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JV comparable big man production in the modern NBA

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  • Axel wrote: View Post
    Honestly, if Demar plays like he is, JV plays like he did last post-season, and Lowry plays like he can - all at the same time in the playoffs, I'd like our chances vs a Cavs team that relied on inconsistent (and one-way) Kyrie and Love. Warriors might be another beast all together but I think the East is winnable if Casey can get all three going at once (which we've never seen before).
    Sure, if the raps are at their absolute best, and the cavs aren't at their absolute best, wed have a punchers chance.but were still a say top 40 power forward away imo from being in the same breath as even San Antonio let alone Gs and cleveland.
    It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

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    • KeonClark wrote: View Post
      Sure, if the raps are at their absolute best, and the cavs aren't at their absolute best, wed have a punchers chance.but were still a say top 40 power forward away imo from being in the same breath as even San Antonio let alone Gs and cleveland.
      Well I certainly wouldn't say no to an upgrade at PF, but I don't think Kyrie and Love are consistent enough, so if our guys can execute at the top level, even LeBron would need those guys to show up. Since we've never seen all 3 of our guys peak at the same time, I'm not advocating that we don't explore moves or anything, just saying that if Casey can get these 3 clicking together, I'd like our chances.

      Masai's job is clear - try to find a better PF without digging too deep

      Casey's job is clear - 3 stallions running in unison
      Heir, Prince of Cambridge

      If you see KeonClark in the wasteland, please share your food and water with him.

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      • Did JV just got spanked by Hassan ?

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        • McRealistic wrote: View Post
          Did JV just got spanked by Hassan ?
          Considering he only had 2 shot attempts, Hassan didn't do anything, JV got spanked by the Raptors.

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          • McRealistic wrote: View Post
            Did JV just got spanked by Hassan ?
            No.

            Hassan scored 21 points, he's averaging 20 per game.

            Hassan grabbed 16 boards, he's averages 14 per game.

            So Hassan is just good is part of it. Fact that Hassan played 38 minutes (to JVs 28) is also a factor. A season high in minutes would explain 2 rebounds above his average.

            Raps took JV out of the game on offence.
            Heir, Prince of Cambridge

            If you see KeonClark in the wasteland, please share your food and water with him.

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            • Axel wrote: View Post
              Since we've never seen all 3 of our guys peak at the same time, I'm not advocating that we don't explore moves or anything, just saying that if Casey can get these 3 clicking together, I'd like our chances.
              I think that after four years of having these guys together, it's very telling that we still can't find a way to get Valanciunas touches. (He has 8 FGA over the last two games.)

              His usage and per-36 FGA are actually down from last year. At this point I think it's simply wishful thinking to hope for some kind of change in our offensive system.

              And don't get me wrong, I love that we're effective during the regular season... but I do think we still need some kind of key change in order to get us to the next level.

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              • Scraptor wrote: View Post
                I think that after four years of having these guys together, it's very telling that we still can't find a way to get Valanciunas touches. (He has 8 FGA over the last two games.)

                His usage and per-36 FGA are actually down from last year. At this point I think it's simply wishful thinking to hope for some kind of change in our offensive system.

                And don't get me wrong, I love that we're effective during the regular season... but I do think we still need some kind of key change in order to get us to the next level.
                Well the usage was up from last season before last nights game, so I'd say we really need to see a larger sample before we can really gauge that but I do think we can safely say that it will be comparable to last year.

                His FGA so far this year is nearly identical to last post season (his FTA are pretty close to) so we've seen what he can produce even with the limited touches and that is something that not many players can do. JVs ability to do more with less might make him the ideal centre to play with Demar and Kyle because you're likely right, the offence isn't going to evolve.

                At this point, I've given up much hope that Casey/Demar/Kyle are going to suddenly use JV more but it's the minutes that need to be there. There is absolutely no reason for him to be playing less than 30 mpg any given night and should be closer to 33-34-35 range given his age and our backup options.

                As far as the post season goes, I'm not sure we've seen both Demar and Lowry peaking at the same time yet which might be the bigger cap on our success. If those two can't coexist at their best, then we won't beat the Cavs because JV has shown he can play at a very high level regardless of whether it's the Demar show or the Kyle show. But if we can get those two going together and JV continues to do what he's shown he can when given the minutes, then I'd take our chances in a 7 game series with anyone in the East.

                Much like last year, the entire regular season serves no purpose other than being ready for the playoffs. It's in April and May that the players need to earn their paycheques.
                Heir, Prince of Cambridge

                If you see KeonClark in the wasteland, please share your food and water with him.

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                • Axel wrote: View Post
                  Well the usage was up from last season before last nights game, so I'd say we really need to see a larger sample before we can really gauge that but I do think we can safely say that it will be comparable to last year.

                  His FGA so far this year is nearly identical to last post season (his FTA are pretty close to) so we've seen what he can produce even with the limited touches and that is something that not many players can do. JVs ability to do more with less might make him the ideal centre to play with Demar and Kyle because you're likely right, the offence isn't going to evolve.

