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Rebuild or Re-tool? (thread merge in post #358)

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  • BrydenB
    replied
    Haven't posted in a while since apparently work blocks me from throwing in my two cents on the boards haha. Jumping in late but if Raps go with rebuild, I'd offer the Cavs Gay and Amir for Tristan and the #1. Who the Raps take with that pick, I dunno

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  • NoPropsneeded
    replied
    Its Monta not Monte... atleast spell his name right lol

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  • mcHAPPY
    replied
    A big fat definite NO to Monta Ellis.

    He is even less efficient that DeRozan.

    http://www.thenbageek.com/players/co...r_ids[]=93


    The only advantage I'd give Ellis is he does not have to be set up off 2 and 3 screens to get his shot.

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  • Chr1s1anL
    replied
    blackjitsu wrote: View Post
    Yo, I just asked if Monte would make a legit option at pg not sg.
    Ok Lowry > Monte

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  • blackjitsu
    replied
    Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    Monte < DD
    Yo, I just asked if Monte would make a legit option at pg not sg.

    Leave a comment:


  • Chr1s1anL
    replied
    blackjitsu wrote: View Post
    Wow. Fair enough, I can guess your rationale, but still a wow.
    Monte < DD

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  • blackjitsu
    replied
    thead wrote: View Post
    I wouldn't give up JV for any player that could currently be had.
    Wow. Fair enough, I can guess your rationale, but still a wow.

    Leave a comment:


  • thead
    replied
    blackjitsu wrote: View Post
    Let's all be honest, the Raps suck. Everyone can be had for the right price.
    I wouldn't give up JV for any player that could currently be had.

    Leave a comment:


  • blackjitsu
    replied
    Can I go back to Monte? What if he was brought here strictly to play the point guard position?

    As far as value, that's a tough debate to have without including impact in the locker room. Just looking at numbers flat is a misnomer. Personally, I have Demar and Gay as highly valuable players, and Landry a trade-able asset, but that's just opinion. I don't have enough information, and I would like the time to see if LF gets his shot back.

    Let's all be honest, the Raps suck. Everyone can be had for the right price. But if the goal is a title who has a higher value staying? How much will dramatic player turnover impact interest from free agents? What players fit the playing philosophy that the team wants to develop? How many years can the general public wait on a rebuild? What would be the locker room impact of the player leaving? Sort of have to answer all those questions before you can figure out who would be best to ship out. Hopefully we will figure out what the Raptors philosophy is in the near future.

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  • magoon
    replied
    Matt52 wrote: View Post
    I think I have talked myself in to a total rebuild on some conditions.

    1) you need to get a top 5 pick this year and one more,
    2) you need to get at least two extra 2014 picks (with own 3),
    3) you need to get back 1-2 players in the mold of Fields or Amir (< 25 years old proven role players that are highly efficient players).
    4) you have extra cap space for 2014-15 season to be a facilitator in deals or take on salary for tax fearing teams (for a price).


    It is not very often a team enters in to a rebuild with the hardest piece already in place - that of course being the C and JV.
    I would set the following conditions for a rebuild:

    1.) One 30-or-better pick in 2013, minimum
    2.) Two first-round picks in 2014 plus our own, or our own plus one likely lottery pick (e.g. a Charlotte or a Phoenix or the like)
    3.) Cap space in 2015-16 to begin signing free agents (our heavy drafting period should be 2013/2014)
    4.) Ed Davis back somehow

    The first can likely be done with cash. The second will probably mean giving up, at a minimum, two of Gay, DeMar, Lowry and Ross. The third should be easy to manage. The fourth: well, I can dream, right?

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  • jimmie
    replied
    Quirk wrote: View Post
    Numbers aren't everything, but they're something. They show that best efforts to measure his performance show him to be bellow average.
    Even if the numbers aren't unequivocally negative, I think it's more rational to look at his impact on the teams he's been a part of. Despite his recognized talent as a SF, you can't really make an argument that he's had a huge impact one way or the other on any of those teams.

    That in itself is a problem, and one that the Raptors will need to monitor closely in the early going next season. If all these things that people are talking about now in rosy terms (new eyes, added weight, desire to be the alpha dog) result in a big change in his impact on wins/losses, then maybe he's a worthwhile asset to keep around as Vanciunas and others develop. If not, then his $16M salary will look pretty ugly to a rebuilding GM, and I can't imagine him finishing his current contract in Toronto.

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  • Quirk
    replied
    Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    Oh god! Number aren't everything. League wide his not known as a below average wing.
    Numbers aren't everything, but they're something. They show that best efforts to measure his performance show him to be bellow average.

    Leave a comment:


  • Chr1s1anL
    replied
    Oh god! Number aren't everything. League wide his not known as a below average wing.

    Leave a comment:


  • Quirk
    replied
    Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    Gay is not a below average wing.
    Yes, he is.

    http://www.thenbageek.com/players/150-rudy-gay

    Leave a comment:


  • Quirk
    replied
    joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
    How do DD and Gay get labeled "below average" and "overpaid" and Landry Fields gets started without a complaint? Lol
    For one, they both have WP48 below .100, while Fields doesn't. But, you are welcome to a different opinion, I was expressing mine.

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