Raptors Salary Cap Situation (and planning for the future)

[DanH]

Yeah, room, board, healthcare and per diem.

[raptors999]

Yeah, room, board, healthcare and per diem.

How about stamps. Are there free stamps?

[Bonus Jonas]

How about stamps. Are there free stamps?

If there's not the NBADLPA should do something about it immediately

[SkywalkerAC]

I see no reason Daniels shouldn't just be signed to the 905s. No, he doesn't make a fortune, but he needs to rehab, probably wants to continue playing with his new chums (Bruno et al), and then he needs to get playing. He doesn't have to worry about a whole heck of a lot, except rehabbing and playing ball, and he gets to work his way into the Raptors organization.

Question:
How much space do we have to offer Powell a 3+ year contract without waiving Nando's rights? And is it enough?

[DanH]

It is enough. We would need only 525k, we have about 700k with de Colo on the cap.

I'd be tempted to actually sign Daniels to a 1 year deal at the minimum (using the min salary exception). That keeps his rights and keeps him in the system while he rehabs (though in theory he should be healthy by training camp) and he can spend time down in the D-League while collecting a decent pay.

[SkywalkerAC]

It is enough. We would need only 525k, we have about 700k with de Colo on the cap.

I'd be tempted to actually sign Daniels to a 1 year deal at the minimum (using the min salary exception). That keeps his rights and keeps him in the system while he rehabs (though in theory he should be healthy by training camp) and he can spend time down in the D-League while collecting a decent pay.

Really? I'm not that tempted. It's still a cap hold next year, versus none if we have him wait, and a roster spot that could be used for the likes of Dorrell Wright, or simple flexibility. Do we really want 5 spots out of 15 taken up with the youth movement, especially when we can only send down a limited number to the 905s?

It seems reasonable to allocate 1 spot to our 2nd round rooks. If Daniels can beat out Norm in training camp, the spots all his.

Can we bump up his pay with a training camp contract? Or is the only avenue there one of these non-guaranteeds?

[DanH]

You'd have to go non-guaranteed, and in that case you lose his draft rights.

I would much prefer having Daniels there rather than a vet who will contribute nothing. Dorell Wright would be a good pickup, but I doubt he signs for the minimum.

Look at the playing time Fields and Stiemsma got last year. Those spots are never used.

In general, I would much prefer a young piece be signed to fill a depth role than a vet that every other team has decided is not worth spending an exception or cap room on.

[mcHAPPY]

You'd have to go non-guaranteed, and in that case you lose his draft rights.

I would much prefer having Daniels there rather than a vet who will contribute nothing. Dorell Wright would be a good pickup, but I doubt he signs for the minimum.

Look at the playing time Fields and Stiemsma got last year. Those spots are never used.

In general, I would much prefer a young piece be signed to fill a depth role than a vet that every other team has decided is not worth spending an exception or cap room on.

Good points.

And overall I agree.

However sometimes you can find real value on minimum deals as well.

Aminu and Ed Davis were just 2 examples last year.

[DanH]

Good points.

And overall I agree.

However sometimes you can find real value on minimum deals as well.

Aminu and Ed Davis were just 2 examples last year.

Yeah, you can find value, especially when you have a position of real need. But when you are 10 deep in legit NBA players, odds are that value might never see the floor even if there is value there to be found. Weighing the odds of needing a third string vet at a position for a long stretch (and considering the positional versatility of many of our players), as well as the odds of finding said diamond in the rough with a veteran minimum deal, against the benefits of establishing another young asset in your system... Seems like a no-brainer to me.

[SkywalkerAC]

Yeah, you can find value, especially when you have a position of real need. But when you are 10 deep in legit NBA players, odds are that value might never see the floor even if there is value there to be found. Weighing the odds of needing a third string vet at a position for a long stretch (and considering the positional versatility of many of our players), as well as the odds of finding said diamond in the rough with a veteran minimum deal, against the benefits of establishing another young asset in your system... Seems like a no-brainer to me.

