Game #24: Los Angeles Clippers 112 - Toronto Raptors 92

[RandomGuy]

I like how we won a chip, are on pace for 54 wins with several key young pieces crushing it, a COY candidate behind the bench, and at the first sign of adversity it's time to tank.

Like come on now. Even if we were to trade the vets for young prospects we would still be a formidable team. If Pascal and Freddy and OG and Norm had all completely shit the bed this season then you could make that argument, but they are killing it.

Yes! This board right now needs more rational thinking than this emotional reactionism.

[Nilanka]

Coming into the season, we were supposed to compete for a top 4 seed. That hasn't changed. We're still one of the better teams in the league, but it's clear we're not a championship contender.

Let's see what Masai does at the deadline (if anything), and hopefully we can put a scare into the 76ers and/or Bucks come May.

[golden]

I like how we won a chip, are on pace for 54 wins with several key young pieces crushing it, a COY candidate behind the bench, and at the first sign of adversity it's time to tank.

Like come on now. Even if we were to trade the vets for young prospects we would still be a formidable team. If Pascal and Freddy and OG and Norm had all completely shit the bed this season then you could make that argument, but they are killing it.

I will never, ever support tanking. Ever. But as you say, unloading the vets wouldn't be a tanking move, IMO. It would be about freeing up development minutes for all the young guys, and also to confirm if Fred really deserves his $20M+ as the franchise PG.

It would also allow Nurse to coach freely without having to tread carefully on the egos of the veteran players, who've earned their respect in the league. I mean, if Lowry plays like sh*t on defense, does anybody think Nurse can hold him accountable? lol. Nurse was so scared of Lowry he asked Danny & Kawhi to intervene last year to hopefully get Kyle to be less disruptive in practice.

[planetmars]

At least these losses are happening now and not in February/March. But the way were losing has become so deflating. Our offense grinds to a halt. They have guys that just keep bricking shots. OG was a .500% 3pt shooter and went 1-7. Lowry was 0-7. Pascal was 1-4. I mean shooting is an essential key aspect of Nurse's offence. Norm has some how become our most consistent shooter right now. TD can shoot but he's so low on Nurse's totem pole that it doesn't matter.

Lowry has his issues defensively.. but we had a good defensive game last night. That 3rd quarter defense was insane. George only had 13 points on 3-14 shooting. Kawhi only had 23 points and got most of those when they kept increasing their lead in the 3rd/4th. It was the offense that just completely sputtered. It's Serge that I have the issue with. He and Rondae cannot play together. Even if we get early form Serge, he is not a floor spacer. And he likes the same spots that Rondae likes. It's just bad spacing. And Serge is so slow. We don't get the run and gun that we got earlier which is what tires out teams. Pascal, Norm, OG, Fred, RHJ, TD all love to run. Marc is slow but he can lead the fast break. Serge can't.

Serge is supposed to be good when you're playing half court offense. But it's not working with the guys around him.

I'll give him more time.. we're playing some hapless teams coming up. But he's become a liability frankly.

I predicted a 45 win team so these losses aren't really that bad. But I thought it was the kids that would struggle not the vets. Serge needs to figure things out pretty quickly or we're going to continue to bleed points when he plays.


And why does Nurse have a boner for McCaw? I really don't understand why McCaw was on the court at all last night. His box score stats were atrocious. Like what is he bringing to the team? His defense isn't really that good. I recall a couple of blow buys on him. Give those minutes to TD. Terrence was actually a bright spot last night.

[Nilanka]

And why does Nurse have a boner for McCaw? I really don't understand why McCaw was on the court at all last night. His box score stats were atrocious. Like what is he bringing to the team? His defense isn't really that good. I recall a couple of blow buys on him. Give those minutes to TD. Terrence was actually a bright spot last night.

The management group has a boner for him as well. I don't get it either.

[MixxAOR]

I like how we won a chip, are on pace for 54 wins with several key young pieces crushing it, a COY candidate behind the bench, and at the first sign of adversity it's time to tank.

Like come on now. Even if we were to trade the vets for young prospects we would still be a formidable team. If Pascal and Freddy and OG and Norm had all completely shit the bed this season then you could make that argument, but they are killing it.

They are too good to tank. You are right. I just think Masai should look into unloading vets and try to get something (preferably picks). Results don't matter.

[The Great One]

Kyle Lowry will have big games here and there and WHEN that happens I'm sure the usual suspects here will say "that's why he's the best PG in the East" he's not even the best PG on his team lol. Freddy VanVleet is the better PG of the two and it ain't close either. So you can take all your Lowry is better than Kyrie and Ben Simmons dumb take and shove it up all your ass.

I don't care if the Raptors are in a top 4 spot come february. I don't care if Lowry scores 40 points in back to back games. I want Kyle Lowry OFF this team.

As for Kawhi Leonard, the tribute and the ceremony was very well done, it was classy. Also loved the MVP chants. A very classy gesture by the fans to the greatest player in franchise history. Kawhi Leonard is what a REAL all-star and MVP player looks like.

The only other player that should get an MVP chants in Toronto this year is when Vince Carter comes to town. That's it.

