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  • #91
    lewro wrote: View Post
    I wouldn't say it's nothing. We literally booed bargs off the court until he cried. Kg and pierce were championship talents and the proof that alot of the value in that trade was more the nets being dumb is that they didn't attach protections to any of those picks. That to me says that Danny did not have to negotiate much at all. The nets just wrote a blank cheque.
    Look at his draft record: we got sully for a song and bebe too, olynk looks like he might walk for nothing, RJ hunter was waived, Mickey/Rozier/Jackson are all ok-ish, James young is a miss, who knows what they have in zizic and yabusele?, Smart and brown look like solid one-way players. I think I'm missing like several picks there too which is further testament to his unremarkable record. What is remarkable is the quantity of picks and not much to show for it imo.
    Ainge is good but masai is definitely better imo.
    I agree. No disrespect to Ainge, who made smart choices with good assets, but Ujiri has "won" more trades imho when you're looking at the quality of what went out vs what came back in.

    One solid transaction at a time Ujiri turned a non-playoff team into a conference finalist in fairly short order. Ainge has great picks in the cupboard but Boston hasn't done yet what the Raptors have done.

    We'll also have to re-visit this over the next couple of years. Everything is going to hinge on what Ainge does with these picks.
    "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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    • #92
      KeonClark wrote: View Post
      Boston also has the luxury of being a big market where guys like kd and ray allen wanted to play, and then won a ring and sold high at the right time. Toronto is only now starting to become a destination. Masai sold a guy who washed out of the league a couple years later, ainge sold two hall of famers. Both great gms no doubt but comparing the fleecings is kind of apples and oranges. Thomas was a great trade no doubt, almost similar to he raptors buying low on lowry (I know that was BC). Both gms have made mistakes. Brown was a bad pick for Boston imo, carroll was a bad signing. Amir was a bad signing but short term pain. I don't think Horford is a max guy, I'd rather have ibaka at a little less of a cap hit. Greivis "retired and no one noticed" vasquez for powell and the pick that helped us get ibaka. The ibaka deal, tucker deal, how bout john salmons for a fun year of lou will and bebe? Masai is a masterful dealer.

      They're both very very good GMs no doubt
      Do you have anything to back up the Amir bad signing claim? He has the best net rating on the Celtics and is a top 10 RPM PF.

      Also a bit early to call Jaylen Brown a bad pick - one can make a claim that almost every player drafted ahead of Brogden was a bad pick.
      If we knew half as much about coaching an NBA team as we think, we"d know twice as much as we do.

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      • #93
        You guys are seriously overvaluing Boston, they are well coached and have good depth, but they scare noone in the playoffs. They have poor rebounding and assuming IT doesn't get the same calls he gets in the regular season, their offense can be shut-down fairly easily. Avery Bradley is the only player I'd want on Toronto.
        -"You canít run from me. I mean, my heart donít bleed Kool-Aid."
        -"ďI ainít no diva! I donít have no blond hair, red hair. Iím Reggie Evans.Ē

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        • #94
          3inthekeon wrote: View Post
          Do you have anything to back up the Amir bad signing claim? He has the best net rating on the Celtics and is a top 10 RPM PF.

          Also a bit early to call Jaylen Brown a bad pick - one can make a claim that almost every player drafted ahead of Brogden was a bad pick.
          I think Amir has been good, he just has a lot of mileage banging with big guys on the frame.
          I think Jaylen has a lot of potential and has shown well for the most part. I give Ainge credit that some people questioned whether Jaylen would fall in that draft. My guy was always Murray tho and I stand by that.
          Brogden is 24 so it's hard to comp him to 18/19 yr olds like Bender at this point.

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          • #95
            Raptorsss wrote: View Post
            You guys are seriously overvaluing Boston, they are well coached and have good depth, but they scare noone in the playoffs. They have poor rebounding and assuming IT doesn't get the same calls he gets in the regular season, their offense can be shut-down fairly easily. Avery Bradley is the only player I'd want on Toronto.
            Crowder has 3 yrs/$22m guaranteed after this season. I'd take that.

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            • #96
              lewro wrote: View Post
              Crowder has 3 yrs/$22m guaranteed after this season. I'd take that.
              Yeah, you've got to be quite the homer to want Carroll than Crowder.
              If we knew half as much about coaching an NBA team as we think, we"d know twice as much as we do.

