Ideal Roster For Next Season? Vince Carter Involved?

[octothorp]

The challenge with the thread right now is that everything is going to depend on who shows they can play at a high level in the playoffs... not only the starters but the role-players. Overall, I'm okay with a low-turnover year, since summer of 2015 is where there will be the opportunity to make real changes.

I'd be okay with either of Vasquez or DeColo as backup. Vasquez is the superior player but I wouldn't be prepared to offer him much more than his qualifying offer. Then grab an understudy in the draft who can spend a bit of time in the d-league.
I do think there will be the opportunity to draft a solid SF with our draft pick, and to me that would be the best use of the pick right now. (Though I'm totally open to any superior player who falls to us.)
Bigs rotation can stay the same, although a cheap, serviceable big body would really help. Nobody catches my eye on the UFA list for this year, but a big, solid college senior as a second-rounder could help (and also spend time in d-league when not needed).


Lowry / [Vasquez or DeColo based on playoffs and contracts] / [Payton / Carson / Smith / Napier]
DeRozan / Fields
Ross / [Warren / Anderson / Grant / McDaniels / Hood] / Novak
Amir / Patterson / Hansbrough
JV / Hayes / [Hammons / Austin / Young / Bachynski]

[OldSkoolCool]

Problem with this is that if Lowry goes down, we are screwed at pg.

Not really, I think De Colo can do just as good a job running the point as Vasquez (if not better). Our third string takes a hit but if the proposed rookie wing were able to take some of the ball handling duties from Stone I think we will be in an average situation.

Explain your rationale in trading DD for a pick to grab Vonleh.

Absolutely.

Vonleh is in my opinion the draft sleeper. He is a high energy player who is also extremely talented. He is a very good defender and rebounder that has great physical tools. He has a back to the basket and a face up game and is an unselfish player. I project that over the course of his career Vonleh will be better than DD will be (with me not being biased), this is due to the complete game that Vonleh has as well as his position. Talented, two-way, high energy posts with great physical tools are solid long term investments. He also has the tools to be a part of an inside out game that I want to be implemented with this team rather than the guard dominated play we see now.

Also consider Ross, who is currently out of position at the SF and is occasionally getting punished due to his lack of bulk (and he should not get bigger, stay speedy - hey great nickname, speedy). Ross demands starters minutes as well as DD so we have a bit of a problem as our wings are undersized to guard one of the positions, I like Ross' skill set more so it is DD that is getting cut. Also DD has very good trade value right now.

TL;DR - DD has the value to trade into draft for Vonleh, Ross has ability to replace DD at SG in the starting lineup.

Also I highly doubt Vince Carter will come here after many fans still harboring ill feelings just so they could goat him every time he has a bad game, not to mentioned he did say that he wants to resign with Dallas in the offseason:


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2...tter-next-year

Let sleeping dogs lie.

I agree, the possibility for complete and utter implosion if Carter comes back to TO is quite high because people will expect way too much from the aged VC. Leave him play out his career in peace.

[Mack North]

Lol every armchair GMs favorite type of thread...so happy!

The majority of our team has good chem and I think there is a good base here that you keep together to grow the culture for the young kids you add. Lowry, Ross, Val, Amir and Pattman are my core.

1) Use Salmon's buyout on Draft Day - Salmons + pick #59 to OKC for Perkins + Perry Jones III +/- future second. OKC does it for cap relief, we buy out Perkins and take a flier on PJ3 whom I think is on a good developmental track and could be a good player within a couple of seasons, play him off the bench at SF.

2) Resign Lowry, resign Patterson, resign De Colo (1st year guaranteed, 2nd year team option), retain TH, let Vasquez walk

3) Trade DD for a pick high enough to select Noah Vonleh. I think the dude has potential to be a very good PF in this league on both side of the ball. He comes off the bench for a while. As the years go along he earns the starting PF and the Amir/Pattman combo off the bench is a solid, sustainable bench unit for years with Vonleh/JV hopefully turns into a great frontcourt

4) If there is a better coach available upgrade take it, I want to see an inside/out team, which Casey stifles

Lineup next season:

Lowry/De Colo/Stone
Ross/????
Fields/PJ3
Amir/Patterson/TH
JV/Vonleh/Hayes

We are weak at the backup SG position, and the SF position has tons of question marks. With our 20th pick I would take wing who has ball handling and very good shooting potential (LaVine or Stauskas). I would love to grab Caris LaVert, but don't think he is gonna declare this season.

