S.R. wrote:
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Vince Carter's Retirement
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it's one of the weirder careers i can recall, closely split about 50/50 between being a huge star and a journeyman role player. closest analogue i can think of is maybe grant hill, but catastrophic injuries divided his career so that made sense. maybe ray allen, but the portion of his career spent as role player was comparatively way shorter.
anyhow definitely a HOFer, don't really think it's a first ballot resume. depending on the year and the class it could be.
i don't think they'll sign him to a one day, at least i wouldn't. agree with poster earlier that's something we would have done a few years ago, back when we were hanging atlantic division banners.
they should retire his jersey in a nice ceremony at some point. though i'm in favor of this being a few years down the line. KLOE should be first raptor jersey retired.
in the immediate short term release a statement about his contributions and impact on basketball in canada
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The Great One wrote: View Post
Next stop: number 15 gets raised to the rafters in Toronto. This is a no brainer. Question is WHEN not if because this pandemic has changed everything.
I hope he signs a 1 day contract with the Raptors like when Halladay signed a 1 day contract with the Blue Jays when he retired.
What uniform will Vince wear....there were so many highlights in other unis
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G__Deane wrote: View Post
We know what happened with Roy's HoF induction when Brandy didn't honour his wishes to enter as a Blue Jay.
What uniform will Vince wear....there were so many highlights in other unisMamba Mentality
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Sonny wrote: View PostI think they're going to retire his number as well. I think Kloe, DD and Vince's numbers will all be retired one day.
Kawhi
Lowry
Vince
These three are no brainer.
I'm 50-50 on DeRozan.Mamba Mentality
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The Great One wrote: View Post
Yeah man, Halladay signed a 1 day contract 8 years ago so he can retire a Blue Jay. I watched that press conference. He said that if he gets inducted into the hall, he'd go in as a Blue Jay. That's what he said, it was on video. So I don't know what happened, when they inducted him into the hall last year, they didn't put a logo on his cap.
Before some yahoo says "I think his wife knew his choice more than we did" she took a lot of heat for the decision and for sure would have said Roy had changed his mind, we had talked about it" etc if it ever happened. She's American, he played in Philly, his kids are American, she made a pizz poor decision on her own imo.
"We decided. We talked about it," Halladay's wife, Brandy, said after the news conference, flanked by her sons. "There's no way to decide between the two teams, and I know we've spent the majority of our time in Toronto. Toronto gave us that chance, that base at the start, but Philly also gave us a chance to win and the passion that we wanted, and there's no way to choose and so we decided that he'll go in with no team."
I read all her statements and interviews. Not once did she say Roy changed his mind. She said "we decided" after he died. She simply decided not to honour his wishes and should be ashamed of herself.
https://www.cbc.ca/sports/baseball/m...aque-1.4990227
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chris wrote: View Postit's one of the weirder careers i can recall, closely split about 50/50 between being a huge star and a journeyman role player. closest analogue i can think of is maybe grant hill, but catastrophic injuries divided his career so that made sense. maybe ray allen, but the portion of his career spent as role player was comparatively way shorter.
anyhow definitely a HOFer, don't really think it's a first ballot resume. depending on the year and the class it could be.
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G__Deane wrote: View Post
Brandy said she decided it was better for him to go in with no logo on his cap.
Before some yahoo says "I think his wife knew his choice more than we did" she took a lot of heat for the decision and for sure would have said Roy had changed his mind, we had talked about it" etc if it ever happened. She's American, he played in Philly, his kids are American, she made a pizz poor decision on her own imo.
"We decided. We talked about it," Halladay's wife, Brandy, said after the news conference, flanked by her sons. "There's no way to decide between the two teams, and I know we've spent the majority of our time in Toronto. Toronto gave us that chance, that base at the start, but Philly also gave us a chance to win and the passion that we wanted, and there's no way to choose and so we decided that he'll go in with no team."
I read all her statements and interviews. Not once did she say Roy changed his mind. She said "we decided" after he died. She simply decided not to honour his wishes and should be ashamed of herself.
https://www.cbc.ca/sports/baseball/m...aque-1.4990227Mamba Mentality
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The Great One wrote: View Post
Complete BS imo. Roy said it himself that if he gets inducted into the hall he'd go in with the Blue Jays logo on his hall of fame plaque. That's why he retired a Blue Jay. He was a Blue Jay, he spent most of his career in Toronto. He had a cup of coffee in Philly, just like Paul Molitor had a cup of coffee in Toronto. Molitor didn't enter the hall without a logo on his cap.
