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The case for Rudy Gay to the Raptors: Heisley speaks to rumours (277)
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MangoKid wrote: View PostWould you trade Valanciunas to Milwaukee for Mike Dunleavy, Larry Sanders and the #12 pick?
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MangoKid wrote: View PostWould you trade Valanciunas to Milwaukee for Mike Dunleavy, Larry Sanders and the #12 pick?
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MangoKid wrote: View PostIt's the same premise. You're talking about giving up 50 cents to the dollar.
it isn't going to be a basketball decision. it will be kids and picks to get rid of millions of dollars.
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AJ360 wrote: View PostIf we were trying to get out of Valanciunas' burdensome contract and the fanbase had turned on him AND we performed worse in the playoffs with him AND that was the best offer, I might.
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MangoKid wrote: View PostOkay then, since you put it that way, the equivalency of that is trading Bargnani to Orlando for Earl Clark, Daniel Orton and he #19 pick. Some fans would support it, others would not, but in the end, we'd be getting 2 young players and cap space. But the value doesn't match up.
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MangoKid wrote: View PostOkay then, since you put it that way, the equivalency of that is trading Bargnani to Orlando for Earl Clark, Daniel Orton and he #19 pick. Some fans would support it, others would not, but in the end, we'd be getting 2 young players and cap space. But the value doesn't match up.
I won't deny the raptors would win this trade from the talent point of view, but they are surrendering a lot of assets including flexibility, which is why in my opinion, a trade involving the 8th pick and 2 young assets would be a fair deal.
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Matt52 wrote: View PostMango: what team could provide Memphis with a return better than what Toronto could offer?
I will say this though - the Grizz would be better off trading Randolph than Gay. Solid 4's are easier to find than solid-star swingmen.
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Am I the only one that is underwhelmed with the Gay and Iggy trade scenarios?
I get that Colangelo needs to save his job and will probably give up some young assets to do so... but I thought we were rebuilding to develop a perennial playoff team that competes for championships. Neither Gay nor Iggy do this!! I like the guys and would selfishly like to see Gay on this team next year, because it brings instant gratification... but both Memphis and Philly are trying to IMPROVE their championship chances by REMOVING the guys we apparently are interested in? On any big market team these type of players would be considered a piece of the puzzle... not by any stretch THE piece. Boston a couple years ago used their young assets to acquire Garnett and Ray Allen... two future hall of famers. We are using our young assets to acquire... Rudy Gay (whose win share % is comparable to guys like Thaddeus Young). Here are his numbers:
Can't embed table so here is link
Matt, I totally agree with your argument and believe these are the type of guys that Colangelo is looking at, but I am just disappointed in the results of waiting for these last couple years. Our #8 pick could land the 8th pick in the 2006 draft, a draft in which Andrea went first and a draft that was not considered strong. We are trading for proven young talent that MIGHT be an all-star on our team.
Signed,
"small market team" bluesLast edited by The Coach; Sun Jun 3, 2012, 11:43 AM.“Be more concerned with your character than your reputation, because your character is what you really are, while your reputation is merely what others think you are.”
― John Wooden
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MangoKid wrote: View PostI will say this though - the Grizz would be better off trading Randolph than Gay. Solid 4's are easier to find than solid-star swingmen.
Rudy is the whipping boy in Memphis which matt mentioned in his original post. Add the fact that in the 2011 playoffs without Rudy they were in game 7 of the west semis and this year they didn't make it through the first round with Rudy and he's overpaid by an owner known to be frugal... It becomes obvious why - rightly or wrongly - Rudy would be the player on the block.
Which brings us back to BC wanting to make big moves, the Grizz looking for cap relief from Rudy and matt's trade idea.
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MangoKid wrote: View PostI don't get into the habit of conjuring up trades. You get caught up in it, you convince yourself that it's best for the franchise and when it doen't happen or the player of your affection goes elsewhere, there's either A: a lot of heartache or B: a lot of blaming/flaming the General Manager of your team because they didn't complete the trade you had conjured up.
I will say this though - the Grizz would be better off trading Randolph than Gay. Solid 4's are easier to find than solid-star swingmen.
A lot of Memphis fans will disagree with your statement on trading Randolph. The other issue with Randolph is what can he bring back in a trade? The idea of a solid 4 being easier to find than a solid swingman, if true, is something other teams will also be aware of. In trading Randolph the Grizzlies need to find a team that can live with his personal and injury history, his contract, and his age.
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The Coach wrote: View PostAm I the only one that is underwhelmed with the Gay and Iggy trade scenarios?
I get that Colangelo needs to save his job and will probably give up some young assets to do so... but I thought we were rebuilding to develop a perennial playoff team that competes for championships. Neither Gay nor Iggy do this!! I like the guys and would selfishly like to see Gay on this team next year, because it brings instant gratification... but both Memphis and Philly are trying to IMPROVE their championship chances by REMOVING the guys we apparently are interested in? On any big market team these type of players would be considered a piece of the puzzle... not by any stretch THE piece. Boston a couple years ago used their young assets to acquire Garnett and Ray Allen... two future hall of famers. We are using our young assets to acquire... Rudy Gay (whose win share % is comparable to guys like Thaddeus Young). Here are his numbers:
Can't embed table so here is link
Matt, I totally agree with your argument and believe these are the type of guys that Colangelo is looking at, but I am just disappointed in the results of waiting for these last couple years. Our #8 pick could land the 8th pick in the 2006 draft, a draft in which Andrea went first and a draft that was not considered strong. We are trading for proven young talent that MIGHT be an all-star on our team.
Signed,
"small market team" blues
I agree with everything you said on Iguodala.
As for Gay, the issue with Memphis is too many eggs in one basket (Gay-Conley-Randolph-Gasol) and an owner who refuses to go in to the luxury tax. If Memphis went in to the tax, a trade would be a non-issue because they could resign the free agents they have while using their exceptions to address the backup PG and C.
When looking at what Boston did with Garnett and Allen, the Celtics acquired those guys when they were both 32 years of age. Gay is just 26 in August and I do think (and was a big part of the case for Gay) that he can still get better - especially on the defensive end - with a coach/teacher/motivator like Casey. In 6 years time, people might have a different view on Gay... they might not too as it is an unknown.
As for trading the #8 pick, it is not an easy decision by any means but nothing is guaranteed on the career potential of a draft pick. Just as he could become an all-star, he could be a total bust.
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