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  • chris
    replied
    MixxAOR wrote: View Post

    Sometimes it was injuries. And in some playoff games his teammates failed him. Doesn't matter what era
    i'm a pretty big proponent of the no-man-can-win-a-championship-by-himself school of thought but kareem in the 70's really should have. have a gander at some of the second and third best players on a few of those championship teams. most casual fans would have no idea who they are.

    he was playing with jamaal wilkes, adrian dantley, and norm nixon (two HOFers and a 2X allstar/champ), so it's not like he was on an island.

    the GOAT's gotta be able to handle marvin webster is what i'm saying, whoever the fuck that is

    Leave a comment:


  • MixxAOR
    replied
    chris wrote: View Post

    not winning more titles in a decade relatively bereft of talent is kind of an indictment though, no? we're talking about the GOAT, not someone just up there in the convo.

    some of those teams were bad, by championship standards. the fucking bullets won 44 games. the warriors won 48.

    he's the GOAT college player though, no doubt about that
    Sometimes it was injuries. And in some playoff games his teammates failed him. Doesn't matter what era

    Leave a comment:


  • chris
    replied
    MixxAOR wrote: View Post
    Meh nothing has convinced me that Kareem isn't up there in GOAT convo. Longevity like Lebron James. Defense. Offense. Accolades. Championships.
    not winning more titles in a decade relatively bereft of talent is kind of an indictment though, no? we're talking about the GOAT, not someone just up there in the convo.

    some of those teams were bad, by championship standards. the fucking bullets won 44 games. the warriors won 48.

    he's the GOAT college player though, no doubt about that

    Leave a comment:


  • The Great One
    replied
    Let me get back to the real topic, if you are posting a black square in your social media but not saying anything else, not sharing info, not donating or looking for other ways you can lend your support, then it does nothing it means nothing. I've already donated to 1 organization. Don't just post a black square because everyone's doing it.

    Ways you can help:

    Donate
    Sign Petitions
    Text or call

    Leave a comment:


  • MixxAOR
    replied
    Meh nothing has convinced me that Kareem isn't up there in GOAT convo. Longevity like Lebron James. Defense. Offense. Accolades. Championships.

    Leave a comment:


  • The Great One
    replied
    If you're great you gotta be able to lead your team to multiple championships as the man. That's why MJ, Bird, LeBron, Magic and Duncan are my top 5 players of all time. MJ's Bulls, Bird's Celtics, Magic's Lakers and Duncan's Spurs team became a dynasty because of them. LeBron was never part of a dynasty but 8 straight NBA Finals appearance as the main guy? that will never happen again.

    Leave a comment:


  • The Great One
    replied
    KeonClark wrote: View Post

    You've said this many times, magic was the big dog in the 80s in LA, conveniently leaving out that Kareems greatness was made in the 70s, a lot of that in Wisconsin
    He's put up great numbers there no doubt. But it's not like he's won 6 chips in his 6 years there. He's only won one. But back to his Lakers career. Look at the Lakers record with him as "the man" from 75 to 79. 40-42, 53-29, 45-37, 47-35. They were mediocre. ONE 50 win season. Zero championships. Heck, the Raptors had 3-4 50 win seasons with Kyle Lowry as the man.

    Leave a comment:


  • chris
    replied
    KeonClark wrote: View Post

    You've said this many times, magic was the big dog in the 80s in LA, conveniently leaving out that Kareems greatness was made in the 70s, a lot of that in Wisconsin
    yup. 5.5 of his 6 mvp's were in the 70's.

    apart from kareem, is there another player in the top 30 or 40 nba players of all time who played his best years in the 70's, other than two great years of bill walton? it's easily the worst decade of nba competition after the 50's.

    Leave a comment:


  • KeonClark
    replied
    The Great One wrote: View Post

    Except it worked. Magic's already won TWO championships before Worthy arrived. His first championship, his rookie year, Worthy wasn't even in the league yet. Game 6 close out game against Philly in the Finals, Kareem didn't play because of an injury, that was the game were Magic played center. I think he finished with 42/15/7 in that game.

    As I said, Magic was Showtime. They called it Showtime because of his style of play. Not because of Kareem's skyhook lol. Magic was the one that transformed that franchise. The Lakers were just another team before he arrived.
    You've said this many times, magic was the big dog in the 80s in LA, conveniently leaving out that Kareems greatness was made in the 70s, a lot of that in Wisconsin

    Leave a comment:


  • The Great One
    replied
    MixxAOR wrote: View Post
    Media will make you believe a lot of things. They gravitated towards Magic because of his talent and personality. But without James Worthy and Kareem "Showtime" wouldn't work. Defensively Kareem was elite defender , shot blocker. Numerous all defensive first team and second team. 3rd leading all time rebounder. Third all time in blocks. 6 MVPs, 2 FMVP with Bucks and Lakers.
    Except it worked. Magic's already won TWO championships before Worthy arrived. His first championship, his rookie year, Worthy wasn't even in the league yet. Game 6 close out game against Philly in the Finals, Kareem didn't play because of an injury, that was the game were Magic played center. I think he finished with 42/15/7 in that game.

