Raptors cannot run a play

[phez]

Has anyone else noticed the complete lack of, well, ANY offensive floor movement for the Raptors?

The raptors offense literally consists of: Get the ball up the court, stand around, set a pick but never use it, stand around some more, pass the ball into iso, fail at beating your defender, chucking a shot with time expiring.

At least with derozan he makes those iso shots.

[KazanTheMan]

It's pretty embarrassing actually. Casey is too one-dimensional a coach. If anything, demote him to defensive assistant or something. Our offence is truly ridiculous. You're best/most promising player (JV) posted up like 50 times today and never got the ball. The guy had 15 and 8 or something like that at half, and he doesn't see the floor again til 4 minutes left in the 4th. How do you believe that our offence is going to be better when you take away our only advantage? I'm just at a loss for words.

[Blacklash2k4]

I read some good analysis on the Raptors offense on some guy on RealGM.

"I've been reading a lot how Coach Casey runs an offense with no set plays in the half-court and that it's mostly Rudy Gay and DeMar DeRozan ISOs so what I decided to do was re-watch yesterday's game footage against the Bucks. While it's true the offense is dominated by isolation clear outs, but I don't think this has to do with Coach Casey rather Rudy's and DeMar's reliance to break away from the offense. But the times that Rudy and DeMar follow the game plan reversing the ball, penetrating against an unprepared defense as it's rotating, setting screens on the ball and away from the ball, or finding the open man on the perimeter the offense was pleasantly nice to watch. I'll try to upload more plays tomorrow morning once I finish watching the 2nd Half since it's late and I had practice earlier this morning and I'll try my best to update this thread with plays from Casey's playbook if you enough people are interested. Maybe some plays from other NBA teams as well.

Opening possession for the Raptors they run "Horns" getting into it's basic alignment of the "A-Set". Lowry delivers a bounce pass to Amir then cuts high side wrapping around to set a back screen for Jonas. Jonas receives the screen and gets open in the lane catching the ball with a two foot land. Larry Sanders denies baseline and Jonas makes a simple drop step move to the middle for an easy left-handed hook.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2Ojhk-ewx8

Again the Raptors run "Horns". Rudy comes up from the corner getting the pass from Lowry who shallow cuts to the weakside. After the shallow cut he gets back the ball while DeMar sets a back screen for Jonas setting him up for a lob. Lowry under throws the pass forcing Jonas to bring the ball down to gather himself resulting in Larry Sanders stripping him. Dead ball as it goes out of bounds, but this was a nice motion play designed to set up for a dunk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FiQsuFattqU

Same play as above. The new wrinkle to this is that instead of DeMar setting a back screen for Jonas it's Rudy. The Bucks take away the lob since the Raptors try the play again the second time and a defensive player of Larry Sanders' caliber isn't going to get hit with a blind pick the second time. The play doesn't stop there as this now flows smoothly into a down screen for Rudy essentially a "screen the screener" action when the first option is taken away. From here Rudy has two options he can either pop the open 3-pointer from the top of the arc with his man hung up on the screen or he gets a ball screen from Amir like he does in the play.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhK0d90y3HE

Not really a set play, but I thought this possession Rudy did an excellent job of setting up his man walking him down to the baseline. Notice how Butler's head is turned away from Rudy and focused on the ball? Good read by Rudy to change directions and he sprints off a double staggered. Butler tries to cheat the play by "jumping the gap" thinking Rudy will curl instead of locking and trailing. Like Stephen Curry when they see this they fade/flare to the wing-corner.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-odetSObiYI

Ross get the dribble pitch or DHO and goes directly into a high pick-and-roll with Hansbrough. What this does is that it gives Ross a "live catch" meaning you can be more of an attacker putting pressure on the defense when you can catch and go. Ross makes the point to wing pass that goes into a side pick-and-roll with Jonas. The spacing on this play is terrific as you can see the "Triangle" or "3 Away" on the weakside formed by Hansbrough, Augustin and Ross with Augustin and Ross as release valves.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlTJBd-LzQ0

This SLOB play might've been the best I saw. Ball is put in play by Fields who then gets a flex screen by Hansbrough who then sets a back screen for Ross to loop around. What's interesting about this play is that Ross has the option of rejecting Fields' screen and using Gray's down screen for the catch-and-shoot. But Neal overplays the screen eliminating that option. Fields' man, Giannis Antetokounmpo, is so occupied with Fields that he doesn't bother to switch. The Raptors run a horizontal stack for Ross coming off of the flare screen for a catch-and-shoot. If that's taken away Fields can curl off of a down screen from Gray."

Again, this is not my work. I just thought I would share it with you all since it was a very well done analysis of the Raptors Bucks game. Props to this guy for the work.

See it here: http://forums.realgm.com/boards/view...f=32&t=1281545

Thoughts? Not entirely Casey's fault but rather Demar and Gay's fault for sticking to iso all the time?

[OldSkoolCool]

DD and Gay were a combine 0/11 on PnR offensive sets against the Heat. The Heat just bum rushed DD/Gay after the screen because not once did the pass it to the rolling big (well once, but the pass was a very tough catch when it needn't be) I also counted times that they took a good shot (ie if its open and miss, still a good shot), but no they instead to fade-aways in double teams or turned it over...that's 11 wasted possessions for the Raptors.

For comparison, Ross was 2/2 on PnR's tonight, he sucked the second defender and made the easy play.

To sum up I think that its DD and Gay that are stunting the offense. Another draw back is that our young guys are gonna be learning from guys who 'get theirs' rather than playing as a team and trusting your teammate.

