Everything Derozan

[Snooch]

I've made no argument that anyone should trust my talent and contract valuations. Simply an argument about using the market as a measuring tool when said market is actually a flawed sub-market - the market valuation of NBA players is probably pretty good overall (even if I do disagree with some skill valuations I can understand them). The issue is when you introduce a scenario where the market is skewed for a particular sector of player. MLE is the example I gave - most non-minimum players in the league have their value determined by a pool of 10-12 teams each summer who have cap room. But a small subset of players, instead of being awarded the value they would typically receive from a limited cap-supply scenario, get paid more than they would typically be valued at simply because there is an artificial market created where 30 teams can offer up to the average salary or so.

Same goes for next summer. If every year from now on was going to be a 20M jump in the cap, if it was the new market, then I wouldn't disagree that the market value of the players this summer should line up with the valuation of those players. But it's not the case. Two summers down the road we'll actually see cap shrinking, and the market value for players will plummet. But even a return to typical cap growth will see the usual market valuation return, along with the correlation between player value and market value.

That said, we should not ignore the impact a screwed up temporary marketplace can have on prices. If you were to buy an overpriced shovel during the gold rush, no one would blame you. But we are in an interesting position - we know the gold rush is not going to last very long. And we know that due to the reality of player contracts, this would be more like buying a house and getting a mortgage (with a much higher than usual interest rate, locked in). We aren't paying a one time fee. We are agreeing to buy that $500 shovel 4 or 5 years in a row, even though we know the gold rush ends 2 years from now.

Fantastic analagy, one only needs to switch it to over 25% of all your money and instead of a shovel its a fork.

you can still dig for gold with a fork, but, you get the point.

[Puffer]

Everyone in the Yukon knew that eventually the easy gold would disappear, just as it did in every other gold rush in North America in the 1800's. There was a strong incentive to get in there NOW and find a decent claim and prove up on it. The NBA will be around for a long time. And, as Dan rightly points out through analogy without actually saying so, there will be many teams regretting the deals they made over the next two years. They will be hamstrung for 2-3 years after the glitter has dulled. Teams with flexibility and players on good deals will be in a great position to improve. The only teams that may not be brutally hurt will be those that don't care about paying luxury tax...L.A., NY, 2-3 others.

I like what Masai is doing. I TRUST what Masai is doing. Good value contracts. Good character players. Quality players at each position. Young potential in the line to develop. He is going to be able to make the right moves when good deals come along.

[golden]

Fantastic analagy, one only needs to switch it to over 25% of all your money and instead of a shovel its a fork.

you can still dig for gold with a fork, but, you get the point.

Actually, you never really "own" players, so the housing analogy should probably be a rental/lease market. Demar is a beach-front lot a few blocks north of the high rent district. He's been under renovation and coming available for lease, but we're not quite sure if he'll become a trendy spot or not. LOL.

[thead]

jesus christ we even argue the semantics of analogies in this thread.

[92TillInfinity]

jesus christ we even argue the semantics of analogies in this thread.

Love that Scanners avatar.

[007]

jesus christ we even argue the semantics of analogies in this thread.

we're in too deep!!!

[golden]

jesus christ we even argue the semantics of analogies in this thread.

LOL. And then we will argue against arguing the semantics of analogies in this thread.

It is, after all, the endless Demar Derozan thread..... where arguing about arguing happens.

[Snooch]

Actually, you never really "own" players, so the housing analogy should probably be a rental/lease market. Demar is a beach-front lot a few blocks north of the high rent district. He's been under renovation and coming available for lease, but we're not quite sure if he'll become a trendy spot or not. LOL.

He has a view of the water, he certainly isnt "beachfront" you would need to walk 7 blocks to get to the beach.

Instead he is a "beach house" styled home built in the center of town.

[Doc]

I still feel this way about this thread:

[JWash]

Well if KD says he wants to come here regardless of whether DeRozan is on the team (which I doubt would happen)...

I will personally pack DD's bags

[mcHAPPY]

I still feel this way about this thread:

I'm confused because that looks like it feels awfully good.

[CalgaryRapsFan]

I'm confused because that looks like it feels awfully good.

Maybe this thread has gone to the dogs? Or it's a result of it being the dog days of summer? Or we should all throw DeRozan a bone and stop this DeBate? That's all I got...

[S.R.]

I still feel this way about this thread:

lmao damn dogs.

Honestly with the talent developing at other positions, DeMar's impact could be replaced by a Tyreke Evans or Monta Ellis type of player if that's what you want. DD's better than those guys, but I have a feeling he's going to cost disproportionately more and the team would be better off with a player of Tyreke or Monta's calibre and re-distributing the leftover cap space to other positions. Alternatively, you don't even need 18-22 ppg from the SG spot and you can have more of a specialist at that position - Danny Green, JJ Redick, Kyle Korver, etc. have held down that spot on very successful teams recently.

The Markieff Morris discussion brought up a good point that there already really isn't room for more usage in the starting unit, and this team definitely still needs a talent upgrade (a player who will need the ball) at some point. Just due to usage, efficiency, and cost, out of the current starters I'd prefer to replace DeMar (or at least "lose" him to make cap and usage space for a better player). That being said, Masai is accumulating good young prospects and I'm not sure how long Lowry will be healthy for - he looks like a guy who could start breaking down sooner rather than later (especially if he's used like last year). This could be a team that ends up peaking after both Lowry and DD are done here.

[S.R.]

I'm confused because that looks like it feels awfully good.

I'd give it a try and report back but I'm currently in the office....

[mcHAPPY]

lmao damn dogs.

Honestly with the talent developing at other positions, DeMar's impact could be replaced by a Tyreke Evans or Monta Ellis type of player if that's what you want. DD's better than those guys, but I have a feeling he's going to cost disproportionately more and the team would be better off with a player of Tyreke or Monta's calibre and re-distributing the leftover cap space to other positions. Alternatively, you don't even need 18-22 ppg from the SG spot and you can have more of a specialist at that position - Danny Green, JJ Redick, Kyle Korver, etc. have held down that spot on very successful teams recently.

The Markieff Morris discussion brought up a good point that there already really isn't room for more usage in the starting unit, and this team definitely still needs a talent upgrade (a player who will need the ball) at some point. Just due to usage, efficiency, and cost, out of the current starters I'd prefer to replace DeMar (or at least "lose" him to make cap and usage space for a better player). That being said, Masai is accumulating good young prospects and I'm not sure how long Lowry will be healthy for - he looks like a guy who could start breaking down sooner rather than later (especially if he's used like last year). This could be a team that ends up peaking after both Lowry and DD are done here.

Good points.

An all-star caliber player, or dare I dream, superstar from the Knicks-Nugget bulge, er, pick will certainly help this team long term.