Continuity = Asset Accumulation

[mcHAPPY]

Not sure if this was already said, but if they amnesty Boozer they still have to pay the 16 or 17M still left on his contract. If they trade for unguaranteed deals like Salmons and expirings, that's less money that needs to be paid. Plus they still have their amnesty clause if they need it later.

Exactly except amnesty clause is of no use after.

Only something like 8 players left in league to use amnesty on.

Had to have been under contract before lockout.

[imanshumpert]

Exactly except amnesty clause is of no use after.

Only something like 8 players left in league to use amnesty on.

Had to have been under contract before lockout.

True, I was actually thinking about this as I made my post. Do the Bulls even have any amnesty eligible players? I don't think they're the type of team to use it anyway, they're usually pretty stingy about money and probably wouldn't want to pay a guy to play for another team.

[mcHAPPY]

True, I was actually thinking about this as I made my post. Do the Bulls even have any amnesty eligible players? I don't think they're the type of team to use it anyway, they're usually pretty stingy about money and probably wouldn't want to pay a guy to play for another team.

Boozer and Noah.... That's it

[DanH]

Just wanted to applaud this post. All great ideas. Hope at least one goes through. Exactly the approach I expect Ujiri to take.

[Mindlessness]

My post makes a few assumptions and takes a number of TL/MU statements at face value:

1) Masai is going to build with the core currently in place for another year or two: KL, DD, AJ, TR, JV, PP, GV;
2) Lowry will be resigned as per TL comments;
3) Masai intends to build through the draft.


All these threads going up on getting a lottery pick neglects the Raptors have to send away numerous assets. That goes 100% against everything the front office and top brass have been preaching. I believe Masai when he says the Raptors won't be stuck in no man's land. What the Raptors are currently doing, in my opinion, is accumulating assets.

I expect draft night to see the Raptors get another draft pick on draft night via trade. This year's draft is very deep. There are a number of talented players in the 2nd half of the 1st round (#15-30). To get anything #1-14, the Raptors are going to have to give up pieces of their core. Sending out 2 or 3 assets to return 1, and an unproven one at that, goes against the idea of asset accumulation.

The following are the types of trades I think make much more sense than #1 or #8 or anything in the lottery:


#16 - Chicago

Boozer, #16, #19 for Salmons, Hansbrough, Buycks, Stone, #20

Bulls waive all 4 players and save about $16M off their cap and books.


#21 and/or #29 - OKC

Perkins, #21 and/or #29 for Salmons and (maybe) #20


#22 - Memphis*

Prince and #22 for Salmons


#25 - Houston*

Lin and/or Asik, #25 for Salmons and/or Hansbrough, Buycks, Stone, #37


#26 - Miami*

#26 for #37


#28 - LA Clippers*

Dudley and #28 for Gay TPE


#30 - San Antonio

Bahahahaha, the Spurs don't trade picks, silly!


* All sniffing luxury tax.


Personally, I would be ecstatic if the Raptors can pull off the above Bulls trade, the Clippers trade, and/or the Heat trade. Bring in 2 first round picks for next year and stash one/two more in Europe. It is all about ASSET ACCUMULATION. When the time is right, Masai has a cupboard full of assets to improve by trade and with a roster full of cheap rookie contract talent he also has the ability to improve with cap space deals (unbalanced trades or free agent signing).



In summary, ASSET ACCUMULATION is the name of the game right now. Any trade that sends out more assets than it brings in is a no-no. Patience.

If a RFA is offer sheeted and the team who owns his right does not match, do they get compensation?

Because instead of #25, I'd rather get Terrence Jones then get whatever compensation from Patterson we can get.

If not then, still, try for Jones, I like him.

[mcHAPPY]

If a RFA is offer sheeted and the team who owns his right does not match, do they get compensation?

Because instead of #25, I'd rather get Terrence Jones then get whatever compensation from Patterson we can get.

If not then, still, try for Jones, I like him.