But Daniels is still an asset in your system if he just signs with the 905s, arguably more of one with his clock not started. That would allow you to have 4 of your youth development program playing together in the D-league rather than just 3 at a time.

[DanH]

But Daniels is still an asset in your system if he just signs with the 905s, arguably more of one with his clock not started. That would allow you to have 4 of your youth development program playing together in the D-league rather than just 3 at a time.

And how do you convince him to sign with the 905? He already took direction last year to sign with an Australian team (where he would make less than he would in Europe), probably on the promise of an NBA deal this summer. To ask him to take a 25k salary would be insulting.

Keep in mind to keep his rights the Raptors have to extend a qualifying tender - an unguaranteed 1 year minimum deal. Sure, if he signs it you could waive him, but then you don't have any rights to him and he can go sign wherever he wants.

It is rare to be able to pull off what you are suggesting, as any player good enough to be drafted is usually good enough to get paid a decent wage somewhere. It is the undrafted players that take the chance of the D-League contract, mostly, hoping to be seen by an NBA team and get a 10 day callup (in which they would make more than they would make for the entire year in the D-League) or potentially more, since their earning potential elsewhere is so low.

Daniels already took one for the team last season by not signing his qualifying tender, allowing us to retain his rights. But you start pushing him backwards instead of forward (as a D-League signing would surely be), and that good will can disappear quickly.

[SkywalkerAC]

And how do you convince him to sign with the 905? He already took direction last year to sign with an Australian team (where he would make less than he would in Europe), probably on the promise of an NBA deal this summer. To ask him to take a 25k salary would be insulting.

Keep in mind to keep his rights the Raptors have to extend a qualifying tender - an unguaranteed 1 year minimum deal. Sure, if he signs it you could waive him, but then you don't have any rights to him and he can go sign wherever he wants.

It is rare to be able to pull off what you are suggesting, as any player good enough to be drafted is usually good enough to get paid a decent wage somewhere. It is the undrafted players that take the chance of the D-League contract, mostly, hoping to be seen by an NBA team and get a 10 day callup (in which they would make more than they would make for the entire year in the D-League) or potentially more, since their earning potential elsewhere is so low.

Daniels already took one for the team last season by not signing his qualifying tender, allowing us to retain his rights. But you start pushing him backwards instead of forward (as a D-League signing would surely be), and that good will can disappear quickly.

2nd rounders have to be extended qualifying offers? That's news to me.

This is a rare situation, with the best comparison being Thanassis. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think NYC's development team is also in their back yard. If Daniels hadn't gotten hurt, and Powell hadn't vaulted over him, I'd be all for adding him to the roster. But stuff happened, and a hobbled Daniels isn't in the best position to negotiate. He is, however, in a good place to get cared for and develop his game, even if he can't get rich doing so.

The Raptors should want to make the best use of the 905s as is possible, and that includes having 2nd rounders play there before signing to engender themselves to the organization and the other players. Now, maybe Daniels was told that he'd be signed, and maybe that's an agreement you honour. Otherwise, it makes sense to ask your 2nd rounders to try to make the main squad and play for the 905s or elsewhere if they can't.

[Katman]

I would prefer they keep one roster spot open to better facilitate a trade tis season or sign someone to 10 days to plug holes as the needs arise.

[DanH]

I would prefer they keep one roster spot open to better facilitate a trade tis season or sign someone to 10 days to plug holes as the needs arise.

But they could waive a guy anytime. If Daniels for example was not working out, and they wanted to do a trade with more incoming players, they would just waive him first.

[DanH]

With Biyombo becoming official, that confirms that the Raptors kept de Colo's rights and signed Powell to between the min and 700k. They have one roster spot left and can only offer the minimum exception (max two years). Or trade guys, as always. In theory they could sign de Colo but that seems unlikely.