We're not getting Durant, how do we build a contender then?

[Kuh]

I agree wholeheartedly that the Raptors are worse than the Spurs today.

I agree that Tim Duncan is better than Amir and PP ... just not night and day better, since he is no longer as overpowering as he was.

And I will definitely stand by my comment about Lowry being better than Parker.

My point was simply that SA is a team we can aspire to becoming. That they don't today have that transcendent individual player (unless you count Kawhi that player). That as champions that had a mix of very good players, and that we are on the path to possibly being the same.

[raptors999]

I agree wholeheartedly that the Raptors are worse than the Spurs today.

I agree that Tim Duncan is better than Amir and PP ... just not night and day better, since he is no longer as overpowering as he was.

And I will definitely stand by my comment about Lowry being better than Parker.

My point was simply that SA is a team we can aspire to becoming. That they don't today have that transcendent individual player (unless you count Kawhi that player). That as champions that had a mix of very good players, and that we are on the path to possibly being the same.

I disagree. Raptors are clearly superior to the defending World Champions and perennial top NBA team. Their accomplishment are nothing compared to finishing over .500 and making the playoffs for the first time in a decade. They should be modeling their organization after us.

[stooley]

I disagree. Raptors are clearly superior to the defending World Champions and perennial top NBA team. Their accomplishment are nothing compared to finishing over .500 and making the playoffs for the first time in a decade. They should be modeling their organization after us.

Don't forget 48 wins!

[iblastoff]

I agree wholeheartedly that the Raptors are worse than the Spurs today.

I agree that Tim Duncan is better than Amir and PP ... just not night and day better, since he is no longer as overpowering as he was.

And I will definitely stand by my comment about Lowry being better than Parker.

My point was simply that SA is a team we can aspire to becoming. That they don't today have that transcendent individual player (unless you count Kawhi that player). That as champions that had a mix of very good players, and that we are on the path to possibly being the same.

bullshit. what single player on the raptors do you think are going to be future hall of famers? spurs have multiple ones. duncan has won championships in his youth, prime AND past his prime. no one on the raptors is even remotely close. lowry had a breakout season in a contract year. JV has potential. thats about it. lets not even start comparing pop vs casey.

comparing two teams and saying they're similar just because neither team has a crazy *current* superstar right now is a huge logical fallacy.

[stooley]

bullshit. what single player on the raptors do you think are going to be future hall of famers? spurs have multiple ones. duncan has won championships in his youth, prime AND past his prime. no one on the raptors is even remotely close. lowry had a breakout season in a contract year. JV has potential. thats about it. lets not even start comparing pop vs casey.

comparing two teams and saying they're similar just because neither team has a crazy *current* superstar right now is a huge logical fallacy.

so what though?

those guys aren't going into the Hall if last year was their best year.

[iblastoff]

We're not getting Durant, how do we build a contender then?

so what though?

those guys aren't going into the Hall if last year was their best year.

My point was people seem to be REALLY reaching with the raptors / spurs comparison, as if lacking a current superstar makes both teams similar when that clearly isn't the case.

[JawsGT]

My point was people seem to be REALLY reaching with the raptors / spurs comparison, as if lacking a current superstar makes both teams similar when that clearly isn't the case.

I don't think it's a reach at all. It's not about talent at individual positions, it's about playing as a team and in a way that maximizes each players strengths. We have a team that can play that way. Will we be as successful as the Spurs? Most likely no. But that doesn't mean we can't strive to play like them, and as such comparisons btw the TEAMS are valid. As soon as we start comparing players at individual positions though, that's when the arguments go to shit because it's a team game. Lowry is better than Parker or Duncan is better than Amir is irrelevant. Going through lineups and comparing positions player by player isn't a great way to compare teams. The Spurs showed this themselves last season. No doubt they have incredible talent on that team, but if you went through position by position and compared their lineup to other teams lineups, then I'm sure one could conclude that there were other teams in the league that were better than the Spurs or more talented. Nonetheless, the Spurs proved they were the best team in the league last year (by a margin I would argue) without that top 10 transcendent talent.

So, I don't think it's the lack of a superstar argument that makes the teams comparable, it's the fact that we are set up to play a style similar to what the Spurs did that makes the teams comparable (we are deep and have a diversity of skills at each position). If the Spurs had to rely on a single player last season in the fashion that a team with a transcendent talent does, then it's hard to imagine they would have been as successful. If the Raps do the same, they probably get worse than last year. But if the team attempts to improve as a team and play a style similar to the Spurs, then we have a chance to get even better than last year. I think it's a safe comparison to make if one focuses on the style of play and approach to the game, but if we just focus comparing individual players to the other teams counterpart, then I can see your issue.

[raptors999]

I don't think it's a reach at all. It's not about talent at individual positions, it's about playing as a team and in a way that maximizes each players strengths. We have a team that can play that way. Will we be as successful as the Spurs? Most likely no. But that doesn't mean we can't strive to play like them, and as such comparisons btw the TEAMS are valid. As soon as we start comparing players at individual positions though, that's when the arguments go to shit because it's a team game. Lowry is better than Parker or Duncan is better than Amir is irrelevant. Going through lineups and comparing positions player by player isn't a great way to compare teams. The Spurs showed this themselves last season. No doubt they have incredible talent on that team, but if you went through position by position and compared their lineup to other teams lineups, then I'm sure one could conclude that there were other teams in the league that were better than the Spurs or more talented. Nonetheless, the Spurs proved they were the best team in the league last year (by a margin I would argue) without that top 10 transcendent talent.