    As I said, Magic was Showtime. They called it Showtime because of his style of play. Not because of Kareem's skyhook lol. Magic was the one that transformed that franchise. The Lakers were just another team before he arrived.

    Leave a comment:


  • S.R.
    replied
    golden wrote: View Post

    With great power comes great responsibility. Sorry MJ... that's the deal.
    Naw, I disagree there. On any topic, some people (for whom the subject matter is not their day job) are thoughtful and worth listening to and some aren't. I don't care if the thoughtful ones speaking out on race and police violence are basketball players or not.

    My Twitter feed is pretty diverse. I've got journalists, politicians, athletes, sports execs, community activists, veterans, authors, comedians, regular people, etc. I follow the people whose opinions and thoughtfulness I value. I try to keep some diversity in the feed to keep myself out of feedback loops. Michael Jordan isn't somebody I follow on any form of media and I don't really care. He played basketball, he won rings, he sold shoes. He's great at those things. He's (probably) nobody's civil rights hero. I don't have an issue with that and it doesn't affect the basketball GOAT conversation at all for me. I guess I can understand for some if some level of community leadership is a component of your basketball GOAT argument? I wouldn't agree but I suppose you could make a case for that.

    And for sure I'd say something like, from the distance I'm at, I respect someone like Masai as a man and a human being more than I do MJ. But that MJ was a severe competitor to the point of making him fairly flawed as a man is pretty well acknowledged, I think. The guy has personal beefs that last decades. The same trait made him great on the basketball court. I'm a pretty big fan of Michael Jordan the basketball player. I don't need him to be something he's not in his personal life (as long as there's a minimum level of decency, obviously).
    Last edited by S.R.; Tue Jun 2nd, 2020, 02:57 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • MixxAOR
    replied
    Media will make you believe a lot of things. They gravitated towards Magic because of his talent and personality. But without James Worthy and Kareem "Showtime" wouldn't work. Defensively Kareem was elite defender , shot blocker. Numerous all defensive first team and second team. 3rd leading all time rebounder. Third all time in blocks. 6 MVPs, 2 FMVP with Bucks and Lakers.

    Leave a comment:


  • The Great One
    replied
    And I know some here will bring up Kareem's stats again. And this will be the last that I'm going to talk about this. He won 5 championships in LA, all of them as Magic's sidekick. These are just facts. "Showtime Lakers" was Magic's team. They called it Showtime because of Magic lol.

    Leave a comment:


  • The Great One
    replied
    It's an idiotic argument. Just like MJ, Wayne Gretzky never speaks on social issues. Ever. Evander Kane on the other hand is pretty active about this situation that is going on right now. Is Kane now the NHL GOAT? some people here seriously need to use their brain man.

    Roberto Clemente is a legend, great humanitarian just like Kareem. MLB even named an award for him. Great baseball player but GOAT? better than Babe Ruth, Ty Cobb? Willie Mays? Ted Williams? Mickey Mantle? no.

    Is Jaylen Brown in the GOAT debate now too? Brown > MJ?

    Leave a comment:


  • golden
    replied
    S.R. wrote: View Post

    He's got a video and a statement up on his Twitter account - http://twitter.com/Jumpman23

    Politics & social engagement have never been in his wheelhouse, he won basketball games and sold shoes and Gatorade.

    Players are different. This is a general statement and not directed at you golden, but I get uncomfortable with the shift to an expectation for everybody to make statements and to make certain kinds of statements. The social pressure means you can trust anybody's authenticity after that point. Who's saying what they mean and who's had PR help to avoid brand damage? You can't know anymore once you demand everybody say something. Even Fox News is releasing statements at this point.
    With great power comes great responsibility. Sorry MJ... that's the deal.

    The world has just finished fellating MJ for the past month or so. After decades of doing already doing that. The least MJ could do is take even a lukewarm stand and call out the cops. You know, like offend somebody who deserves to be offended. Show that you really care. Like, just for once, MJ. The world has given you love and billions. It's the least you can do.

    I do get what you're saying.... MJ is just being authentic, as always with boilerplate platitudes. And that authenticity continues to reveal his true character.... which looks a lot like shallowness, greed and petty ego.

    Leave a comment:

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