                  At this point, I've given up much hope that Casey/Demar/Kyle are going to suddenly use JV more but it's the minutes that need to be there. There is absolutely no reason for him to be playing less than 30 mpg any given night and should be closer to 33-34-35 range given his age and our backup options.

                  As far as the post season goes, I'm not sure we've seen both Demar and Lowry peaking at the same time yet which might be the bigger cap on our success. If those two can't coexist at their best, then we won't beat the Cavs because JV has shown he can play at a very high level regardless of whether it's the Demar show or the Kyle show. But if we can get those two going together and JV continues to do what he's shown he can when given the minutes, then I'd take our chances in a 7 game series with anyone in the East.

                  Much like last year, the entire regular season serves no purpose other than being ready for the playoffs. It's in April and May that the players need to earn their paycheques.
                  Pretty much nailed the concerns of a lot of folks on this board. And it is scary to think what happens with the Raptors if they get DeMar, Kyle, JV and a healthy PF working together. (fantasy thought - Carroll gets better at the same time)

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                  • Nilanka wrote: View Post
                    I guess it all depends on how many touches Casey plans to give him. We can expect the same, if not more touches for Lowry and DeRozan this year. Ross is expected to increase his output too. Amir is the only guy in the starting lineup who doesn't have plays drawn for him, leaving Jonas as the 3rd/4th option on the floor.

                    Even when Vasquez and Lou enter the game, Jonas would play second fiddle.

                    Let's hope his time with Hakeem changes Casey's offensive approach.
                    Swap a few names and the story remains the same. Now that dd is even better there is even less chance for Jonas. They went to him in game 1. He was amazing but so was dd. They haven't looked back. I wonder if jv got drafted by Detroit before Drummond? He be a beast and the whole team would be built around him I think.
                    Maybe he will get into the screen assists hall of fame eventually?

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                    • I don't know what to think of Jonas anymore. I mean, I appreciate his efficiency and eagerness to improve, but I see a hard ceiling.

                      If there's 1 word to describe his game, I would say it's "clumsy".

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                      • I love JV, I just don't know how well he is adapted to the speed that the game is played at, he's fairly slow footed. The only way it makes sense not to explore trades for him is if he does in fact get 30+ mins and does become the 2nd scoring option after DD.

                        I just don't see that happening with any consistency and quite frankly he throws himself off mentally on various nights but getting overly frustrated with foul calls or missed shots. KL and DD seems to use a long or athletic center well enough. They basically give Bebe the same looks as JV minus the one or two daily pump fakes. I think we'd be better off with a defensive C like a Noel n use JV to get an all-star like talent at PF that can space the floor better.

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                        • The idea of trading JV is melding into all his different threads, but I'd like to just quickly point out that trading JV for a PF is not likely... at least not an all-star caliber PF. Most teams that have an all-star caliber PF don't need a center. Howard, Jordan, Gobert, Vucevic/Biz, Gasol, etc.. There is always the option of bringing in a 3rd team, but that just then makes it complicated.

                          Personally I just don't see Masai trading away JV. He's good in his role even if its limited. And he's been crazy good in the playoffs. It's not like his salary is getting in the way of anything either.

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                          • Nilanka wrote: View Post
                            I don't know what to think of Jonas anymore. I mean, I appreciate his efficiency and eagerness to improve, but I see a hard ceiling.

                            If there's 1 word to describe his game, I would say it's "clumsy".
                            His game isn't appealing to the eyes. It's only been 6-7 months since he was dominating the playoffs. I'm staying optimistic because of what he showed on the most important stage.

                            Did also hear Casey say that JV isn't 100% yet so that is contributing to his play and minutes somewhat.

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                            • Lots of good discussion here on both sides. I wouldn't describe jv as clumsy but I agree re: footspeed and defensive ceiling.
                              At least this year, I'll take all the weapons I can vs. lebron. That includes jv and noel. I'm not a big Sully guy, especially considering the injury and conditioning and Ufa status. I like delon but losing those two for noel might be an upgrade vs lebron. We gotta better chance to keep noel over Sully if things work out and there's no pt for delon anyway. Into next yr, well, I'd have to see how things played out this year first before I can say trade jv for sure. It is hard to get the elusive pf, but jv would certainly be our best chip. A healthy noel signed long term could be traded to recoup the cost of acquiring him and possibly return someone useful long term. Delon is useful but not to us right now. I don't know how useful Sully will be short term. He certainly won't be long term.

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                              • Jangles wrote: View Post
                                His game isn't appealing to the eyes. It's only been 6-7 months since he was dominating the playoffs. I'm staying optimistic because of what he showed on the most important stage.

                                Did also hear Casey say that JV isn't 100% yet so that is contributing to his play and minutes somewhat.
                                People keep bringing up his performances in the playoffs......And for the record I agree he played really well.

                                However, lets remember the following:

                                (The Pacers) didn't even have a real Center. They were starting Ian Mihinmi and playing a rookie (Miles Turner) as their Center in crunch time most of the time. That was a matchup JV was supposed to dominate!

                                (The Heat) Whiteside was hobbled the whole time and they had no one else (Haslem and Stoudemire - lol) so JV was supposed to dominate there as well.

                                Are we really surprised he dominated, given the matchups/competition at the Center position?

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