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Thread: How do we fix our defense?

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    Default How do we fix our defense?

    Right now it's our biggest problem. The offense is fine ranked 4th and we're keeping turnovers to a minimum (3rd least per game) so that's not the issue. We're ranked 24th defensively per basketballreference and 22nd on NBA.com. We've regressed back to our 2014-15 levels on that end.

    How do you guys think we can fix it? Surely it can't all be attributed to losing Biyombo? It seems like our defense at the point of attack has gotten worse though and we're getting absolutely killed in pick and roll situations leading to a lot of easy baskets at the rim or wide open threes when we're forced to scramble.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar Scraptor's Avatar
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    I'm not sure what's going wrong. I did look up the rim protection stats on stats.nba.com and Jonas is getting crushed in the middle. Of the 54 players defending 5 or more fga at the rim per game, Jonas is 46th in FG% allowed. But I think that is partly because he is left on an island a lot. I know last year we were one of the worst teams in keep-in-front %, meaning we were allowing a lot of penetration from the perimeter. This leaves Jonas having to defend two men at once, and he's never sure whether to leave his man or fully contest the ball handler. That said, his numbers aren't all that different from last year, so something else must be going on.

    I thought maybe it had something to do with the young guys, but our best three DRPM guys are Lucas, Jakob, and Pascal weirdly enough. So basically I'm no help.

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    Raptors Republic Superstar special1's Avatar
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    It's starting to become clear. Biz did much more than a lot of people gave him credit for. His offense sucked but he was a great defender for us.

    Our offense is fine (we're like top 4).... It's our defence that's letting us down. Our guards remain the same.....but one thing is missing and that's a defensive Center to clean up the mess. That's the truth.

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    Raptors Republic Starter omgsomuchpotential's Avatar
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    Quote special1 wrote: View Post
    It's starting to become clear. Biz did much more than a lot of people gave him credit for. His offense sucked but he was a great defender for us.

    Our offense is fine (we're like top 4).... It's our defence that's letting us down. Our guards remain the same.....but one thing is missing and that's a defensive Center to clean up the mess. That's the truth.
    No Bismack seems to be the most logical assumption. Or maybe it's the departure of the defensive specialist Andy Greer? It could also be DeMar concentrating his all attention on the offensive side, because's he's not the type of player who could sustain such beastly offensive numbers while also giving his all on the defensive side. Or maybe it's Lowry starting to decline physically, or Carroll not fully recovering from his injury (he's also 30 years old btw). There's really tons of possibilities here, or maybe even a combination of few.
    Last edited by omgsomuchpotential; Tue Nov 22nd, 2016 at 09:19 AM.

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    It could be Greer but Casey was hired as the defensive coach that won the Mavs title. I think you need a rim protector behind Kyle and demar. Bebe is the +- king but we've lost recently when he's played bad or had a baby.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Barolt's Avatar
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    Everyone's going to point at JV, or the lack of Bismack, but... numbers don't lie.

    JV's DRtg on-court: 108.0. off: 104.0.

    Our defense is clearly better with him off the court. Is there anyone with a bigger spread?

    Powell on-court: 108.4, off: 105.2.

    Better when he's off the court, but we can do better.

    Joseph on-court: 110.4, off: 103.1.

    We're getting warmer.

    DeRozan on-court: 107.4, off: 101.7.

    What about when DeMar and Cory are on the floor together? 117.1 DRtg. DeMar and Powell? 111.6.

    27 2-man units have played more than 100 minutes for us this season. Those are the only 2 over 110 DRtg. When Norm, CoJo and DeRozan are all 3 on the floor(a 21 minute sample size) it's a 133.2 DRtg.
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    Raptors Republic Starter omgsomuchpotential's Avatar
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    The thing with JV is that he's not a defensive center. He's an offensive minded center who's underutilized on that end. And if that's what the coach wants it's fine. But it makes for an awful fit between him and this roster. You'd be way better off just trading him for a guy who fits that defensive minded role better, as you're not getting nearly 100% out of JV as it is now.

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    Raptors Republic All-Star Just Is's Avatar
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    Quote omgsomuchpotential wrote: View Post
    No Bismack seems to be the most logical assumption. Or maybe it's the departure of the defensive specialist Andy Greer? It could also be DeMar concentrating his all attention on the offensive side, because's he's not the type of player who could sustain such beastly offensive numbers while also giving his all on the defensive side. Or maybe it's Lowry starting to decline physically, or Carroll not fully recovering from his injury (he's also 30 years old btw). There's really tons of possibilities here, or maybe even a combination of few.
    Bingo.

    It's what scared me the most in the off-season.
    "My biggest concern as a coach is to not confuse winning with progress." - Steve Kerr
    "If it's unacceptable in defeat, it's unacceptable in victory." - Jeff Van Gundy
    "We Ride with Lowry. We Die with Derozan" - Golden

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Barolt's Avatar
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    There have been 68 minutes played this season with JV on the floor, without DeMar out there according to nbawowy.

