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  • golden wrote: View Post

    That's exactly what I'm saying.... start Lavine beside Lowry, OG & Siakam and that's already a boost for him. Add in Nurse and the Raptors culture and you've got a chance to unlock more upside. In return, the Bulls badly need to change the culture, so we can sell high on some of our 'championship culture' which, TBH, got exposed in the playoffs as being mostly Kawhi.
    I think this is really intriguing. LaVine gets a bad rap but I like him more than Ingram. Plus the Raptors have to find a way to figure out how to get every ex dump champion on it's roster some how.

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    • planetmars wrote: View Post

      I think this is really intriguing. LaVine gets a bad rap but I like him more than Ingram. Plus the Raptors have to find a way to figure out how to get every ex dump champion on it's roster some how.
      Lavine / Lowry backcourt

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      • Are we sleeping on OG here while we’re talking about Fred? He’s in the same boat as Siakim last year. Are they going to extend him? For how much?

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        • Jclaw wrote: View Post
          Are we sleeping on OG here while we’re talking about Fred? He’s in the same boat as Siakim last year. Are they going to extend him? For how much?
          Yes, they will. Probably something along the lines of Levert’s deal.

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          • Jclaw wrote: View Post
            Are we sleeping on OG here while we’re talking about Fred? He’s in the same boat as Siakim last year. Are they going to extend him? For how much?
            The difference between Pascal and OG is the difference between the 2020 and 2021 free agency class. If we wanted to be buyers in 2020 then Pascal wouldn't have gotten his extension. And if we want to be buyers in 2021 then neither would OG.

            And since Masai seems to be aiming hard for 2021, I would be surprised if OG got his extension.

            On the other hand.. if Giannis signs a super max all bets are off.

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            • I think OG gets about $12-$15M a year. You get paid on offense, not defense. So he's not getting a $20M+ deal. He plays his role really well, but still ultimately just a role player in this league.

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              • planetmars wrote: View Post
                I think OG gets about $12-$15M a year. You get paid on offense, not defense. So he's not getting a $20M+ deal. He plays his role really well, but still ultimately just a role player in this league.
                FWIW, OG is on a pretty similar 3&D SF trajectory as Otto Porter, who got the max.

                And when it come to getting paid for offense.... that's the whole thing about FVV. There was no need to over-inflate his numbers and now that comes back to bite us in free agency. Fred should have been firmly in the backup PG role, sink or swim.

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                • golden wrote: View Post

                  FWIW, OG is on a pretty similar 3&D SF trajectory as Otto Porter, who got the max.

                  And when it come to getting paid for offense.... that's the whole thing about FVV. There was no need to over-inflate his numbers and now that comes back to bite us in free agency. Fred should have been firmly in the backup PG role, sink or swim.
                  Porter's extension was mostly because he was the 3rd overall pick in his draft class. I think sometimes that makes a difference. It's why Wiggins got the max deal as well.

                  As for Fred.. once he gets paid, he really should hand deliver a gift basket to Nurse.

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                  • planetmars wrote: View Post

                    Porter's extension was mostly because he was the 3rd overall pick in his draft class. I think sometimes that makes a difference. It's why Wiggins got the max deal as well.
                    The other counterpoint: the Washington Wizards gave Porter that contract. And it was pretty widely regarded as an overpay at the time.
                    "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                    • MixxAOR wrote: View Post

                      Christmas
                      Is this official?

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                      • golden wrote: View Post

                        Yeah, it's always like a "poor choice" or "we used him wrong" when Gasol and FVV crap the bed. It has nothing to do with their limitations or just plain bad play. That same logic (or lame excuse) doesn't apply to other players, apparently.
                        I think both Fred and Gasol played poorly, AND that they were used poorly. I actually think the same applies to Pascal, though he was way off his game and may well have struggled even with better actions run for him (I do think less so though). Lowry was awesome because he always is. Serge and Norm had great success (individually) and hurt the team less than they could have defensively precisely because they were kept in their mostly shielded bench roles (though good on Norm for being part of a moderately successful small look) where they are best able to play to their strengths. Players being used well performing well and players being used poorly performing poorly? Yeah, such a logical inconsistency on my part...

                        I haven't been inconsistent on this. Surely you aren't suggesting that my criticism of Fred's role is new for these playoffs. Nor for Gasol.
                        twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                        • When are the Raptors going to unveil their new uniforms?

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                          • planetmars wrote: View Post

                            I like using shamsports.com/capulator since I don't have to do the leg work. Shows about $121M with all free agents let go except Fred's cap hold. So even if we find someone for Norm, and waive either Stanley or McCaw.. we're still pretty thin.

                            Need the salaries and cap holds to be about $85M to get a $30M player, assuming the cap is at $115M.
                            And that's an optimistic assumption. With revenues plunging, it's best to assume a flat cap (109M) moving forward until we hear otherwise. That may be optimistic as well, but based on how leagues have approached cap drop scenarios like lockout shortened seasons in the past it's as good a guess as any.
                            twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                            • golden wrote: View Post

                              FWIW, OG is on a pretty similar 3&D SF trajectory as Otto Porter, who got the max.

                              And when it come to getting paid for offense.... that's the whole thing about FVV. There was no need to over-inflate his numbers and now that comes back to bite us in free agency. Fred should have been firmly in the backup PG role, sink or swim.
                              You do that to your guys and you just develop a reputation for doing that. And lose them to other teams in FA anyway, just for less money, because they want a bigger role than you are willing to offer.
                              twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                              • golden wrote: View Post

                                That's exactly what I'm saying.... start Lavine beside Lowry, OG & Siakam and that's already a boost for him. Add in Nurse and the Raptors culture and you've got a chance to unlock more upside. In return, the Bulls badly need to change the culture, so we can sell high on some of our 'championship culture' which, TBH, got exposed in the playoffs as being mostly Kawhi.
                                I dont really want any part of Levine. Hes kinda proven himself as a scorer with not a lot else. I think anyone we bring in needs to have great defensive awareness at a minimum - which has always been a weekness of Levine. The scoring is intriguing but I dont trust his reads to be a top option. To me hes like Tobias Harris or Demar in that he can probably be a foundation piece for a nice regular season offense, but not going to win you many important games.

                                If I were to target a guard it would be one of the San Antonio guys or Lonzo Ball. I think Ball could benefit from all the stuff you mention cause he has the tools and smarts to be a Nurse favorite just needs some direction and molding. A year or two with Kyle and Nurse would turn him into an incredible player imo - though admitedly hes not filling into the scoring role Levine or even Fred could.

                                Im pretty okay paying FVV - I think hes shown over the last two years that hes a solid two-way player. He tried to do too much this post season, but I think it was cause nothing else worked not because he thinks hes James Harden. Now if you keep Fred I think you need more handling from the wing. Can Siakam be that guy?

                                Big question is whats the center rotation look like? I dont trust any current options to play heavy minutes. Im fine with bringing one of Marc or Serge back so long as there is another option. Hernandez clearly isnt ready but flashed a bit in Gleague - maybe he can be a 3rd center with potential to soak up injury minutes midseason. Still leaves a hole which I would prefer to fill with a good rebounding rim runner.

                                I think Masai is active to find a trade for talent. Enough bench guys are set to pop into legit rotation pieces that im not worried about losing Norm or a draft pick, the question is what does that get you. Wed all love a trade for a star but Id be fine with trading Norm for future picks - its a lot easier to get a star with draft capital.

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