Everything Off Season

[Yuri Gagarin]

We just need a C that can defend and one who has a bit of girth to contrast boucher and who comes at a reasonable price. I love serge. Hes a great locker room guy and hes been money shooting last few playoffs. Frustratingly lazy in rebounds sometimes but I dont think we can afford to match what he’ll be offered.

how about Biz? What will he demand in the market? Im guessing 8-10/yr? I realize its a few years later but when he was here he made bron think twice about going into the paint. Rebounds, blocks and hustle is adequate and a guy like Biz only needs about 24 minutes so Boucher can get about equal burn.

oh ya and Boucher. What would you guys offer him? What donyou think he’ll be offered elsewhere? Im thinking we should lock him in for 8m x4

[golden]

Any argument based on winning percentage that doesn't take the minimal effort required to take a slightly closer look at how the team won those games is bound to be not a great argument. No matter which direction is being argued.

The bubble did a lot of things, expose reality I would say is not one of them. Judging guys by how they perform after a 5 month layoff and then playing in an environment completely alien to a usual NBA environment feels like maybe the dumbest thing one could do with the bubble results? I take it Pascal is permanently unable to dribble now?

Pascal's handles have never been good enough to be a first option, isolation scorer on a deep playoff contender. I mean, we were all hopeful, but surely everyone knew that. Smart posters have pointed that out on a number of occasions. His handles got exposed, plain & simple. He will work hard on that in the summer. You're just proving my point.

That said, Nurse did Pascal no favors by putting him on an island to die against great defenders.... over and over and over.......

[DanH]

Pascal's handles have never been good enough to be a first option, isolation scorer on a deep playoff contender. I mean, we were all hopeful, but surely everyone knew that. Smart posters have pointed that out on a number of occasions. His handles got exposed, plain & simple. He will work hard on that in the summer. You're just proving my point.

That said, Nurse did Pascal no favors by putting him on an island to die against great defenders.... over and over and over.......

Come on, Pascal's struggles in that series were NOT his typical struggles in isolation. He was basically useless offensively even when he did get to the rim, couldn't hit jumpers... Is that really your position? Pascal's struggles in the bubble were EXACTLY what you expected going in?

[A.I]

Pascal's handles have never been good enough to be a first option, isolation scorer on a deep playoff contender. I mean, we were all hopeful, but surely everyone knew that. Smart posters have pointed that out on a number of occasions. His handles got exposed, plain & simple. He will work hard on that in the summer. You're just proving my point.

That said, Nurse did Pascal no favors by putting him on an island to die against great defenders.... over and over and over.......

You realize there is more to it than Pascal doesn't have good ball handling skills. His handles did him fine for majority of the season. Obviously he can still improve, but his struggles started when the bubble started not only against the Celtics.

[golden]

Come on, Pascal's struggles in that series were NOT his typical struggles in isolation. He was basically useless offensively even when he did get to the rim, couldn't hit jumpers... Is that really your position? Pascal's struggles in the bubble were EXACTLY what you expected going in?

Pascal struggled against top defenses and dominated weaker teams throughout the regular season. He also struggled against single coverage vs. long, smart defenders. He even struggled against some guys you wouldn't expect, like Finney-Smith, Maxi Kleber and a few other guys I can't remember. Yes, I expected him to struggle as a first option, and especially in the playoffs against elite defenders. Even worse than I expected, for sure. In the end, his confidence was shredded and he looked like a shell of himself; but, that's because he didn't have the solid skill base to overcome, when the day of reckoning arrived and Nurse left him out there doing ISOs to make it clear he was the main guy letting this team down.

I called this back in July......... 2019.

Assuming no major injuries or changes to the roster, I could see Pascal as a 20/8/4 guy, but his efficiency could drop significantly. It's hard to picture him as a 26+ % USG first option type of guy with his current handles, 3-pt shot and lack of a consistent quick pullup/step-back jumper. It will require yet another unprecedented leap in growth.

[S.R.]

On the one hand I wished they had put Siakam in better position to succeed. Run him off screens more, put him in the high pnr with Lowry a lot more, quit the clear out iso's.

On the other hand, this team has been great at developing players and this is part of it. You tell them you have confidence in them and put them in position to develop instead of boxing them in. DeMar, Fred, Siakam, OG off the bounce...there's a method to the madness and the early stages of it include taking your lumps as the guy fails and needs to learn. Key is giving him opportunity and time to learn. If Siakam has shown us anything, it's that he can grow. He's no "he is who he is" player. Wish the bubble had gone differently for him, but since that was his first season in a 1A role, I'm not writing anything off for him re his potential. He should get more time - he'll have next seasons for sure, then we'll see what happens with the roster + who is here.

