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Twin Tower Dream Collapsed Thanks to BC

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  • #16
    white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    People have really gott aget over this. They thought Ross was a safe pick, they were wrong. It is in a lot of ways unrelated to Drummond, who 7 other teams also felt was too risky to draft...including Cleveland who passed on JV one year and Drummond the next in favour of Thompson and Waiters (both good players, but I don't think either will have the impact of a top tier C).

    Clearly there were pretty common concerns about both his body and motor. And many of those other teams did not have a young prospect like Jonas. I'm sure teams like Charlotte, Cleveland, and Sacto at least would all like a re-do on that draft. And I'm sure even some of the teams that made decent picks would reconsider...like Washington and GSW, who both drafted solid wings, but in hindsight do either of Beal or Barnes look like they can have the impact of a guy with Drummond's potential? I think not.

    On the other guys:
    -Henson is a PF, which we all know would only get drafted by default while BC was here because he wanted Bargs to turn into something
    -Nicholson has hardly proven to be such a high calibre of player to get your panties in a twist about
    -Sullinger had MAJOR injury concerns regarding his back, which he has still not shaken off in Boston. If he didn't, he likely would have been a top 5 pick and the Raps probably wouldn't have had a shot at him anyway.
    To the bolded - this was the crux of the issue. BC was simply not going to draft another big no matter where the team drafted/who was available. I personally think this was just as much Bargnani related as Jonas (if not even more so). He also wanted a player that could contribute immediately (his contract was coming due). Inevitably he made the classic draft day mistake - drafting for need instead of the BPA.

    The irony ofcourse is that had he done the opposite he may have 1) saved his job 2) had an ideal fit beside Bargnani in Drummond (as ideal as you can get with Bargnani ofcourse)

    As to Drummond, yes there are numerous teams that probably would prefer to have him, even if they are content with their selection. However, I think its also worth noting that going into the draft there were 6 players that stood out as the consensus 6 (in no specific order): Davis, MKG, Barnes, Robinson, Beal, Drummond + Lilliard making alot of noise leading up to draft day. Its not like the teams that passed on Drummond for those guys took the same level of risk vs reward Colangelo did. They replaced the opportunity to take Drummond with another one of those other highly coveted picks. Cleveland did Toronto a huge favor (again) reaching for a player in Waiters and leaving a 'Tier 1' opportunity for Toronto. What Colangelo did was replace a Tier 1 opportunity with a lower one.

    While Drummond should have gone much higher, the risk vs reward those others teams took in their selection was not nearly as bad as Colangelo's.

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    • #17
      LBF wrote: View Post
      Who, Drummond or Justin Timberlake?
      JT always performs. Maybe we should have drafted him instead. Then we could combine JV and JT and have "The Big J's"
      Heir, Prince of Cambridge

      If you see KeonClark in the wasteland, please share your food and water with him.

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      • #18
        TRex wrote: View Post
        I thought this thread is about Chris Bosh and Jermaine O'neal

        They're supposed to be the next Duncan and Robinson.....according to Bosh.
        Before that, it was supposed to be Bosh and Villenueva :|

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        • #19
          Nilanka wrote: View Post
          Before that, it was supposed to be Bosh and Villenueva :|
          And before that it was Lonny Baxter and Robert Archibald...

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          • #20
            joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
            And before that it was Lonny Baxter and Robert Archibald...
            I believe they were the "Banger Brothers"

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            • #21
              This is such a stupid conversation - it's only got traction because of how Drummond's rookie season has played out, in spite of arguments for him being the BPA at the time.

              8 teams passed on Drummond. Maybe half of them would have taken him now, in hindsight (for sure Sacto at #5 instead of Thomas Robinson) making the whole argument moot. If the Raps blew it at #8, then Sacto really blew it at #5, which means if we're gonna argue shoulda/woulda/couldas, Drummond wouldn't even have been on the board at #8.

              As has been explained pretty well above, there are much, much bigger draft day blunders than taking Ross over Drummond.

              Also, after 1 (1!) season, it's way too early to make final judgments on either player. Drummond's attitude may catch up to him yet - even Michael Beasley's had a couple nice seasons.
              "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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              • #22
                S.R. wrote: View Post
                This is such a stupid conversation - it's only got traction because of how Drummond's rookie season has played out, in spite of arguments for him being the BPA at the time.

