficiency standpoint) only slightly above average, he's eschewing these shots in favour of less efficient shots (long 2s; although the raw FG% from that distance is better, the TS% is much worse - if out of 100 3's attempted, he's hitting ~37%, that equates to 111 pts; at 44% from long 2 range, the same # of shots is only 'worth' 88 pts).

IMO, he's actually better off taking 3's than long 2's (currently, he's taking over 50% more long 2's than he is 3's), even if he's only a 'good' 3pt shooter.

[mcHAPPY]

I have to disagree. Bargnani is a good 3 point shooter. He is slightly above average. 36/37% is hardly bad. It is not great but not bad - it is good. If you want to consider he is 7ft tall and his shot has to be at least respected and therefore providing the opportunity to draw the opposing team's bigs outside the key, I call that great.

For me Bargnani's evolution is fun to watch. He is not a great help defender, he shows flashes of solid 1-on-1 defense, he is not a great rebounder but he is starting to get a few in traffic and going after it with 2 hands. These are things we all know and he is never going to be any of them - so acceptance is recommended.

His offense is becoming incredible - no exaggeration. He is really mixing it up - inside, post, mid-range, off the dribble, 3's.

He seems to be the only person who can stop himself when he doesn't bring the effort every night and I 100% admit that to be a problem. Luckily those games seem to becoming fewer. He is showing signs of swagger. For people to continue to ride the guy means they are pure haters - and that is fine but just make sure you are upfront about it. For all the talk about progression of DD, there has been a progression of Bargnani as well. He has certainly taken his game up a level.

He is not a franchise player. He is not even a bonafide 1st option right now but that might be debatable if he continues to improve over the last 40 games of the year as he has the first 40. He is a good piece to build the team around though. The maturation of Davis and acquiring a star 2-way wing player (which has never been here since VC left although he didn't play D) would do wonders for this team.

Anyways my ramblings are over. If this makes me a Bargs lover, so be it.

[yertu damkule]

first off, don't be ashamed of supporting a player.

i agree with most of what you've written, though i do have a problem with some of your linguistics. when you (and others) say/write things like 'bargnani isn't a great rebounder/defender' (bolds/italics added), it skews the picture somewhat. no one is demanding or expecting that he be GREAT at either, but the fact remains, he's quite bad at both. not good, not average, and maybe not below average, but bad. is he improving at either...i dunno, to be honest. there are glimpses & moments when i think he is, but they aren't sustained. even last night, he played a fairly well-balanced game (esp. for him), but he really didn't become engaged defensively & on the glass until late. i know that he is who he is, and that part of us, as fans, is that we'll more than likely just have to accept that, but as you point out, how much is it an ability thing, and how much is an effort thing? is the 'cost' of barganani's offensive production his lack of average-good defense/rebounding?

lastly - i'd ask in what areas, other than in FGA/game & PPG, has bargnani shown real, measured improvement? i agree, to a degree, that he's expanded his offensive repertoire (somewhat), but given he's been the main beneficiary of additional touches/USG%, i would hope that would have been the case. i'm not sure there's been much of an improvement in the areas of his offensive game that are, IMO most important for his position. as i mentioned above, i don't actually mind that he's a 3-pt shooter, and would actually prefer he shot more of those, at least if it means taking less long 2s.

[WJF]

If a player shoots 50% from the field they have a good fg%.

50% from 2 results in 10 points scored for every 10 shots attempted, if you shoot 36.2% from 3 you score 10.86 points per 10 shots taken....so 36% is good.

[mcHAPPY]

no one is demanding or expecting that he be GREAT at either, but the fact remains, he's quite bad at both. not good, not average, and maybe not below average, but bad. is he improving at either...i dunno, to be honest. there are glimpses & moments when i think he is, but they aren't sustained. even last night, he played a fairly well-balanced game (esp. for him), but he really didn't become engaged defensively & on the glass until late. i know that he is who he is, and that part of us, as fans, is that we'll more than likely just have to accept that, but as you point out, how much is it an ability thing, and how much is an effort thing? is the 'cost' of barganani's offensive production his lack of average-good defense/rebounding?

I deleted a good bit of what you wrote to focus on this part here.

I disagree he is a bad rebounder and a bad defender because he has shown he can do those things at least average.

This leads us to the real issue: his motivation/effort/intensity is not there night in and night out. It is getting better but you cna't depend on him. He has shown he can rebound and defend when he wants to. This is why he is not a franchise player or even a guy to totally build around. He is a piece for the Raptors, and a solid piece at that, but he needs other pieces to make up for his weaknesses. Unfortunately if he doesn't bring it night in and night out it won't matter who is around him as he'll be a liability.

One thing I have totally given up on is his help defense. There is no one worse in the league.

[Beagle]

He's certainly good at threes compared to the rest of the team, and they gotta keep that streak alive, right?

[jrdyck]

CAREER
Ray Allen - 39%
Reggie Miller - 39%
Dale Ellis - 40%
Peja Stojakovic - 40%

4 of the greatest 3-point shooters in NBA history are only 2-3 percentage points ahead of Bargnani's career average of 37%. Proof that you don't need to shoot 40-45% to be considered a 'good' shooter.

[Multipaul]

King Bargs dethroned the false Kings on Sunday, along with Prince Dero! Life is good without Queen Bosh!

[Multipaul]

Bargs is showing the whole arsenal now. He schooled the Kings inside and out. It should be noted it was his three ball that sealed the win for us ironically. I agree though, his 3 ball right now is a great tool to keep defenses honest. I enjoyed his back to back tre's against NYC at MSG which shook the ground a bit in "the mecca". Wish we won that game.