No compensation.... unless they agree to a sign and trade but that is not mandatory. A lot of times a team losing the player will agree to sign and trade so they at least get something in return, even if it is just a TPE. The signing team often looks to S&T because they don't have to renounce cap holds or exceptions to clear cap space to sign the player outright.

I like Jones too.

[Heatdreamer]

Salmons + hansborough + Fields + 1st pick in 2016 = Jason Terry + Williams + Outlaw +# 8 pick in 2014 draft

Toronto salaries total 16.3 million = 15.2 plus 1st round pick very similar salary cap.

Toronto : KL, DD , TRoss, AJ,JV - total salaries 33 million
: Vasquez , JTerry, Patrick Patterson, Novak , Hayes - 25 million
: Outlaw+Williams + 2 1st round picks- 13 million
: decolo 1.5 million. Total salaries for 72.5 million for 2014.

2015 raptors : KL , DD , TRoss, JV , Vasquez , Patterson ,Novak , 2014 -2 1st round picks plus 2015- 1st round pick 42.5 million plus the cost of the picks plus 8 million for Dereck Williams. Projected Salary Cap is 66 million and luxury tax is 80 million.
Lots of room for 2015 Free agents.
Imagine your starting in 2014 : KL , DD, TRoss, AJ and JV -second team Vasquez , Terry, Aaron Gordon , Patrick Patterson , adrien Payne . Williams, outlaw , Hayes, Novak + Decolo.

[Mindlessness]

No compensation.... unless they agree to a sign and trade but that is not mandatory. A lot of times a team losing the player will agree to sign and trade so they at least get something in return, even if it is just a TPE. The signing team often looks to S&T because they don't have to renounce cap holds or exceptions to clear cap space to sign the player outright.

I like Jones too.

Sorry, I follow hockey even more closely than I do basketball, and in hockey you get compensation.
Anyways, Jones would be a great target to me. And he's best friends with Ross, so, y'know. Added incentive I s'pose.

[mcHAPPY]

Matt

Rumours have been Chicago will look to trade Boozer rather than amnesty. That is a difficult task considering his contract, declining production, and defensive limitations.

Would Chicago bite on a trade such as the following with Toronto (after Minnesota wants no part of a Love-Boozer trade):

Chicago receives Salmons, Hansbrough, Stone, Buycks, #20

Toronto receives Boozer, #16, #19

The Bulls could waive all 4 players and save $14.8M plus the difference between picks 16/19 and 20.

What do you think?

Steve Kyler

Chicago is not giving up two first round picks to get rid of Boozer… there are teams that would trade for Carlos. His money is part of it, but he is an ending contract, so its not like you are trading for $40 million owed to Boozer.

Equally I would be STUNNED if Masai took on Boozer… that does not fit with anything they are doing.


Read more at http://www.basketballinsiders.com/ch...AyOB5Iusdt2.99

Steve Kyler not so enthused by the idea.

I am not sure he really gave it much thought based on the reading of his answer. Bulls giving up 1 first round pick, not two.

[CalgaryRapsFan]

Steve Kyler not so enthused by the idea.

I am not sure he really gave it much thought based on the reading of his answer. Bulls giving up 1 first round pick, not two.

It's a tough predicament. If I was a Chicago fan, I could argue that trading Boozer (still a decent player, on an expiring contract) for just cap space might be worth moving down a few spots, but not moving down a few spots AND giving up a 1st round pick.

From a Toronto perspective, would such a deal be worthwhile if the #19 pick was removed? Would a year of Boozer be worth moving up 4 spots in the draft, from #20 to #16? Or, could such a deal be done with just #19 and #37?

Also, on a related note, would bringing in Boozer mean that either Amir or Patterson is gone? I'd hate to sacrifice either of them for Boozer and a limited move in the draft, considering that Boozer is gone in a year or less. I suppose a subsequent trade is possible, to cash-in one of them. This is why I contemplated including Amir in a deal for Boozer, as a way to justify asking for both #16 and #19 (net gain of 1 1st round pick, along with a move up from #20), while clearing the PF logjam (assuming Patterson gets re-signed). Amir is also an expiring contract, who would form a solid 3-headed 'big' monster for Chicago, along with Noah and Gibson.