[golden]

On the one hand I wished they had put Siakam in better position to succeed. Run him off screens more, put him in the high pnr with Lowry a lot more, quit the clear out iso's.

On the other hand, this team has been great at developing players and this is part of it. You tell them you have confidence in them and put them in position to develop instead of boxing them in. DeMar, Fred, Siakam, OG off the bounce...there's a method to the madness and the early stages of it include taking your lumps as the guy fails and needs to learn. Key is giving him opportunity and time to learn. If Siakam has shown us anything, it's that he can grow. He's no "he is who he is" player. Wish the bubble had gone differently for him, but since that was his first season in a 1A role, I'm not writing anything off for him re his potential. He should get more time - he'll have next seasons for sure, then we'll see what happens with the roster + who is here.

That wasn't player development happening during the playoffs. If it was, then we would have seen a lot more Terence Davis and Matt Thomas. Nurse was playing who & how he thought was his best chance to win. He was rolling the dice that "his guys" (e.g. Pascal, Gasol, FVV) would snap out of their funks, if he stuck with them long enough. If the series was best of 11 games...... maybe.

[DanH]

That wasn't player development happening during the playoffs. If it was, then we would have seen a lot more Terence Davis and Matt Thomas. Nurse was playing who & how he thought was his best chance to win. He was rolling the dice that "his guys" (e.g. Pascal, Gasol, FVV) would snap out of their funks, if he stuck with them long enough. If the series was best of 11 games...... maybe.

Pretty sure we can call it a solid maybe in just those 7 games, considering they came within a few points of winning the series.

[golden]

Pretty sure we can call it a solid maybe in just those 7 games, considering they came within a few points of winning the series.

the minimal effort required to take a slightly closer look at how the team won those games is bound to be not a great argument. No matter which direction is being argued.

[TrueTorontoFan]

We just need a C that can defend and one who has a bit of girth to contrast boucher and who comes at a reasonable price. I love serge. Hes a great locker room guy and hes been money shooting last few playoffs. Frustratingly lazy in rebounds sometimes but I dont think we can afford to match what he’ll be offered.

how about Biz? What will he demand in the market? Im guessing 8-10/yr? I realize its a few years later but when he was here he made bron think twice about going into the paint. Rebounds, blocks and hustle is adequate and a guy like Biz only needs about 24 minutes so Boucher can get about equal burn.

oh ya and Boucher. What would you guys offer him? What donyou think he’ll be offered elsewhere? Im thinking we should lock him in for 8m x4

biz would be a good back up

[Yuri Gagarin]

Pascal constantly relies on his spin move and they’re waiting for it now. And he dribbles way too high while hes doing it it’s frightening to watch. Still quick enough to execute it on occasion but hes been mostly been figured out by those guys at least. The bubble excuse is lame

i though nurse was an experimental coach then he gave time to guys like hes lenny wilkins. With two minutes left pascal threw it away. He was doing nothing. After that I said to my son why is he still in so he can do it again? And he did! Game over. Really disappointed with nick that series.

[DanH]

Not sure I follow.

[DanH]

biz would be a good back up

Biz is a great option for a vet backup we could get for cheap assuming our other vets are out the door. Whether they keep a vet (Serge or Marc) to be a nominal starter for a year or grab a vet backup, I do think they'll want significant minutes at C going to a younger option.

[DanH]

Pascal constantly relies on his spin move and they’re waiting for it now. And he dribbles way too high while hes doing it it’s frightening to watch. Still quick enough to execute it on occasion but hes been mostly been figured out by those guys at least. The bubble excuse is lame

i though nurse was an experimental coach then he gave time to guys like hes lenny wilkins. With two minutes left pascal threw it away. He was doing nothing. After that I said to my son why is he still in so he can do it again? And he did! Game over. Really disappointed with nick that series.

If you look at some of his games in the like final week before the shutdown he looks pretty good. It's a pretty stark contrast with the bubble. And don't forget, Pascal looked pretty rough throughout the 8 pre-playoff games and also not great against the Nets. Really not a matchup or great defender thing isolated to the Boston series.

I agree Pascal was completely misused given his struggles. But that doesn't invalidate that he was struggling. He got put in way too many tough situations. But also looked awful when he did get good looks or matchups. Just wasn't there offensively.

[golden]

Not sure I follow.

You're contradicting yourself by quoting wins and results without context, to support an argument. In reality, the series wasn't really that close. Take a closer look, as you say.