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What If We Dealt DeMar And Not Rudy?

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  • #91
    CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
    Other posters who are far more versed in stats have posted the evidence in multiple threads, so you're right, I didn't post them yet again. My bad.

    Whether it's against me or any other poster, there's never a reason to make it personal, especially if you're throwing out insults (check the stickied post for forum rules).

    I did expect it, but until DeRozan proves that he can score efficiently consistently, it's not justified.
    See.... thats where your wrong. You don't get to pick whether it's justified. Demar needs to prove nothing to you either. Many people here respect what he's done for this team. Too bad you can't see what he's done for us instead of what you want him to do. Maybe then you'd at least give him some respect. As always, you go back to the same talking points you made prior to the season....except you acknowledge he improved (a tiny little bit). Good for you! Would a spot on the all-star roster change your opinion? NOPE

    Seriously, how can i address your flawed opinion?

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    • #92
      special1 wrote: View Post
      See.... thats where your wrong. You don't get to pick whether it's justified. Demar needs to prove nothing to you either. Many people here respect what he's done for this team. Too bad you can't see what he's done for us instead of what you want him to do. Maybe then you'd at least give him some respect. As always, you go back to the same talking points you made prior to the season....except you acknowledge he improved (a tiny little bit). Good for you! Would a spot on the all-star roster change your opinion? NOPE

      Seriously, how can i address your flawed opinion?
      You are throwing this "eat crow" sentiment at anybody who voices an opinion that points out any negative in DeRozan's game. However, the main issue most posters you've labeled as a "hater" bring up, is his scoring efficiency numbers. To myself (and I assume I'm not alone here), despite his improvements and potential all-star appearance, his scoring is still statistically very inefficient. This isn't due to having a flawed opinion, or really an opinion of any kind; the stats speak for themselves.

      Even though I still feel that way about his scoring efficiency, I've given him lots of respect, if you go check out other threads. I've gone so far as to say he (along with Lowry) should be on the EC all-star team this season. I've also said that he's showed himself much more worthy of his contract that he was when he signed it. I've never questioned him as a person, teammate or Raptors representative in the community.

      You always seem to mix these two things into one, when they can be mutually exclusive.

      I think one of the reasons I'm so hard on him is because he is a likable guy and would be great to have as a key player on a Raptors team that is a perennial contender. I so desperately want him to elevate his game to the next level but, despite all the hype, he hasn't been able to do so - at least not consistently. He's clearly not a #1 option but, as evidenced from the time playing alongside Gay (though Gay was a black hole, granted), he doesn't do as well when he isn't ball-dominant (compared to a guy like Ross, who barely needs to touch the ball to be successful) so it's a bit of a conundrum. Do you keep giving him #1 option quantity of touches and hope he improves his efficiency, or bring in a true #1 option and hope he doesn't disappear completely? Ross seems like a much better secondary scoring option to better balance the lineup, assuming a legit #1 scoring option was brought in as the starting PF/SF.

      Given the emergence of Ross, I'd still personally prefer to move DeRozan (his value should be at an all-time high after potentially both an all-star appearance and leading his team to the playoffs) and bring another starting SF in, be it through the draft, trade or free agency (I'd keep DeRozan as 6th man, but the Raptors' cap situation prevents them from enjoying that luxury).
      Last edited by CalgaryRapsFan; Fri Jan 24, 2014, 06:55 PM.

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      • #93
        How does crow taste? Most birds are pretty delicious

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        • #94
          This -debate- is absolutely hilarious looking from the outside

          So I'm just gonna give a little tip to special1 here:

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          • #95
            Dr. James Naismith wrote: View Post
            Oh, and Lowry is arguably the team's best player. It pains me to say it because I've never been a fan of him since he came into the NBA, but without his resurrection, Toronto wouldn't be where they are at the moment. This team could still compete without DeMar in my opinion. Without Lowry at the moment, we'd be awful. JMO
            Well, depending on how long DeMar is out for now, I guess we'll have that opportunity to see how badly this team will (or will not) miss DeRozan. Let's see if I'm eating crow too.

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            • #96
              Dr. James Naismith wrote: View Post
              Well, depending on how long DeMar is out for now, I guess we'll have that opportunity to see how badly this team will (or will not) miss DeRozan. Let's see if I'm eating crow too.
              It is a trade in the original scenario you proposed.

              An injury is not going to allow the returns in a trade to contribute

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              • #97
                Wow, looking back at this; DeMar and Ross together for years to come (hopefully), it looks incredibly bright to me.