Continue building around Lowry, Ross, Val, Amir and Pattman. Hopefully the pieces I propose of adding turn into the pieces that push us over the edge

I'm not gonna lie, I didn't know who Vonleh was until I just looked at his scouting video. The kid does look very good for a freshy...

I just don't see how you trade an all-star SG, one who has improved his game exponentially in the last year and a half, for a prospect at a position that is not necessarily in need of fixing. Sure it would be nice to have a blue chipper there again, but if Amir and Project Patterson can hold it down along with Psycho T, it's not really a move I would look to make.

[OldSkoolCool]

I just don't see how you trade an all-star SG, one who has improved his game exponentially in the last year and a half, for a prospect at a position that is not necessarily in need of fixing. Sure it would be nice to have a blue chipper there again, but if Amir and Project Patterson can hold it down along with Psycho T, it's not really a move I would look to make.

These are all very valid points and do make it hard to justify the move.

I think there are two things that need to be satisfied in order to justify the move

1) Vonleh is the perfect fit at PF beside Val and will fit perfectly in system and team identity
2) If you think Vonleh will be better than DD in the future

If 1 and 2 make a lot of sense to you, you have to look at the cost of acquiring him.

If the cost of acquiring Vonleh is a current all star SG then I think he is well worth it. He is a smooth player that crashes the boards hard and has the potential to be a very good defender (two things I put heavy emphasis on). I think he is going to be better than Randle, but is more of a project.

And must mention I was wrong in my one post about Vonleh being an unselfish player. Stand by everything else. I think he has the ability to make the right play, just needs growth

[OldSkoolCool]

Vonleh is projected top 7 right now. If the price to get him is anything more than DD, or has anything bad coming back (outside of an expiring) then the deal is a no go. I would want the number 5 or 6 pick in case someone more interesting slips to us (Exum). So basically a not likely scenario...

[Mack North]

These are all very valid points and do make it hard to justify the move.

I think there are two things that need to be satisfied in order to justify the move

1) Vonleh is the perfect fit at PF beside Val and will fit perfectly in system and team identity
2) If you think Vonleh will be better than DD in the future

If 1 and 2 make a lot of sense to you, you have to look at the cost of acquiring him.

If the cost of acquiring Vonleh is a current all star SG then I think he is well worth it. He is a smooth player that crashes the boards hard and has the potential to be a very good defender (two things I put heavy emphasis on). I think he is going to be better than Randle, but is more of a project.

And must mention I was wrong in my one post about Vonleh being an unselfish player. Stand by everything else. I think he has the ability to make the right play, just needs growth

It's just that in a league(and the way the rules are setup these days) that is dominated by top notch wing players, it would be tough to give up a proven commodity. With that being said, I kinda like your idea, but I would want another piece coming back as well. It would have to be somewhat of a Jermaine O'Neal for us selecting Roy Hibbert... or should I flip that script and say us getting Antonio Davis for our Jonathan Bender! lol we're even, Indy!

Your boy does look like he's gonna be a player though!

[Mack North]

And No, I don't want Vince back. Past is the past. If they're rippin' down old pics of the Leafs in the ACC, then we don't need to bring back a quitter. Goes against what (real)Toronto sports fans like and respect.

[golden]

I am in the minority of fans that were not pissed off about how Carter left (I blamed Babcock more). I still love those highlights and those memories that Carter provided. He truly put the Raptors on the sports map. I remember travelling to Estonia in 2000 and telling a taxi driver I was from Toronto. His response was... Oh, yeah... Vince Carter.

That said, I have less than ZERO interest in bringing him back.

