Everything Draft 2021

[The Great One]

If we're going to play the "fit" game, who's our backup 4 again?

Boucher

[LJ2]

It's just a really slow release.. it won't really work in the NBA in my opinion.. if he takes that long and misses, it'll just hurt his confidence.

You're talking like these guys are finished products when in fact their games are yet to undergo the biggest changes after they enter the NBA.

At worst Barnes brings really good defense that can guard 3 positions right now and will be able to guard small C's once he gets stronger, toughness which this team needs, play making ability and a guy that can bring the ball up when our guards are pressured.

I really like our defensive identity, and I'm not so sure we should give that up so easily because Luka and Tre are putting up these crazy numbers. We're not going to out duel Brooklyn or Golden State regardless of who we draft, but we may have an easier time defending these super teams if we have no weak defenders on the floor.

[LJ2]

Boucher

They can't keep Boucher can they? We definitely need some players on rookie scale contracts in our rotation.

[TrueTorontoFan]

Boucher

that is also how I am reading it.

[planetmars]

You're talking like these guys are finished products when in fact their games are yet to undergo the biggest changes after they enter the NBA.

At worst Barnes brings really good defense that can guard 3 positions right now and will be able to guard small C's once he gets stronger, toughness which this team needs, play making ability and a guy that can bring the ball up when our guards are pressured.

I really like our defensive identity, and I'm not so sure we should give that up so easily because Luka and Tre are putting up these crazy numbers. We're not going to out duel Brooklyn or Golden State regardless of who we draft, but we may have an easier time defending these super teams if we have no weak defenders on the floor.

Because of the rule changes in basketball it is so much more important that have a really great offensive player over a really great defensive player. Ideally you want both because defense still matters.. but it is so much harder to defend in the NBA then it is to score. The Atlanta / NY matchup kind of confirmed this already.. even though neither are real contenders. And it's not even about Trae vs Luka. It's about the other guys.. well not in Dallas and that's why they lost. But Atlanta has guys like Collins, Huerter, Bogdonovich, Sweet Lou, and Gallo all basically stiffs on defense but they are getting it done.

Dunn isn't playing. Okongwu might become a good defender one day. Rondo was there but was traded for Lou. The only guys they have that can play defense are Capela and Hunter.. otherwise they play team defense and do a pretty good job at it.

I just think offensive upside is important.. and that's why I've become low on guys like Keon Johnson, Kuminga and Barnes. Could be great defenders.. and there is a place for that.. but the Toronto Raptors need guys that can score too. We don't have a lot of that.. and we especially lose a lot of it when Lowry leaves or hangs 'em up.

That's why I'm also higher on Moody and Wagner because I think those guys can at least shoot already. They can also play defense though. They may not become all-nba caliber.. but that might be tough to find outside the top 4 anyway.

[TrueTorontoFan]

Because of the rule changes in basketball it is so much more important that have a really great offensive player over a really great defensive player. Ideally you want both because defense still matters.. but it is so much harder to defend in the NBA then it is to score. The Atlanta / NY matchup kind of confirmed this already.. even though neither are real contenders. And it's not even about Trae vs Luka. It's about the other guys.. well not in Dallas and that's why they lost. But Atlanta has guys like Collins, Huerter, Bogdonovich, Sweet Lou, and Gallo all basically stiffs on defense but they are getting it done.

Dunn isn't playing. Okongwu might become a good defender one day. Rondo was there but was traded for Lou. The only guys they have that can play defense are Capela and Hunter.. otherwise they play team defense and do a pretty good job at it.

I just think offensive upside is important.. and that's why I've become low on guys like Keon Johnson, Kuminga and Barnes. Could be great defenders.. and there is a place for that.. but the Toronto Raptors need guys that can score too. We don't have a lot of that.. and we especially lose a lot of it when Lowry leaves or hangs 'em up.

That's why I'm also higher on Moody and Wagner because I think those guys can at least shoot already. They can also play defense though. They may not become all-nba caliber.. but that might be tough to find outside the top 4 anyway.