So, I don't think it's the lack of a superstar argument that makes the teams comparable, it's the fact that we are set up to play a style similar to what the Spurs did that makes the teams comparable (we are deep and have a diversity of skills at each position). If the Spurs had to rely on a single player last season in the fashion that a team with a transcendent talent does, then it's hard to imagine they would have been as successful. If the Raps do the same, they probably get worse than last year. But if the team attempts to improve as a team and play a style similar to the Spurs, then we have a chance to get even better than last year. I think it's a safe comparison to make if one focuses on the style of play and approach to the game, but if we just focus comparing individual players to the other teams counterpart, then I can see your issue.

I agree that FO Buford - Masai is comparable but the greatest difference is the coaching. Drafting and retaining players means little if the coach is crap. Novak shot the most non three pointers in his career on the Raptors.

[mcHAPPY]

I agree that FO Buford - Masai is comparable but the greatest difference is the coaching. Drafting and retaining players means little if the coach is crap. Novak shot the most non three pointers in his career on the Raptors.

Novak only took 146 shots last season of which 122 were 3's. 84% of his attempts last season were 3's.

HIs two seasons in NY saw him shoot 84% and 82% of his shots as 3's.

The only other season he played considerable minutes was 2008-09 with CLippers and 71% of his shots were 3's.

I'm not sure what you mean by the bold.

[raptors999]

Novak only took 146 shots last season of which 122 were 3's. 84% of his attempts last season were 3's.

HIs two seasons in NY saw him shoot 84% and 82% of his shots as 3's.

The only other season he played considerable minutes was 2008-09 with CLippers and 71% of his shots were 3's.

I'm not sure what you mean by the bold.

Novak had his highest amount of non - 3pt scoring totals for his career. Raptors couldn't get Novak perimeter shots. 122 3PA 24 2PA previously 282/55 351/

Novak only took 146 shots last season of which 122 were 3's. 84% of his attempts last season were 3's.

HIs two seasons in NY saw him shoot 84% and 82% of his shots as 3's.

The only other season he played considerable minutes was 2008-09 with CLippers and 71% of his shots were 3's.

I'm not sure what you mean by the bold.

Novak had his highest amount of non - 3pt scoring totals for his career. Raptors couldn't get Novak perimeter shots. 122 3PA 24 2PA previously 282/55 351/ 79.

[mcHAPPY]

Novak had his highest amount of non - 3pt scoring totals for his career. Raptors couldn't get Novak perimeter shots. 122 3PA 24 2PA previously 282/55 351/

One of us is missing something here or one of us is totally wrong.

[raptors999]

One of us is missing something here or one of us is totally wrong.

Novak was used terribly all season. He was in the post defending and taking jumpers inside the arc. It wasn't Novak's fault he was put into a situation to fail just like Salmons. Previous years he shot a higher 2P % because they were wide open, 2012-13 36.7% but usually much higher than 40%. Last season 33.3% on 2PA and much more as a % of attempts.

[mcHAPPY]

Novak was used terribly all season. He was in the post defending and taking jumpers inside the arc. It wasn't Novak's fault he was put into a situation to fail just like Salmons. Previous years he shot a higher 2P % because they were wide open, 2012-13 36.7% but usually much higher than 40%. Last season 33.3% on 2PA and much more as a % of attempts.

That is all well and good.

My point is the number of non-3s he took. Only 16% of his shot attempts were 2 last season. That is just above what it was in New York and higher than clippers. Those were only 3 years where he got any sort of regular burn.

[Heatdreamer]

The real question who is the free agent player in 2015 that the Raptors are signing, would Amir be willing to resign as a back up center for around 3/15 million or is the better quality backup center available and Amir is released from the cap hold .

Because in 2016 cap holds for Jv, TR and GV will push us close to the salary cap, and I don't know if DD can opt that year and have a more expensive cap consideration.

So again i am asking the community for 2015 FA we need a shooter or scorer to replace Lou , a Starting Power Forward and a back up center , which I believe is the least expensive.

If the Tv deal is completed one year earlier than expected, the salary cap for 2015/16 could be high 70 million dollars with the cap at 92 million.

This would allow the Raptors at 49 million with 10 players signed for 2015. So ante up guys, want to hear your comments.

[kopite91]

I think the Raptors in 2016 will be what the Suns were this summer aka a team that's young, has a couple stars, a good supporting and a lots of cap space. Enough to give max salary to one dude and maybe even two if Ujiri does his job well. But like Phoenix, Toronto will have little to pitch for Kevin Durant... therefore Masai will have to gamble a bit and roll the dice on the development of Ross and Valancuinas. If we can make major forays in the Eastern Conference the new couple seasons, there might be that chance of us signing a bigtime player.