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              • #97
                lewro wrote: View Post
                I think Amir has been good, he just has a lot of mileage banging with big guys on the frame.
                I think Jaylen has a lot of potential and has shown well for the most part. I give Ainge credit that some people questioned whether Jaylen would fall in that draft. My guy was always Murray tho and I stand by that.
                Brogden is 24 so it's hard to comp him to 18/19 yr olds like Bender at this point.
                Just saying Brogdon (just like Powell the year before) has turned out to be a very good pick where he was drafted. No other draftee has really shown much and some like Ingram have been very disappointing despite their age.
                If we knew half as much about coaching an NBA team as we think, we"d know twice as much as we do.

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                • #98
                  Raptorsss wrote: View Post
                  You guys are seriously overvaluing Boston, they are well coached and have good depth, but they scare noone in the playoffs. They have poor rebounding and assuming IT doesn't get the same calls he gets in the regular season, their offense can be shut-down fairly easily. Avery Bradley is the only player I'd want on Toronto.
                  Agreed. It boggles me how a Boston team that was beaten by a weak Hawks team last year, then swapped out Turner and Sully for Horford, could be considered a serious contender in the East above Toronto, Cleveland, or even Washington.

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                  • #99
                    President/gm rankings from espn. Ujiri and weltman came in 6th. #30 MAY SHOCK YOU

                    http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/1...t-ratings-1-30
                    It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

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                    • KeonClark wrote: View Post
                      President/gm rankings from espn. Ujiri and weltman came in 6th. #30 MAY SHOCK YOU

                      http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/1...t-ratings-1-30
                      How is Danny Ainge that high? Celtics did nothing at the trade deadline.

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                      • A.I wrote: View Post
                        How is Danny Ainge that high? Celtics did nothing at the trade deadline.
                        Ainge has made so many good moves over his tenure, it's not just looking at the trade deadline.

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                        • I think Ainge is slightly overvalued as a GM, but still very good. The heist of Brooklyn has propped up their asset base considerably (putting that mildly), and it may very well be the most lopsided trade of all time when it's all said and done, but I question how much of the deal can be accredited to Ainge's genius and how much of it was him being in the right place at the right time to take advantage of a desperate and incompetent Prokhorov in BK. Having said all that, he has done most other aspects of his job very well during his time in Boston. He's a very good executive.

                          And keep in mind that he did orchestrate another championship roster with Boston in the not too distant past as well, so I wouldn't exactly call him a one-hit wonder with the Nets trade. Ultimately this chapter of his GM tenure will be judged by what he's able to accomplish with the war chest of assets he's been able to accumulate. He certainly wouldn't be the first exec who we fawn over for a couple years with how many assets they've been able to assemble... only to have it never really translate into a championship level team (i.e Rob Hennigan or Ryan McDonough). The difference between those two and Ainge of course is that the Celtics are still enjoying a very successful season while they wait for his master plan to come to fruition, and Ainge certainly deserves credit for that.

                          There are already a lot of Celtics supporters who felt he was too passive at the trade deadline, so we'll have to see if his patience pays off. If this summer they sign Hayward, draft Fultz, and upgrade the rest of their roster using expendable assets, then their outlook changes drastically very quickly for the better, and anyone who was blasting him a month ago for standing pat will probably have to eat their words.

                          I'd still prefer Ujiri over Ainge because I think Masai's job is more difficult - building a contender with a previous laughing stock like the Raptors over the leagues 1B franchise in the Celtics - but they're comparable in terms of performance. Both fanbases should be grateful that they have someone like that in charge.
                          Last edited by Fully; Sun Apr 2nd, 2017, 12:08 PM.

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                          • Ainge, Griffin & Morey before Masai? Yecchhh. I am on the fence re Morey (his big move was joining Harden with D'Antoni imo), but think giving Masai the assets Ainge has and James who Griffin has....would have loved to see what MU would have accomplished?

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                            • Bendit wrote: View Post
                              Ainge, Griffin & Morey before Masai? Yecchhh. I am on the fence re Morey (his big move was joining Harden with D'Antoni imo), but think giving Masai the assets Ainge has and James who Griffin has....would have loved to see what MU would have accomplished?
                              Masai has completely changed the Raptors franchise. Got a terrific deal for Bargnani, traded away Rudy, and this season traded for 2 players who have completely changed the culture of this team for a bench player, an injured player and picks. I don't get how he isn't higher.

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                              • A.I wrote: View Post
                                Masai has completely changed the Raptors franchise. Got a terrific deal for Bargnani, traded away Rudy, and this season traded for 2 players who have completely changed the culture of this team for a bench player, an injured player and picks. I don't get how he isn't higher.
                                I hate to do this but I am gonna play the "Canada" card again. These people have blinders on quite often and forget there is a franchise here....or they just look at the current standings and place their tick marks. It's the same effing attitude as when placing DD at #46.

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