It's so hard to discuss with such a lack of knowledge about the true value of draft picks and/or players...

[planetmars]

Steve Kyler not so enthused by the idea.

I am not sure he really gave it much thought based on the reading of his answer. Bulls giving up 1 first round pick, not two.

I'd be very curious to know who would actually be interested in Boozer and his $16.8M contract. This assumes that Chicago would only trade him such that they do not get anything back.

Boozer is not what MU is looking - so I agree there.. but if MU is trying to obtain a second 2014 first round pick without giving up his core.. than I don't see a better method than taking on a bloated contract. Boozer could actually be useful in certain situations. He'd be as useful as TH was but would be much more of an offensive threat.

[planetmars]

It's a tough predicament. If I was a Chicago fan, I could argue that trading Boozer (still a decent player, on an expiring contract) for just cap space might be worth moving down a few spots, but not moving down a few spots AND giving up a 1st round pick.

From a Toronto perspective, would such a deal be worthwhile if the #19 pick was removed? Would a year of Boozer be worth moving up 4 spots in the draft, from #20 to #16? Or, could such a deal be done with just #19 and #37?

Also, on a related note, would bringing in Boozer mean that either Amir or Patterson is gone? I'd hate to sacrifice either of them for Boozer and a limited move in the draft, considering that Boozer is gone in a year or less. I suppose a subsequent trade is possible, to cash-in one of them. This is why I contemplated including Amir in a deal for Boozer, as a way to justify asking for both #16 and #19 (net gain of 1 1st round pick, along with a move up from #20), while clearing the PF logjam (assuming Patterson gets re-signed). Amir is also an expiring contract, who would form a solid 3-headed 'big' monster for Chicago, along with Noah and Gibson.

It's so hard to discuss with such a lack of knowledge about the true value of draft picks and/or players...

With Chicago having 2 picks, I don't think Toronto needs to be greedy by trying to swap 19/20 as well.

A simple Boozer/16 for our non-guaranteed scrubs I think would work for both teams. Toronto than has 16/20/37/59 going into this draft.. they could package 2-3 of these to get even higher or draft a couple of Euro-stashes.

I would treat Carlos like we treated Tyler.. basically 15mpg and coming off the bench. I would not give Chicago Amir for their picks.. Amir is too valuable to this team especially with JV still growing.

[Heatdreamer]

Would you prefer Boozer or Perkins 16th or 21 st pick ?

[JordanMariam14]

Boozer isn't bad, he was still putting up ok numbers this season, we'll benefit with his veteran toughness, especially if he works hard and fights for the team like everyone else on the team.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

[magoon]

The problem with Boozer is that he basically makes any further teambuilding difficult. To wit:

Say we trade Hansbrough, Salmons, Buycks and Novak to Chicago for Boozer and the #16, which is a reasonable offer because it means Boozer's 17m hit to Chicago drops to 5.5 (Novak's 3.5 plus the 2m to get rid of Salmons, Buycks and Psycho T). The problem is this: assuming we bring back Amir (which of course we do), our team salary before we sign any free agents or rookies is $52.1m - only $11m under the projected cap of $63m, and only $25m under the projected luxury tax of $77m.

So in that $25m - because you really don't want to go into the tax this year, the team isn't yet at the point where the tax makes sense - you need to pay Kyle, 2Pat and Vasquez (and De Colo?), plus rooks, plus maybe a mid-level exception free agent signing like Vince Carter.

Like, you'd need the following structure:

11m Kyle
3.5m Vasquez
3.5m 2Pat
3m MLE free agent
3m for all the rooks
1m De Colo

Not impossible, but it's very, very tight and leaves absolutely no room for error. And of course, the timing of actually signing all these guys becomes extremely important because now you have to negotiate our returning free agents' cap holds - until we sign our returning FAs (or renounce our Bird rights) we effectively can't sign any other free agents. Luckily our Bird rights on the FAs and rook signings all count as cap exceptions, along with the MLE - but we're definitely tight nonetheless.