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  • oseebhai wrote: View Post
    So if we were to sign Durant first, we could then go over the cap to resign DD and our draft picks?
    Think they need to trade salaries out or renounce Demar to get enough space for Durant @ Max

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    • oseebhai wrote: View Post
      So if we were to sign Durant first, we could then go over the cap to resign DD and our draft picks?
      Just like you thought of that loophole, so did the writers of the CBA. So for any players you have the rights to, including draft picks, there is a cap hold (or dummy salary) that sits on your payroll to prevent you from doing just that. So DeMar counts as a 15M dollar contract that uses up our cap space this summer until we sign him. You can clear the cap of that cap hold by renouncing your rights to a player - at that point DD's 15M cap hold would disappear, and we could use the cap space to sign another team's free agent. But then we lose the ability to go over the cap to sign DeMar.
      twitter.com/dhackett1565

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      • 2016 and 2017

        2016/17:

        Jonas Valanciunas $14,382,024
        DeMarre Carroll $14,200,000
        Kyle Lowry $12,000,000
        Terrence Ross $10,000,000
        Cory Joseph $7,315,000
        Patrick Patterson $6,050,000
        Lucas Nogueira (BeBe) $1,921,320
        Bruno Caboclo $1,589,640
        Delon Wright $1,577,280
        Norman Powell $874,636

        Cap holds:

        DeMar DeRozan $15,075,000 (assuming he opts out of his player option)
        Luis Scola $3,480,000
        James Johnson $4,750,000
        Bismack Biyombo $3,376,800 (assuming he opts out of his player option)
        Nando de Colo $1,901,900 (cap hold; $1,828,750 QO)
        TOR 2016 1st round pick $1,301,900 (assumed 20th pick)
        NYK 2016 1st round pick $2,140,500 (assumed 10th pick)

        Above roster, if all free agents are let go: $73,895,771

        This equates to 15.2M in cap room. The 7-9 year vet max is 25.1M.

        2017/18:

        Jonas Valanciunas $15,460,675
        DeMarre Carroll $14,800,000
        Terrence Ross $10,500,000
        Cory Joseph $7,630,000
        Lucas Nogueira (BeBe) $2,947,305
        Bruno Caboclo $2,451,225
        Delon Wright $1,645,200
        Norman Powell $1,014,746 (unguaranteed)
        TOR 2016 1st round pick $1,632,480 (assumed 20th pick)
        NYK 2016 1st round pick $2,684,160 (assumed 10th pick)

        Cap holds:

        Kyle Lowry $18,000,000 (if he opts out)
        Patrick Patterson $9,075,000
        TOR 2017 1st round pick $1,347,400 (assumed 20th pick)
        LAC 2017 1st round pick $1,098,700 (assumed 25th pick)

        Above roster, if all free agents are let go: $63,211,891

        This equates to 44.8M in cap room, with three spots to fill. The 7-9 year vet max is 30.5M, the 10+ year max is 35.6M.

        Any salary added in 2016 that will extend into 2017 gets taken away from that cap room. Sign DD to a 20M flat deal, that 44.8M drops to 24.8M, less than the RFA max. Sign him to an even bigger deal and it obviously drops even lower.

        And that assumes Lowry walks, and Patterson, and anyone else signed in summer 2016 is only for a year.

        Obviously trades could, and probably should, happen between now and then, and that could free up (or tie up) salary in various ways.
        twitter.com/dhackett1565

        Comment


        • So to offer a 7-9 max with DD re-signed for ~20M per in 2017 (while retaining Lowry's cap hold). We'd need to move Carroll and Ross basically.

          Or you could simply just not have re-signed DD in 2016. Keep Lowry's cap hold on the books and clear out just Ross (which would give you about enough room for the 10+ max as well) or maybe a few prospects instead. Although in that scenario it likely imo becomes tougher to make pitches to free agents because you have no proven all-star players locked into contracts. And if you had signed someone in 2016 to remedy the loss of DeRozan to more than a 1 year deal, then Carroll would still need to be shipped.

          Interesting. This kind of reads to me as us being sort of fucked but I don't want to read it that way lol.
          Last edited by JWash; Wed Dec 23rd, 2015, 08:46 PM.

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          • Patterson will be 2016 Vasquez, IMO.

            I.e. Guy moved for draft picks and cap space.

            Comment


            • mcHAPPY wrote: View Post
              Patterson will be 2016 Vasquez, IMO.