I think bottom line we have enough two way guys.. we need either a Jalen Green, or Mobley, or Cade. Basically we need someone who can playmake and score at a really solid rate.

[planetmars]

I think bottom line we have enough two way guys.. we need either a Jalen Green, or Mobley, or Cade. Basically we need someone who can playmake and score at a really solid rate.

I'd swap Mobley for Suggs but yeah. I think Mobley is a better defender than scorer, but still young. I'm growing on Trae Mann. But might be too high at 7/8. I think a treadmill team this year is going to get a good player.

[G__Deane]

You're talking like these guys are finished products when in fact their games are yet to undergo the biggest changes after they enter the NBA.

At worst Barnes brings really good defense that can guard 3 positions right now and will be able to guard small C's once he gets stronger, toughness which this team needs, play making ability and a guy that can bring the ball up when our guards are pressured.

I really like our defensive identity, and I'm not so sure we should give that up so easily because Luka and Tre are putting up these crazy numbers. We're not going to out duel Brooklyn or Golden State regardless of who we draft, but we may have an easier time defending these super teams if we have no weak defenders on the floor.

Who was the last team to win a chip without a top 10 offense?
Is it the same answer as the last team to win it all without an elite player, back to the Detroit days?

A strong defensive identity is fantastic but you don't win many games 90-80 and you don't shut down the lebrons, Davis', Kawhi's, Durants, Hardens, over a 7 game series.

[MixxAOR]

Who was the last team to win a chip without a top 10 offense?
Is it the same answer as the last team to win it all without an elite player, back to the Detroit days?

A strong defensive identity is fantastic but you don't win many games 90-80 and you don't shut down the lebrons, Davis', Kawhi's, Durants, Hardens, over a 7 game series.

To be fair you can say the same thing about defense

[G__Deane]

To be fair you can say the same thing about defense

Perhaps, maybe some stats geek (I say that with affection) can look it up much faster than I can. But I bet the NBA champion normally has a higher ranking O than D.

Does a knockout offense with an average D beat a lockdown D with average offense?

Or pitching beats good hitting?

Said another way, defense is our identity .... and we missed the playoffs

[LJ2]

Who was the last team to win a chip without a top 10 offense?
Is it the same answer as the last team to win it all without an elite player, back to the Detroit days?

A strong defensive identity is fantastic but you don't win many games 90-80 and you don't shut down the lebrons, Davis', Kawhi's, Durants, Hardens, over a 7 game series.

Raps had a top 10 offense before Kawhi.

[TrueTorontoFan]

I'd swap Mobley for Suggs but yeah. I think Mobley is a better defender than scorer, but still young. I'm growing on Trae Mann. But might be too high at 7/8. I think a treadmill team this year is going to get a good player.

Suggs you can add to that mix but honestly Mobley I think ends up being very good. It is rare to have the ability to score and defend like that at that size and move. He can also handle decently well for his size. It is impressive. It is rare enough and he seems to want to get down low and rebound as well (we are essentially a treadmill team with a lottery pick lol).

[golden]

To be fair you can say the same thing about defense

None of those old top 10 comps matter that much anymore because superstars coast through the regular season these days. I mean, even Kawhi said the regular season was just practice. A huge part of defense is simply effort and superstars can crank that up in the playoffs. Only teams like Raptors, Heat and Bucks play balls to the wall defense in the regular season.

[TrueTorontoFan]

Raps had a top 10 offense before Kawhi.

wasn't it top 5?

[MixxAOR]

None of those old top 10 comps matter that much anymore because superstars coast through the regular season these days. I mean, even Kawhi said the regular season was just practice. A huge part of defense is simply effort and superstars can crank that up in the playoffs. Only teams like Raptors, Heat and Bucks play balls to the wall defense in the regular season.

Jazz, Clippers, 76ers, Suns are in Top 10 in defensive rating.