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                • #98
                  Dr. James Naismith wrote: View Post
                  Well, depending on how long DeMar is out for now, I guess we'll have that opportunity to see how badly this team will (or will not) miss DeRozan. Let's see if I'm eating crow too.
                  Haha I have been firmly on the bandwagon that losing DD will have a minimal impact on how the Raptors will perform.

                  I guess we may get to see how wrong (or right) I am....and whether or not I'm eating crow

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                  • #99
                    If only we'd traded DeRozan...
                    your pal,
                    ebrian

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                    • ebrian wrote: View Post
                      If only we'd traded DeRozan...
                      We haven't passed the trade deadline yet, this is still a possibility

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                      • special1 wrote: View Post
                        See.... thats where your wrong. You don't get to pick whether it's justified. Demar needs to prove nothing to you either. Many people here respect what he's done for this team. Too bad you can't see what he's done for us instead of what you want him to do. Maybe then you'd at least give him some respect. As always, you go back to the same talking points you made prior to the season....except you acknowledge he improved (a tiny little bit). Good for you! Would a spot on the all-star roster change your opinion? NOPE

                        Seriously, how can i address your flawed opinion?
                        I think even DeMar's harshest critics respect him as an individual and a player and how hard he works, his intensity and how he's got that little bit better every year. He's not exactly a player a raptors fan would disrespect. However, doesn't mean fans can't discuss scenarios where the team would benefit from moving him, as the point you have bolded is not incorrect at all, he's still not proven he is an efficient scorer consistently. He may very well make the allstar game, but I for one will be very disappointed if he makes it and Lowry does not, as Lowry is really the guy that has carried the raptors this season. If both make it that would be fun, but not important in the big picture. I'd certainly move him for the right price.

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                        • Just wanted to say this, people lots of people don't like DeRozan trade talks in many of our threads here on RR...

                          Look, I'm one of the biggest DeRozan supporters if not the biggest. But, trade speculation isn't unavoidable, considering how high his trade value is and the uncertainty of Masai Ujiri's building plan (we all have an idea though - build through the low end of the draft i.e. pick #15 to lower).

                          I will just give my opinion here:

                          Keep DeRozan, he's an all-star calibre player, who continues to improve many aspects of his game each and every season, no matter how marginal certain improvements are; improving is still progress, and some of us may be a little too stretchy when talking about improvement/progress.

                          Lowry/DeRozan/Ross/Amir/JV is a starting lineup for possibly, years. Sustainability is huge in this league, and internal improvement has never been a bad thins; look at teams like the Pacers and the Thunder. Now I know people will say" blah, blah, the Thunder and Pacers have big time talent." Well, obviously, because they improved. Not sure anyone could have said George or Hibbert, hell for sure Stephenson, that these guys were going to be the players they are now..

                          Anyways, keep DeMar, Lowry is my point guard for a reasonable contract, and continue to improve internally along with adding in the right mix of veterans, and continuing to stockpile young players/assets in the draft.

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                          • ReubenJRD wrote: View Post
                            Just wanted to say this, people lots of people don't like DeRozan trade talks in many of our threads here on RR...

                            Look, I'm one of the biggest DeRozan supporters if not the biggest. But, trade speculation isn't unavoidable, considering how high his trade value is and the uncertainty of Masai Ujiri's building plan (we all have an idea though - build through the low end of the draft i.e. pick #15 to lower).

                            I will just give my opinion here:

                            Keep DeRozan, he's an all-star calibre player, who continues to improve many aspects of his game each and every season, no matter how marginal certain improvements are; improving is still progress, and some of us may be a little too stretchy when talking about improvement/progress.

                            Lowry/DeRozan/Ross/Amir/JV is a starting lineup for possibly, years. Sustainability is huge in this league, and internal improvement has never been a bad thins; look at teams like the Pacers and the Thunder. Now I know people will say" blah, blah, the Thunder and Pacers have big time talent." Well, obviously, because they improved. Not sure anyone could have said George or Hibbert, hell for sure Stephenson, that these guys were going to be the players they are now..

                            Anyways, keep DeMar, Lowry is my point guard for a reasonable contract, and continue to improve internally along with adding in the right mix of veterans, and continuing to stockpile young players/assets in the draft.
                            Good post. I do feel a legit 3 would help that starting line up though. Sign LBJ and move DD to 6th moy?

                            And I'm also a huge proponent of internal development. I think that becomes a lot easier when you're surrounded by a stable environment too.
                            "Bruno?
                            Heh, if he is in the D-league still in a few years I will be surprised.
                            He's terrible."

                            -Superjudge, 7/23

                            Hope you're wrong.

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                            • Rudy may be killing it, but he's also led the Kings to the bottom of the Western Conference. They are currently in LAST... so there's that.

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