              I.e. Guy moved for draft picks and cap space.
              Yeah I expect that to happen. But it doesn't change a lot. Even renouncing DD it wouldn't put us at max cap space.

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              • JWash wrote: View Post
                Yeah I expect that to happen. But it doesn't change a lot. Even renouncing DD it wouldn't put us at max cap space.
                Masai and Bobby Webster have more tricks than Penn and Teller.

                Trying to determine what they are going to do is a bigger exercise in futility than attempting to be objective in the DeRozan thread.

                We shall see what unfolds.

                Comment


                • mcHAPPY wrote: View Post
                  Masai and Bobby Webster have more tricks than Penn and Teller.

                  Trying to determine what they are going to do is a bigger exercise in futility than attempting to be objective in the DeRozan thread.

                  We shall see what unfolds.
                  Not saying definitively what they're going to do, just that it'd have to be more than just moving 2Pat to free up space that's all.

                  Comment


                  • I think Masai will resign DD at 20 mil. Than he will target another all-star to join the Kyle/DD combo. A player like DMC. Who already has a good relationship with DD. I've seen a couple pics of DMC holding DD's daughter on Instagram. Also Drake for some reason is attending a lot Sacramento games. Also Drake and DMC have that Kentucky connection. This all depends on how the team does in the playoffs. If Lowry/DD can prove that they can carry this team past the first and compete in the second. Than Masai will know his only one piece away from contending.

                    Basically, I don't think the next big contributor will come via free agency. It will be via trade. 2 first round picks this year. Two player extensions that add up to the max. Something got to give this summer.
                    @Chr1st1anL

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                    • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
                      I think Masai will resign DD at 20 mil. Than he will target another all-star to join the Kyle/DD combo. A player like DMC. Who already has a good relationship with DD. I've seen a couple pics of DMC holding DD's daughter on Instagram. Also Drake for some reason is attending a lot Sacramento games. Also Drake and DMC have that Kentucky connection. This all depends on how the team does in the playoffs. If Lowry/DD can prove that they can carry this team past the first and compete in the second. Than Masai will know his only one piece away from contending.

                      Basically, I don't think the next big contributor will come via free agency. It will be via trade. 2 first round picks this year. Two player extensions that add up to the max. Something got to give this summer.
                      zero chance derozan signs for $20M

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                      • KHD wrote: View Post
                        zero chance derozan signs for $20M
                        Why?

                        Comment


                        • Wouldnt say zero but it would be unexpected at this point given his production. However idk I thought jv would get near a Max as well in the offseason of 2016, but he ended up taking a lot less in his extension. However that scenario is quite different because jv was getting advance security while demar would already be tabling other offers up front.

                          Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk

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                          • Hey DanH are we sure Biyombo actually has a player option?

                            http://www.spotrac.com/nba/toronto-raptors/cap/2016/

                            It's not listed on spotrac, and looking at Woj's original article when we signed him, there's no mention of it http://sports.yahoo.com/news/sources...074216426.html

                            Hoopshype and BasketballInsiders show the player option though. Any other good sites to look at for confirmation?

                            EDIT: If it is the case that he doesn't have a player option, that would mean we could sign and trade for a max player without draining our "prospect cupboard".
                            Last edited by JWash; Sun Dec 27th, 2015, 05:14 PM.

                            Comment


                            • JWash wrote: View Post
                              Hey DanH are we sure Biyombo actually has a player option?

                              http://www.spotrac.com/nba/toronto-raptors/cap/2016/

                              It's not listed on spotrac, and looking at Woj's original article when we signed him, there's no mention of it http://sports.yahoo.com/news/sources...074216426.html

                              Hoopshype and BasketballInsiders show the player option though. Any other good sites to look at for confirmation?

                              EDIT: If it is the case that he doesn't have a player option, that would mean we could sign and trade for a max player without draining our "prospect cupboard".

                              Sportrac uses BasketballInsiders as a source, and they are pretty much gospel when it comes to contracts in my opinion. But, ESPN mentions it here too:

                              http://espn.go.com/blog/nba/post/_/i...being-a-raptor

                              Biyombo's contract will pay him $2.81 million for 2015-16 and he owns a player option worth $2.94 million for 2016-17.

                              Comment


                              • Spotrac is a garbage site that just recycles information from other sites, it's their entire model. Please don't use it, as you are taking page views from the sites that generate the information (used to be Sham, and since his seeming retirement, Basketball Insiders).

                                So, yes, he has a player option.
                                twitter.com/dhackett1565

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