First of all, there is the media distraction and the endless nostalgia that would come with it. What benefit comes from that? How does that help the team WIN? Secondly, why take the spotlight away from the current players who deserve the credit? It's a sideshow, plain and simple. You never want that. Again, I see no benefit to winning there. And since when did Vince Carter ever represent the type of toughness, grit and determination that IS the culture and identity that has become the signature of THIS team. If we're talking about the veteran, mentor role, then I'd rather have a guy like Shane Battier, who has WON at every level.

"You win with serious, tough-minded people. That never changes" - Tom Thibodeau

[Raps76]

Also I highly doubt Vince Carter will come here after many fans still harboring ill feelings just so they could goat him every time he has a bad game, not to mentioned he did say that he wants to resign with Dallas in the offseason:


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2...tter-next-year

Let sleeping dogs lie.

If Dallas misses the playoffs and we make it to the 2nd round Carter would be dumb not to give us some thought. Especially with the Anniversary & All-Star game on tap, let alone the chance to retire here.

Also what about the video footage in this thread where Masai basically states Tim L talked to him with Mark Cuban's permission about coming back?

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[Hotshot]

If Dallas misses the playoffs and we make it to the 2nd round Carter would be dumb not to give us some thought. Especially with the Anniversary & All-Star game on tap, let alone the chance to retire here.

First of, Carter does not need to finish his career in Toronto in order to retire his jersey here

Secondly despite Dallas fighting for a playoffs spot, they still have a better record then the Raptors which shows that the East is still an inferior league to the West. At the end of the day Dallas is still a much more proven winner today and in the past, something the Raptors reputation are still fighting for.

Also what about the video footage in this thread where Masai basically states Tim L talked to him with Mark Cuban's permission about coming back?

What about it?! Tim L just asked Cuban a permission to talk to Carter, there was nothing after that from Carter's end just his verbal commitment to Dallas for hoping to come back next season.

[Superjudge]

Carter would be awesome back here.

I'd love it

Its a good story

[magoon]

PG: Lowry, De Colo, Tyler Ennis
SG: DeRozan, Vince Carter, Thanasis Antetokounmpo
SF: Ross, Fields, Melvin Ejim
PF: Amir, 2Pat, Psycho T
C: Val, Hayes, Ed Davis

Draft Ennis first round (I think he'll potentially fall to #20 and if he doesn't he should be available for our own #20 pick and a small expense, a future second-rounder or Novak or similar), draft Thanasis with Sac's pick, draft Ejim with OKC's pick. Resign Lowry and 2Pat, sign Carter and Davis.

[Raps76]

First of, Carter does not need to finish his career in Toronto in order to retire his jersey here

Secondly despite Dallas fighting for a playoffs spot, they still have a better record then the Raptors which shows that the East is still an inferior league to the West. At the end of the day Dallas is still a much more proven winner today and in the past, something the Raptors reputation are still fighting for.



What about it?! Tim L just asked Cuban a permission to talk to Carter, there was nothing after that from Carter's end just his verbal commitment to Dallas for hoping to come back next season.

What about the quotes from Vince saying he would say yes in a heartbeat to returning back to Toronto?

http://www.raptorscage.ca/report-rap...g-back-carter/

I think Tim & Masai both know this would be a great PR move for the franchise and he's an obvious upgrade over Salmon's at a cheaper price, it's too good of an opportunity for it not to happen.

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[psrs1]

Ideal roster

PG - Lowry, de Colo
SG - DeRozan, Ross, Carter
SF - Harrison Barnes,Fields, Novak
PF - Amir,PPat, Ed Davis
C - Val,Hayes



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How will we acquire Barnes?

[RepTdot]

Ideally next season

PG- Lowry, Vasquez, Myck Kabongo
SG- DeRozan, Carter or Shumpert (1 more Knicks trade!), Jimmer Freddette
SF- Ross, Novak, (1st rd Pick)
PF- Amir, Patterson, Hansbourgh
C- JV, Hawes (or any capable back-up via trade), (2nd rd pick)

this is assuming that Masai buyouts Salmons and can work his magic and get some value for Fields & Hayes in the off season