[golden]

Lowry has his issues defensively.. but we had a good defensive game last night. That 3rd quarter defense was insane. George only had 13 points on 3-14 shooting. Kawhi only had 23 points and got most of those when they kept increasing their lead in the 3rd/4th. It was the offense that just completely sputtered. It's Serge that I have the issue with. He and Rondae cannot play together. Even if we get early form Serge, he is not a floor spacer. And he likes the same spots that Rondae likes. It's just bad spacing. And Serge is so slow. We don't get the run and gun that we got earlier which is what tires out teams. Pascal, Norm, OG, Fred, RHJ, TD all love to run. Marc is slow but he can lead the fast break. Serge can't. Serge is supposed to be good when you're playing half court offense. But it's not working with the guys around him.

You basically summed up the issues in a nutshell. I'd add that Boucher is another guy that likes to run and he might be the fastest guy on the team. Nurse loves to play an attacking style and he wants his players play aggressive on both ends. Force turnovers, contests 3-pters, grab the ball and head up court immediately to put pressure on the opposition. We got a glimpse of Nurse's vision for a team and Lowry and Ibaka don't really fit that.

And that 'insane' 3rd quarter defense? Meh. Any player can play defense in "spurts", especially when you're way behind in front of the home crowd, mounting a faux comeback in an emotionally important game. The young guys showed they can play hard for close to 48 minutes. And without Serge, we were getting the energy boost when the bench came in. With Serge & Lowry on the second unit, we're getting a more deliberate & methodical style of play, which isn't working on either end of the floor.

Yeah, and it pains me to say that Serge might be done because I have made respect for him. He didn't get enough praise for being the only guy other than Kawhi to show up in game 7 of the Sixers series. If not for Serge, we don't get the FVV heroics and Lowry's legacy is forever etched as a playoff choker. Instead, we're now talking about $25-30M/yr for Fred and statues for Lowry. It was that close, folks.

[Rudy Bargnani]

The management group has a boner for him as well. I don't get it either.

McCaw had a -61 net rating. That’s not the best.

[G__Deane]

Not ready to blow up a vet or two yet but it has to be at the corner of their minds.
One thing that's subtle but I don't like is you don't see Pascal and Kyle low fiving when they leave the court, never smiling together, never even talking things over on the bench that I've seen. All these things I see with Pascal and FVV and the energy guys, they were having a blast together. Maybe the winning brought the chemistry and smiles not the other way around......

Kyle and Siakam don't seem to have that on court chemistry that's so hard to quantify.
"The players need to adjust to me" kinda pizzes me off to be honest when it should have been "the guys have been playing so well in my absence that I'm not going to disrupt the roll we're on. Just come in and do what I do but play hard on defense and keep up the energy that these guys have been bringing"

But he came across as a bit too me-first and self important. And it's not the first time.

[The Great One]

Yeah, and it pains me to say that Serge might be done because I have made respect for him. He didn't get enough praise for being the only guy other than Kawhi to show up in game 7 of the Sixers series. If not for Serge, we don't get the FVV heroics and Lowry's legacy is forever etched as a playoff choker. Instead, we're now talking about $25-30M/yr for Fred and statues for Lowry. It was that close, folks.

Honestly, the only thing that I remember about Game 7 other than "The Shot" was Kawhi Leonard taking 39 shots. He took 39 shots because all the players on the team including Lowry kept passing up open shots. It was embarassing to watch how scared they looked.

[golden]

They are too good to tank. You are right. I just think Masai should look into unloading vets and try to get something (preferably picks). Results don't matter.

At this point Masai, Tolzman & scouting staff don't even need to tank for top 5 picks. Without even using picks, we got 2 of the best rookies in the league this year (TD & Matt Thomas). And Dewan looks like an NBA rotation player as well - he could probably replace Serge in a year or 2.

I think Masai wanted to give the veterans a chance to prove they can defend the title, before the trade deadline. It's up to them to turn things around and show they're a legit contender.

[G__Deane]

Kyle Lowry will have big games here and there and WHEN that happens I'm sure the usual suspects here will say "that's why he's the best PG in the East" he's not even the best PG on his team lol. Freddy VanVleet is the better PG of the two and it ain't close either. So you can take all your Lowry is better than Kyrie and Ben Simmons dumb take and shove it up all your ass.

I don't care if the Raptors are in a top 4 spot come february. I don't care if Lowry scores 40 points in back to back games. I want Kyle Lowry OFF this team.

As for Kawhi Leonard, the tribute and the ceremony was very well done, it was classy. Also loved the MVP chants. A very classy gesture by the fans to the greatest player in franchise history. Kawhi Leonard is what a REAL all-star and MVP player looks like.

The only other player that should get an MVP chants in Toronto this year is when Vince Carter comes to town. That's it.

How can I agree and disagree with so much in 1 post?

[golden]

The management group has a boner for him as well. I don't get it either.

Three-Pat. Hat-Trick McCaw. He's luckier than a 5-leaf clover.

[The Great One]

How can I agree and disagree with so much in 1 post?

You know where I stand when it comes to Vince. He's the 2nd greatest player in franchise history. Second behind Kawhi obviously. I'm not changing my opinion man.