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Was it worth it to trade for Gay, then flip him?

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  • Was it worth it to trade for Gay, then flip him?

    We traded out for Rudy Gay:

    -a very skilled point guard Jose Calderon on a $10 M expiring contract
    -a young big with potential Ed Davis. Looked really predictable on offense tho
    -a 2nd rounder

    We got back:

    Rudy Gay

    When we traded away Rudy Gay, we got back:

    -Grevis Vasquez, a decent backup point guard. Can't really defend well
    - John Salmons. a decent backup wing, but had shown inconsistency and had given locker room problems in the past. $1M guaranteed next year
    -Patrick Patterson. Biggest X-factor really. He showed potential, was young and was a stretch 4 that could bang inside or had range to 3 point.
    -Chuck Hayes. An albatross of a contract. Owed money this year and next year.

    Right now, we are capped out with no potential until 2015. Patterson, Lowry are getting a raise this summer.

    If we hadn't traded for Gay and hadn't flipped him, do you think we would be better off?

  • #2
    Was it worth it to trade for Gay, then flip him?

    I don't think so. Jose probably would've left, I think PPat is better than ED was in his time here and salmons and Hayes five us a pretty good bench

    Who knows, too. That terrible Rudy trade might've been the catalyst that got us MU.
    A key that opens many locks is a master key, but a lock that gets open by many keys is just a shitty lock


    • #3
      ^ I think you mean that it was worth it?

      I think it was worth it, we ended up getting good return.

      Got us a Bench, got rid of our PG Controversy, which I think Jose would've left anyways, or we would've overpaid him, both of which would be bad.

      And ED...I like him, but, PPat is much more versatile.


      • #4
        The Gay traded in my opinion cemented Bryan's departure. Therefore I think it was a great trade in hindsight.


        • #5
          We acquired Rudy for a fair price, though it was a major/desperate strategic gamble in terms of cap management.

          We sold him at the absolute nadir of his value and got a decent complementary piece in Patterson. The huge benefit of the deal was that it allowed Ross to come into his own. You have to wonder if he'd be rotting on Casey's bench otherwise.

          The biggest what-if for me is what an effective coach would have done with Rudy (and all our athletes). Asking Rudy to add weight to play the four was so incredibly dumb. Now that he's played himself into shape and is being utilized more effectively you have to think his value is much higher.

          But whatever. Water under the bridge.... just another of so so many Raptor what-ifs.


          • #6
            The OP missed that Rudy is owed another year @ about 19 million. Removing that from the payroll = flexibility/certainty


            • #7
              Are the Raptors in better place now than they were prior to Gay trade?

              I think so, definitely.

              So yes it was worth it to trade for him and then flip him.


              • #8
                I think it was worth it and for reasons already mentioned.


                • #9
                  What has only been hinted at is how moving Gay opened up opportunities for others to operate. Lowry's play and Demar's play and the opportunity for Ross have more than made up for Gay. Not to mention actually acquiring depth on the bench.

                  No question it was worth it.


                  • #10
                    Yes it was...when the rudy gay trade happened the Raps were terrible, DD hadn't developed and Lowry was being restricted due to Calderon and Ed Davis was being outplayed by Amir. Lets not forget that we were a .500 teams with Rudy Gay on the squad the year of the trade. When we flipped him we got a good deal- Vasquez serves the same role/talent/skillset as Jose did except with the controversy of a starter battle with Lowry, 2Pat is a young big man- he was drafted 14th after Ed Davis (13th) in the same draft class! John Salmons is a vet presence the team was missing and will need in the playoffs with a $1mil buyout on his $7mil contract...for a 2nd rounder, obviously having to take back Chuck Hayes was/is brutal but take the wins with the losses


                    • #11
                      Doesn't it basically come down to would you trade Ed + 2nd rounder for 2Pat, GV, Hayes and Salmons?

                      While 2Pat>Ed (although Im not sure many people would have said that pre the trade), its a lot of salary to take on given the differential. To me, its close to a wash, depending on what you think of GV vs random back up PG that you could find in free agency for the equivalent of $9 mm (what we are paying Hayes + GV. When you think about it that way, Id like to think we could get something better than GV for that ..
                      We already tried Augustine who somehow is lighting in up in Chi - but was horrible with us and all of his previous stops. Obviously he makes a fraction of that. Jose makes less than that .. and while he was a bad fit with KL - if he just took a back seat, I think we would all take him as a back up vs GV??
                      When I look at it this way, don't think we are better off....


                      • #12
                        I'm not sure. What could the Raps have got for moving Andrea, and Jose instead?

                        The Raps needed a bench wing, because of Landry's health.
                        A solid back up PG, instead of a starter playing backup.
                        A stretch 4 who could play defense.

                        IF BC was less about big moves and made solid small moves the Raps could have gotten these kind of players. Instead, they got Rudy Gay, and never moved Andrea. And what are the Raps missing now? A PF who can bruise and play the post (like ED), and a big 5 for the deep bench (like Grey).

                        The current holes in the roster were created to repair the bigger roster issues created during the BC era. I'm happy with the results, but I look at the Gay trade more like "two steps forward, one step back," rather than significant progress. The step however, has coincided with whatever the East has become, making a team which on paper should be a 6-8 seed look like a 3-5 seed.


                        • #13
                          GV= Poor mans Jose Calderon 2Pat 2Furious> Eddy D


                          • #14
                            feet85 wrote: View Post
                            GV= Poor mans Jose Calderon 2Pat 2Furious> Eddy D
                            GV's contract is also a lot better than Calderon's was. Which is perfect, because we don't necessarily need a guy like Calderon running the second line.
                            Heh, if he is in the D-league still in a few years I will be surprised.
                            He's terrible."

                            -Superjudge, 7/23

                            Hope you're wrong.


                            • #15

                              Everything about it was perfect and worth it.
                              “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King