[mcHAPPY]

It could be and is poor plays.

But it is also a lack of a system.

Watching the HEAT play offense really showed how high schoolish the Raptors really are.

Their ball movement is a thing of beauty.... like that one play vs. Milwaukee the Raps had which will likely be the highlight of the year.

[Axel]

It could be and is poor plays.

But it is also a lack of a system.

Watching the HEAT play offense really showed how high schoolish the Raptors really are.

Their ball movement is a thing of beauty.... like that one play vs. Milwaukee the Raps had which will likely be the highlight of the year.

We cannot compare our offence to the Heat. They have play-makers at multiple positions. We have 0 play-makers. Casey can draw it up all he wants, if the players don't or are unable to execute, then it wont work.

If we had a play making PG (like Marcus Smart) and a point forward (say Dario Saric at 13), we would be much more likely to execute.

[JawsGT]

Very atrocious offense. think about it, Miami has Wade and James, both superior to Gay and DD, yet refuse to play a one on one
ISO style offense. They move the ball so well and everyone gets involved. That was a winnable game last night, yet our wings reliance on playing for themselves is suffocating our offense and the rest of the team. I do not know how many times Demar could have passed the ball into JV off a PnR, but instead tried to shoot for himself or subsequently passed the ball to the side of the floor with all the defenders, while JV is in the post waving his hands for the ball, with only Haslem there waiting for him. Absolute insanity!! Very poor use of the screens, I expect more from Demar. And I do not know what kind of rotations Casey was using. Our starters were doing well working the ball in the paint early on, and then just got away from it all together. And JV basically misses most of the second half. The guy could have had 30 last night. I'm very confused...it's tough being a Raps fan with this type of nonsense going down game after game.

There is little doubt in my mind right now that the only way this team will succeed is to move both Rudy and Demar. I'm thinking a lineup of JV, Amir, Fields, Ross, and Lowry would be more successful and better to watch than one with DD and RG.

[Ambidextrious]

we need a frank vogel type of coach please but give casey a chance it was a tough loss..

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[Mediumcore]

I still like Casey and think he is a good coach for this current Raptors team. However it's clear that he can't impose his principles on the personalities on this team.

SVG is my first pick because he's worked with an elite big and knows how to build a team around the centre position. Karl would be my second pick because he's been known to challenge players to fights over disagreements, so you know he won't back down from a player. I would truly, truly love to see a coach rip into DeRozan and Gay for continuing to shoot those long jumpers instead of making the easy pass. They are full of themselves and selfish, and it's hurting the team imo.

[isaacthompson]

we need a frank vogel type of coach please but give casey a chance it was a tough loss..

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It was a tough loss BECAUSE of Casey. We played awful without JV and we were still within 6 with 2 minutes left. Last night was a very winnable game.

[Ambidextrious]

I still like Casey and think he is a good coach for this current Raptors team. However it's clear that he can't impose his principles on the personalities on this team.

SVG is my first pick because he's worked with an elite big and knows how to build a team around the centre position. Karl would be my second pick because he's been known to challenge players to fights over disagreements, so you know he won't back down from a player. I would truly, truly love to see a coach rip into DeRozan and Gay for continuing to shoot those long jumpers instead of making the easy pass. They are full of themselves and selfish, and it's hurting the team imo.

It was a tough loss BECAUSE of Casey. We played awful without JV and we were still within 6 with 2 minutes left. Last night was a very winnable game.

yeah it was pretty stupid to sit Val for so long only 27 mins but you need to rest you players in back to backs

[Craiger]

The core problem is lack of talent. The secondary problem (related to the first problem) is too many similar players (in a broad sense), that are not very good at passing when they have the ball and/or playing without the ball.

Every other issue with the offense pale in comparison to the first two issues.

The only 'passer' on this team is Lowry, who also happens to be a bit reckless, and he's at his best when he sees the ball alot. But he can't see the ball alot with 2 iso heavy guys on the wings who need the ball to play their iso ball.

What we see is the same Colangelo mish-mash attempt at team building. Any future 'organic growth' with current roster is going to have to come from players doing things they historically haven't done or not done well.

[mcHAPPY]

We cannot compare our offence to the Heat. They have play-makers at multiple positions. We have 0 play-makers. Casey can draw it up all he wants, if the players don't or are unable to execute, then it wont work.

If we had a play making PG (like Marcus Smart) and a point forward (say Dario Saric at 13), we would be much more likely to execute.

Passing, spacing, and cutting is the basis of their offense. Those are basic fundamentals. LBJ and wade are much better than gay and dd yet they don't stop the ball on every possession

[Axel]

Passing, spacing, and cutting is the basis of their offense. Those are basic fundamentals. LBJ and wade are much better than gay and dd yet they don't stop the ball on every possession

Agreed that their offence is based on better principles, but having significant better and versatile players make it so much easier.

Take a simple drive for example. With LeBron, that could mean an attempt at the rim for him, a dump pass for a teammate at the rim, a corner three (both strong and weak side) for a teammate, pass to a weak side cutter, a lob pass or a pull-up jumper. With Gay or DD, pull-up jumper or attempt at the rim. Play-makers make it so much easier. I think this is more of a talent deficit than a strategic shortfall.

When you have better players, it is easier to implement an offence. The Raptors simply don't have players to execute a more complex offence. That doesn't even take into account the benefits of team continuity that is playing a familiar system vs a team still adjusting a new primary scorer (Gay).

[KeonClark]

I'm glad most people are with me in seeing that Demar and Rudy are absolutely DRAINING the offense.