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  • TheWaterboy wrote: View Post

    I'm surprisingly OK with the state of things right now. On the one hand, we haven't made ourselves better or even put ourselves into run-it-back position... but on the other hand, we haven't screwed up already like some teams have, and we haven't had players we want back signed out from under us, either.
    I'm okay for now as well, but I would argue we may already be better with the addition of Flynn whom I expect to get minutes, Pascal and OG improvements, and Masai still has to figure out our big man rotation. Even if Serge is back I doubt Marc will be.

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    • G__Deane wrote: View Post

      But re-signing most of a roster that fell well short ....optimism. I don't want to be content with a playoff appearance
      So like be specific what do you want to see happen? Tank? Trade Mccaw for Lebron?

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      • Who's the best player that was signed or traded yesterday that we missed on? All the players getting new deals are basically role players. Exception is probably Jrue Holiday but the Bucks gave up 3 picks and 2 pick swaps for him. And he's not really a star.

        There are some nice to have role players that moved around. But at the end of the day nobody really is a difference maker.. not even Montrezl Harrell.

        Harden was the big name at the start of the off season.. and he's still with Houston. Let's see if he ever gets moved in the next couple of weeks. We'll need to know what offer Houston got for him, and what team he landed on. If the Raptors miss out and the package is kind of meh, I'll be bringing my pitchfork over. But I don't suspect that to be the case. Either Harden gets traded to a team he wants to play for. Or the team he gets traded for sent a package as big as OKC got for the Paul George trade. and possibly even bigger than that.

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        • golden wrote: View Post

          Meh, you just gotta chill a bit Deaner. We’re at the end of the WeTheNorth Era. We should be grateful that it ended in a chip and a surprisingly robust title defense season last year. Enjoy the rebuild.

          The “gotta do something now” mentality is the hallmark of the Bryan Colangelo years.
          I'm trying, I really am. But I honestly would have been fine with a full rebuild rather than a Band-aid and hope. I can't see us being enough of a competitor this season (that the Bucks likely will be again) to attract Giannis here, as slim a chance as that might be. And there aren't any other avenues to relevant competitor after him. Another decade of "just happy to be here" sucks.

          Anyway, let's see what Masai and Bobby have up their collective sleeve.

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          • Rudy Bargnani wrote: View Post

            You keep repeating this but again the salary cap is what it is. If the raps let van vleet, Ibaka, gasol all walk for nothing they would not even have enough money to sign a jerami grant piece.

            There are going to be a bunch of good teams doing nothing this off-season . Miami, Raptors, probably Celtics, probably clippers.
            Clippers already made move(s). That they didn't want to.
            I get ti re the salary cap issue. Didn't stop other teams like the f'n lakers.

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            • Rudy Bargnani wrote: View Post

              So like be specific what do you want to see happen? Tank? Trade Mccaw for Lebron?
              Either.
              I'm just not content to run it back and bow out in the first or second round.
              I don't have the answers but I irrationally like change and too many guys take it personally if you remotely criticize this team

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              • G__Deane wrote: View Post

                Clippers already made move(s). That they didn't want to.
                I get ti re the salary cap issue. Didn't stop other teams like the f'n lakers.
                Sure it did. They had to wait until they freed up cap space to be able to get LeBron and then have enough leverage threat to force the AD trade.

                Which, you know, is exactly what the Raptors are doing? So not sure what your problem is with this approach, exactly.
                twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                • G__Deane wrote: View Post

                  Either.
                  I'm just not content to run it back and bow out in the first or second round.
                  I don't have the answers but I irrationally like change and too many guys take it personally if you remotely criticize this team
                  How would setting ourselves up to tank even work at this exact moment? OKC is hoovering up all of the loose second rounders and whatever firsts it can get its hands on, making it next to impossible to try to collect draft picks effectively, and while we have all of our first rounders right now, we are missing two of our next three second rounders. Kyle and OG and Pascal (which is probably the minimum we'd keep to start the season) and a handful of mediocre rotation players is probably still enough to have the sort of season that Orlando had last year, which doesn't get us a high enough draft pick to make it worth our while to shed assets now.

                  If there is a time to tank in the near future, it's the next offseason, not this one (if we miss out on Giannis). Kyle comes off the books and we will have the cap space to take on bad deals for picks and/or pick up the next crop of reclamation projects from franchises like the Kings that generally don't know what they're doing.

                  Managing a team is not about not taking risks, it's about aggressively taking risks when it's smart to do so and taking smart risks in relation to upside/downside when you do. Hitting on 50% or more of your aggressive moves and/or gotta-take-a-chance-on-something moves like your draft picks is a big part of what good team management is all about.