    97.0 DRtg in those minutes. 116.3 ORtg.

    I'm not saying DeMar should be traded to make space for JV. Not saying that at all. I am, however, saying that maybe their minutes should be staggered.
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    Raptors Republic Veteran Barolt's Avatar
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    Also, and here's the really fun one:

    Lowry, DeRozan, Carroll, Patterson and JV has played 48 minutes together, and has a 93.9 DRtg in those minutes.

    It's Patterson(again).
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    Raptors Republic All-Star Mess's Avatar
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    They're not going to fix it playing against Houston, that's for sure. I bet it will magically look better after they play Mil, Phi and Memphis.
    Two beer away from being two beers away.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran planetmars's Avatar
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    Bioyombo could have helped a bit, but our points in the paint defense is right in the middle.. right at 15th in the league. But having a defense center can help alleviate the stress on the guards to play tighter so that they don't give up as many 3 opportunities.

    Ultimately though I think this is mostly due to their schedule and this should normalize a bit over the next 10-15 games. I don't think we'll ever get to a top 5 defense, but if we could get into the top 10 that should help for the playoffs.

    Not sure what's up with CoJo lately but he's not the guy we saw last year. And if we want to move into that top 10 defensive team he's the guy that needs to improve the most in my opinion.

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    A shooting guard's play on the defensive end isn't going to catapult a defense from top 10 to bottom 10. The suggestion that this is on DeRozan is pretty insane if you ask me. Using small minute samples of particular lineups isn't really going to tell us anything of substance.

    The Andy Greer point is a good one. I think Casey also struggles to get the team defending at a high level without an extremely mobile rim-protecting big in defense.
    Last edited by Lupe; Tue Nov 22nd, 2016 at 10:08 AM.

  17. #14
    Raptors Republic Veteran Barolt's Avatar
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    Quote Lupe wrote: View Post
    A shooting guard's play on the defensive end isn't going to catapult a defense from top 10 to bottom 10. The suggestion that this is on DeRozan is pretty insane if you ask me.

    The Andy Greer point is a good one. I think Casey also struggles to get the team defending at a high level without an extremely mobile rim-protecting big in defense.
    I really don't understand this idea that a guard can't kill your defense. Offenses are creative nowadays, and can be very good at attacking at the point they want to.

    If an offense continually manipulates switches to get a bad defensive guard as the player they're attacking, why can't that be the point that hurts the defense?

    I'm not saying JV is a great rim protector, but why is it on him if he constantly has to play 1v2 in the paint because our guards let their man by and didn't help onto his man?
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    Raptors Republic Veteran MixxAOR's Avatar
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    Do we foul a lot? And do we allow too many 2nd chance opportunities?

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    Quote Barolt wrote: View Post
    I really don't understand this idea that a guard can't kill your defense. Offenses are creative nowadays, and can be very good at attacking at the point they want to.

    If an offense continually manipulates switches to get a bad defensive guard as the player they're attacking, why can't that be the point that hurts the defense?

    I'm not saying JV is a great rim protector, but why is it on him if he constantly has to play 1v2 in the paint because our guards let their man by and didn't help onto his man?
    It's very simple really. We've seen many teams win titles with weak or average defense on the wings or in the backcourt, but not many do so with average defense in the frontcourt.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran Barolt's Avatar
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    Quote MixxAOR wrote: View Post
    Do we foul a lot? And do we allow too many 2nd chance opportunities?
    We're 27th in the league in fouls/game, but that's a pretty small margin. We give up 23.2 fouls per game, the Pelicans give up 20.1/game and they're 11th.

    We're middle of the pack in DRB%, so we do ok cleaning our own glass. Interestingly, the two Raptors with the biggest difference in terms of on/off court DRB% aren't big men, it's Kyle Lowry and Terrence Ross.
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    Quote MixxAOR wrote: View Post
    Do we foul a lot? And do we allow too many 2nd chance opportunities?
    Yes we're fouling a lot, 4th most in the league at 23.2 personal fouls per game. And we're not great on the defensive glass either, rank 20th there, but we're about middle of the pack in terms of giving up offensive boards. Good spot. I don't think these are the biggest issues, but they definitely don't help you on the defensive end.

    What's scary to me is that we hardly ever turn over the ball but we are so bad defensively. That means our half-court defense is essentially trash.

  22. #19
    Raptors Republic Veteran Barolt's Avatar
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    Quote Lupe wrote: View Post
    It's very simple really. We've seen many teams win titles with weak or average defense on the wings or in the backcourt, but not many do so with average defense in the frontcourt.
    I'd argue we haven't seen many weak defenders at all on championship teams, and if any it's almost never more than 1 on the court at a time. I'm assuming you're referring to Kyrie, last year, because other than him and maybe Steph I can't think of any weak defensive guards playing on recent championship teams. Kevin Love and Dirk Nowitzki won 'chips as big men recently though, and neither of them is exactly a defensive stalwart.
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    Raptors Republic Superstar tDotted's Avatar
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    I was going to make a thread about this. We play so goddamn loose on the perimeter so guys are getting to the paint at will and you have to scramble just to recover. Last year this team was one of the very best at defending inside the arc (5th). Down to 25th this season..

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