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G__Deane wrote: View Post
Brandy said she decided it was better for him to go in with no logo on his cap.
Before some yahoo says "I think his wife knew his choice more than we did" she took a lot of heat for the decision and for sure would have said Roy had changed his mind, we had talked about it" etc if it ever happened. She's American, he played in Philly, his kids are American, she made a pizz poor decision on her own imo.
"We decided. We talked about it," Halladay's wife, Brandy, said after the news conference, flanked by her sons. "There's no way to decide between the two teams, and I know we've spent the majority of our time in Toronto. Toronto gave us that chance, that base at the start, but Philly also gave us a chance to win and the passion that we wanted, and there's no way to choose and so we decided that he'll go in with no team."
I read all her statements and interviews. Not once did she say Roy changed his mind. She said "we decided" after he died. She simply decided not to honour his wishes and should be ashamed of herself.
https://www.cbc.ca/sports/baseball/m...aque-1.4990227
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golden wrote: View Post
If Halladay had actually won a World Series, I could see the argument for the Phillies. But he never even made it to the big stage. And 2 out of his 4 years in Philly, he never even made the playoffs. Even then, he only appeared in 5 post-season games. That's it. 5 games. You blow off the Jays for 5 playoff games with the Phillies? I wouldn't be surprised if there's something between Brandy and someone in the Jays front-office or ownership at the time that's not being said here. Feels like somebody's being petty or holding a grudge about something we don't know about.
Bottom line is we know Roy's wishes, she never said they changed, she said screw it to his wishes. It's in the past, she has to live with herself but I would have loved someone in the media to have the balls to ask "what about his stated wishes in the interview?"
Too close to his death I suppose.
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Vince is obviously such a polarizing figure.
The thing that I'm not hearing enough of in the conversation about him going to the hall, amidst the point totals, the all-star selections, and the lack of winning in the postseason, is how astonishingly superhuman he was. He was the human highlight reel. He was MUST SEE TV. In a way that really, nobody had been since Jordan. (yes, Kobe was.) It's a shame he didn't have the killer instinct of a Michael or a Kobe... but he certainly had the other-worldly, astonishing athleticism. There's no doubt for me that one of the primary reasons I've grown to appreciate basketball over say hockey is the unbelievable, mind-bending feats of athleticism. Vince Carter jumping over the 7-foot centre is without a doubt the best in-game dunk I've ever seen. It defies comprehension. But he was doing absolutely astounding shit every single day. One of the biggest things basketball has going for it, maybe the biggest thing is that astonishment factor. And Vince took things to another level. And that's why he's going to the hall.
I'm not saying you put a Corey Magette or a friggin Darius Miles or an Aaron Gordon in just cause they could dunk. But Vince, in his moment, was the single greatest entertainer in the NBA. And while I wish that we could've built a better organization sooner and he'd stayed with us and he got his ring and his legit accolades and achievements for an indisputable resume --- the NBA has become a league that's also based largely on entertainment. And Vince is one of the greatest entertainers the league has ever seen.
If I have to pin-point it ... this is about the moment the doors to the hall opened to him:
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The more I think about it, it just makes so much sense that Vince went on to become the only player to span 4 decades in the league. Because while the gates swung open for him at that moment, in order to pass through those doors he knew full well he'd have to run this league like the longest marathon in order to secure his place in the hall. His lack of winning on the big stage held too much of a possibility of dashing those dreams.
But he did it. And whether it's first or second ballot, he's a HOFer.
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To the other points...
I don't think he signs a one-day here. I don't know that he or the Raptors will really ultimately need that. He had his own journey. It started here. ...It travelled more places than Forrest Gump. And I think there's something fitting about him ending his career in ATL, where he mentored younger players and in a city which is one of the more important sites in this movement against anti-black racism in the states. That said, I hope and trust that he goes to the Hall as a Raptor.
I think you retire his number first, yup. Primarily because it's classy on OUR part and it's what all the players want. Kyle says he should be the first Raptor jersey in the rafters --- so I'm good with that, too.
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Retiring Vince is a no brainer. Raps have always been big on the 99-03 alumni and he is the poster boy of that crew. And it doesn't fucking matter who goes in "first", Lowry is 4 years from retiring likely, Derozan and Kawhi are maybe 8 years from retiring9 time first team all-RR, First Ballot Hall of Forum
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