                  Change for the sake of change may feel good, but it's not good management. It's what Detroit's doing this year, and what Sacramento seems to do every year... and if that doesn't convince you that it's not a good idea, I don't know what will. :-)

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                  • G__Deane wrote: View Post

                    Another decade of "just happy to be here" sucks.

                    .
                    That’s a leap. Raps won the NBA title 1 year ago, have multiple all stars and max cap space a year from now.

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                    • Chris Dunn 2 years 10 million..wow, not bad contract..
                      "Never apologize for coming to me. Office hours are for patients.
                      My kitchen is always open to friends"

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                      • G__Deane wrote: View Post

                        But re-signing most of a roster that fell well short ....optimism. I don't want to be content with a playoff appearance
                        So you'd rather overpay for average free agents? If there are no good options available, you don't go into desperation mode and attempt to create a contender overnight.

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                        • G__Deane wrote: View Post

                          Either.
                          I'm just not content to run it back and bow out in the first or second round.
                          I don't have the answers but I irrationally like change and too many guys take it personally if you remotely criticize this team
                          It's punt season for most teams.

                          Unless Miami miraculously gets Giannis, only injuries stand in the way of LeBron repeating.

                          Last edited by Kagemusha; Sat Nov 21, 2020, 12:31 PM.

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                          • G__Deane wrote: View Post

                            Either.
                            I'm just not content to run it back and bow out in the first or second round.
                            I don't have the answers but I irrationally like change and too many guys take it personally if you remotely criticize this team
                            Im kinda with you. I for all the talk about capspace, its only good as the player you sin with it. Overpaying on a short term deal for the chance to sign a star next year is a fine plan, but I dont love living in purgatory while other situations sort themselves out. You can be much more proactive and still have avenues to aquire a star player if one becomes available. Im not worried that Masai will do nothing, its still early, but it definitely feels like we’ve missed out on a guy or two

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                            • Cap space isn't just a just a shot at Giannis next offseason, it's also transaction flexibility if that doesn't work out. You can do any number of things with cap space and you're really limited without it. Raptors always had 2 seasons to get through to get to that key offseason. It's taken years to build the salary structure for this.

                              Season 1 they finished 2nd overall and were a bucket or two away from the conference finals. Holy smokes, not bad for a gap year there are some good players on this team.

                              Season 2 is shaping up to be similar.

                              And don't forget how in half a year Masai turned the DD/Lowry/Casey team into a championship team. How? He had plenty of good assets on good deals and was positioned to pounce on an opportunity. He's working to stay in the same position while also opening up a max slot next offseason. This is exactly what he should be doing instead of signing Jahlil Okafor or Marcus Morris.

                              Nobody in the organization is settling for mediocrity. They're working at building another champion.
                              "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                              • G__Deane wrote: View Post

                                Either.
                                I'm just not content to run it back and bow out in the first or second round.
                                I don't have the answers but I irrationally like change and too many guys take it personally if you remotely criticize this team
                                Yeah I'm not as fidgety as you when it comes to wanting change all the time but I see where you come from.

                                What bugs me a bit is the lost opportunity cost: Assets fresh from a championship can (1) keep you close to another title if you continue to add win-now talent (what the lakers is doing) or (2) be flipped for high picks and elite prospects that can set you up for years.

                                That only works right after the chip though. If you let them all age, walk away in free agency or be further removed from the championship run, that value slowly evaporates. A loose analogy is like having a million bucks sitting on a checking account for years of high inflation (other teams getting better) and not invested. It's still a million bucks and it's awesome, but over time the value is slowly eroded, and the opportunity to make more from it through investing is lost. Right now we have the million bucks (which is safe and it's awesome), but we're just buying lotto 649 tickets (Giannis), rather than investing it in the stock market.

                                Personally, I'm never one to make moves just for the sake of it. That said, what I would do now is aggressively pursue guys like Beal, Oladipo, Harden, Gobert, KAT, Embiid, etc, even if it means losing some combination of current assets, future picks and the 2021 cap space. Take a risk and take control of the team's fortune now by pursuing an elite shooting guard and/or centre for the future to pair with Siakam & OG, while the champioship shine is still there. Soon we might not have the capital to pursue big trades anymore. To me that beats a pipe dream scenario where Giannis leaves a better team offering more money (like the Bucks), to come here (and not Miami).
                                2019 NBA Champions. Glad to have doubted the doubters.

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