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  • G__Deane wrote: View Post

    He used to finish more high off the tin but he's throwing it up straight into blocks now. Doesn't seem to blow by anyone either or the help is coming faster.
    Totally. Plus because of that lack of burst a half to full step on a shot blocker is kinda useless. High off glass would help, also could use some more patience and hesitasion to throw off a shot blockers rhythm. In transition hes just got to let someone else lead the break and drift out to three to space.

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    • chris wrote: View Post

      not sure why you'd assume i'm unaware of the relationship, it's the reason i pointed out the discrepancy. it was also worth pointing out that those two in particular are absolute zeros on defense, and while i'm not buying stock in matt and leo's campaign for fred to make all-defense, he is still a damn good defender, limited mostly by his size.

      i just think it's funny that you'll go out of your way at every opportunity to argue that fred is completely replaceable by 8th to 10th men on worse teams. he's better than you give him credit for.

      anyhow, try not to be such a cock to strangers on the internet.
      Yes, I did assume you were unaware of the relationship, because no person educated on the topic would even consider comparing a 37.7% USG player to a 23.4% USG player. That's a 14% difference... not even in the same stratosphere, at least when it comes to that stat. That's like comparing prime Lowry's offense to Bismack.

      Was not trying to be a d*ck.... I truly assumed you were ignorant on the concept and applicability. You really should check out the book.... it's a great read on the early advanced stats. That's a meant as a recommendation, not a slight or dig.

      Sure, Fred is probably a better defender in certain matchups and schemes than some of those guys. But Mixx questioned his efficiency, and that's what the numbers say for him and others..... I'm just reporting them... don't shoot the messenger.

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      • lol that player pyramid is from Nick Wright. Enough said.
        "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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        • golden wrote: View Post

          Yes, I did assume you were unaware of the relationship, because no person educated on the topic would even consider comparing a 37.7% USG player to a 23.4% USG player. That's a 14% difference... not even in the same stratosphere, at least when it comes to that stat. That's like comparing prime Lowry's offense to Bismack.

          Was not trying to be a d*ck.... I truly assumed you were ignorant on the concept and applicability. You really should check out the book.... it's a great read on the early advanced stats. That's a meant as a recommendation, not a slight or dig.

          Sure, Fred is probably a better defender in certain matchups and schemes than some of those guys. But Mixx questioned his efficiency, and that's what the numbers say for him and others..... I'm just reporting them... don't shoot the messenger.
          i thought you were purposefully cherry picking bench role players as another subtle indication that fred could be replaced with just about anybody, so i responded with the numbers of some of the other board favorites, recognizing that while beal and lavine's numbers are good at that USG, they are two of the very worst defenders in the league.

          yes i'm aware of the general decline in efficiency with increased useage relationship but have not read the book, so i'll take your word for it that there's a lot more to it and check it out some time.

          i gotta say though that when i see a USG up at that 37.7% my first reaction is not "holy crap that's impressive" but more "gee, i bet that team would fare better if their entire offense did not so completely revolve around that one player", even if that player is maintaining an ORtg above league average.

          like, there's probably diminishing returns at some point. maybe the book would shed light on that, though i suspect not and that his logic is probably the driver for how houston was playing with harden and dallas is playing with luka. looking at the zards specifically, if i were them i'd rather take 5% off beal's USG (and another 7 or 8 off westbrooks) and redistribute it to bryant, bertans, lopez, and their young guys (deni and rui).

          anyhow, i'm sorry i called you a cock.

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          • #COVID disagreements are real

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            • Did you see shirtless Durant last night? There's hope for Boucher after all!

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              • Beal was 47/4/6 last night. We have nothing like that

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                • G__Deane wrote: View Post
                  Beal was 47/4/6 last night. We have nothing like that
                  Okay, but the game was over in the first quarter....

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                  • Embiid is not scared of Gasol anymore
                    Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

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                    • slaw wrote: View Post

                      Okay, but the game was over in the first quarter....
                      LOL, Slaw the Beal love around here disregards his complete lack of ability to lead his team to any sort of success.

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                      • LJ2 wrote: View Post

                        LOL, Slaw the Beal love around here disregards his complete lack of ability to lead his team to any sort of success.
                        He's no Lowry but his teams have kind of sucked. I mean this year, they have to play Len like 20mpg because their primary center is out for the year.

                        I think his offense is needed in Toronto. We have lost so many games because we go into these 2-3 minute stretches where we just can't score. He can fix that. Defensively we'd have 4 guys around him to pick up the slack.

                        I'd give up 2-3 picks for him. We can try to buy back picks if he leaves in 2 seasons by trading some of our guys like Fred/Pascal/etc and go into a full rebuild.



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                        • LJ2 wrote: View Post

                          LOL, Slaw the Beal love around here disregards his complete lack of ability to lead his team to any sort of success.
                          Honestly with Pascal, OG, Beal and Lowry, it wouldn't be bad at all. Kyle is the leader and floor general, Beal is the main scorer, Pascal will do a bit of everything and OG is your 3&D specialist.

                          3 of those guys won a championship and have been part of winning seasons for many years.

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                          • A.I wrote: View Post

                            Honestly with Pascal, OG, Beal and Lowry, it wouldn't be bad at all. Kyle is the leader and floor general, Beal is the main scorer, Pascal will do a bit of everything and OG is your 3&D specialist.

                            3 of those guys won a championship and have been part of winning seasons for many years.
                            Are you thinking Fred for Beal? Fred can't be traded until March 2.. long time away still. I think Beal gets traded before then.

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                            • LJ2 wrote: View Post

                              LOL, Slaw the Beal love around here disregards his complete lack of ability to lead his team to any sort of success.
                              I like Beal and he checks off a lot of boxes in terms of the Raptors but I have some healthy skepticism about what is happening this season.....

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                              • planetmars wrote: View Post

                                Are you thinking Fred for Beal? Fred can't be traded until March 2.. long time away still. I think Beal gets traded before then.
                                if we did trade for beal i would prefer it be for lowry because fred is younger and you could presumably keep that core contending for longer. fred/OG/pascal might still be enough to cover beal's shortcomings on the defensive end, depending who's at center.

                                given recent precedent with holiday and harden it would probably take the max allowable (or close to it) draft assets going to washington along with lowry (up to 3 firsts and 4 pick swaps)... would that core be good enough to want to lock in long term with minimal opportunity to restock talent in the draft for 7 years? i am skeptical.

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