                8 teams passed on Drummond. Maybe half of them would have taken him now, in hindsight (for sure Sacto at #5 instead of Thomas Robinson) making the whole argument moot. If the Raps blew it at #8, then Sacto really blew it at #5, which means if we're gonna argue shoulda/woulda/couldas, Drummond wouldn't even have been on the board at #8.

                As has been explained pretty well above, there are much, much bigger draft day blunders than taking Ross over Drummond.

                Also, after 1 (1!) season, it's way too early to make final judgments on either player. Drummond's attitude may catch up to him yet - even Michael Beasley's had a couple nice seasons.
                Further to your point, it's still too early to label Ross a waste of a pick.

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                • #23
                  Nilanka wrote: View Post
                  Further to your point, it's still too early to label Ross a waste of a pick.
                  But it's getting closer to the correct time every game he doesn't show any improvement whatsoever.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Ross could get better. Hope he does.

                    Just, Drummond was huge.... he was never gonna get small. No biggie, I mean hey, he has his shortcomings too. Its just, old sayings that last, last for a reason, and this one, well, it makes most sense to me.

                    "You can't teach size".

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                    • #25
                      Craig wrote: View Post
                      "You can't teach size".
                      Patrick O'Bryant, Solomon Alabi, Jake Voshkul, Kwame Brown...etc...

                      I'm not saying there isn't merit to this idea. It just shouldn't occur in a vacuum
                      For still frame photograph of me reading the DeRozan thread please refer to my avatar

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                      • #26
                        thead wrote: View Post
                        Patrick O'Bryant, Solomon Alabi, Jake Voshkul, Kwame Brown...etc...

                        I'm not saying there isn't merit to this idea. It just shouldn't occur in a vacuum
                        Those players were all vacuums, aka they sucked.

                        Drummond scared me more than any high prospect in recent memory. He was a massive high risk/high reward pick, and I wouldn't have picked him.

                        I had Rivers as a total bust right from the get go. Ross wasn't hugely on the radar, but I did like him more than Lamb.
                        Heir, Prince of Cambridge

                        If you see KeonClark in the wasteland, please share your food and water with him.

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                        • #27
                          Puffer wrote: View Post
                          But it's getting closer to the correct time every game he doesn't show any improvement whatsoever.
                          I think he's struggling with his confidence, more than anything else.

                          Offensively speaking, I find a noticeable improvement in his willingness to put the ball on the floor and attack. Last year, he was content hanging out behind the arc and waiting for a kickout.

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                          • #28
                            Why all this pawning after Drummond? The thing I'm pissed at is GS tanking to tie us, Uzoh's infamous triple double night on the last game of the season that got us the win and then GS winning the coin flip to take Barnes. I'd take Barnes any day of the week over Drummond. No matter how awesome Drummond is, I can't stand a rotation player that shoots 30% from the line.

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                            • #29
                              sleepz wrote: View Post
                              Both Tristan and Waiters start for a team with the same playoff aspirations (but with a much better chance imho) as the Raptors.

                              Ross isn't pushing Derozan for minutes at this point and looks like a 7-8 rotational guy right now. This could change but the argument concerning your GM being able to recognize talent and build a team with it is significant. Even J.Lamb who went after Ross and is a 2 as well, is going to have a big role this year coming off the bench for OKC. Ross still doesn't seem to know where or how he should fit on the 2nd unit.
                              I'm really not sure how this is relevant. The point I made was that neither Tristan nor Waiters were as good choices to build a foundation (considering Kyrie's there too) then potentially beast Cs who Cleveland passed on two years in a row. They could have maybe had (assuming their draft positions left unchanged) Jonas, Kyrie and Waiters, or Drummond, Kyrie and Thompson....both those trios are pretty obviously better to build around than Kyrie, Waiters and Thompson.

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                              • #30
                                I was pretty shocked when we picked Ross over Drummond as well, but I'm not ready to throw in the towel on the Ross pick either.

                                Ross has ridiculous raw talent...imo, he is to shooting guards as Paul George is to small forwards. Great size, ridiculous athletecism, smooth shooting mechanics, length to be a lock down defender. What he does with those raw talents and god given gifts is up to him, but if ever gets his shit together you have a star in the making. Clearly he is far off right now, but I'm not going to say he is a bust after a single year of inconsistent playing time.

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