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Everything Draft 2021
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Did a deep dive on Tennessee. I watched a couple full games. Springer is really, really good. He’s the kind of guy that makes his entire team better, constantly making the right plays on and off the ball. Defensively, he’s really sound and will immediately be a plus defender in the NBA. His biggest issue is a lack of offensive polish and development. He doesn’t have a single go to move, and he can’t do much when given the ball at the end of the shot clock. He moves it well but he’s definitely not a finisher, at least not yet. He’s strong and can sometimes get to the rim, he’s a pretty solid finisher and a pretty solid jump shooter. All this being said, he’s only 18 and I think he can already do a portion of what Kyle does for a team, minus some of the KLOE moments. He’s also a very good passer. I’d be very happy if the Raps drafted him, but he won’t be really good for at least 4 years probably. Lots of the problems I have with Springer can probably be explained by the role he seemed to play on Tennessee as a tertiary ball mover on offense. He wasn’t asked to do a lot so when he was handed the ball at the end of a shot clock like hot potato he did his best but wasn’t always ready. One thing that I really love is that he hits the glass on both ends and he gets fouled a lot because of how big and strong he is. He may even continue to grow, given that he is so damn young. The most important thing I noticed was that he was constantly having a positive impact and it felt like he won every minute on the floor just by being out there. Btw, Springer absolutely shut down Tre Mann. Like, completely took him out of the game. Not sure if this is more of an indictment of Mann, but I was really impressed. My comp is Malcolm Brogdon mixed with Kyle. I know that sounds incredible but it’s possible that he never develops as an offensive threat.
Keon, on the other hand, to me has flashes of premier scorer. He’s got a more developed offensive game with a solid dribble pull-up that is essentially unguardable because of the lift he gets, he just misses a lot. His shooting mechanics are pretty solid but need work. He can get to the rim at will and is a better finisher than expected. He’s aggressive offensively (the big difference between him and Ross) and his ultimate approach to the game is one of an alpha, the kind of pedigree this team needs. Defensively he’s as aggressive as he is offensively, and the way he gets after shows to me that he can be a plus defender in the NBA. He’s not as solid Springer but his upside is so high just because of his effort and athletic ability. He also has a playmaking side to him, but it’s mostly a switch he flips. He doesn’t have his head on a swivel and mostly makes a move to either pass or score, not both. He also gets to the line pretty effectively as well. Impact wise, he’s not quite as effective as Springer was for the Voles. My comp would be a shooting guard version of Ja Morant mixed with Terrence Ross.
Overall, I’d be really really happy with either of these guys. I think Springer could be a long term point guard (like next 10 years kind of long term) for a really good team. He played shooting guard in college and he could definitely do that in the NBA, I just liked his playmaking and decision making a lot. The fit next to FVV is probably questionable until he becomes more comfortable as a primary ball handler. Keon is just a whole lot of fun and if everything breaks right for him he could be a huge injection of premier talent that we all want badly. As well, both of these guys have games that should really open up in the NBA. Springer should flourish in the more open game and his decision making and general impact will translate really well. Keon’s athleticism should also benefit from a faster pace and better spaced floor (the Voles often had pretty poor spacing forcing Springer or Keon to drive into a crowd).
So far for me, the first tier goes 1. Mobley 2. Cade. Green and Suggs both have holes in their game that drop them below these two, but I’d still take at least Suggs before anyone else. Green I have a lot of questions about.
Springer and Keon are right at the top of the second tier, ahead of Kuminga. It’s really hard to pick between them right now, but Keon might be able to contribute more as a scorer right away and that’s always fun. I think Springer really has a chance to be an incredible driver of wins though. My pick is Springer just because we’re going to need a Kyle replacement and I’m not sold on FVV despite the advanced stats stuff. The next guy I’m going to look at is Giddey, who I admittedly don’t even know what he looks like or what his position is, so that should be fun.
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"Explosive" is one of those words which sounds dramatic but can mean all sorts of things. Devin Booker has been called an explosive scorer, for example, because he can score a shit-ton of points with very little assistance, but Devin Booker isn't super athletic or amazingly fast, he's just really good at shooting the ball.
Basically, when we say "explosive," we usually just mean "he can score a lot of points without help" and then the means of how defines said explosiveness.
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Maury wrote: View PostDid a deep dive on Tennessee. I watched a couple full games. Springer is really, really good. He’s the kind of guy that makes his entire team better, constantly making the right plays on and off the ball. Defensively, he’s really sound and will immediately be a plus defender in the NBA. His biggest issue is a lack of offensive polish and development. He doesn’t have a single go to move, and he can’t do much when given the ball at the end of the shot clock. He moves it well but he’s definitely not a finisher, at least not yet. He’s strong and can sometimes get to the rim, he’s a pretty solid finisher and a pretty solid jump shooter. All this being said, he’s only 18 and I think he can already do a portion of what Kyle does for a team, minus some of the KLOE moments. He’s also a very good passer. I’d be very happy if the Raps drafted him, but he won’t be really good for at least 4 years probably. Lots of the problems I have with Springer can probably be explained by the role he seemed to play on Tennessee as a tertiary ball mover on offense. He wasn’t asked to do a lot so when he was handed the ball at the end of a shot clock like hot potato he did his best but wasn’t always ready. One thing that I really love is that he hits the glass on both ends and he gets fouled a lot because of how big and strong he is. He may even continue to grow, given that he is so damn young. The most important thing I noticed was that he was constantly having a positive impact and it felt like he won every minute on the floor just by being out there. Btw, Springer absolutely shut down Tre Mann. Like, completely took him out of the game. Not sure if this is more of an indictment of Mann, but I was really impressed. My comp is Malcolm Brogdon mixed with Kyle. I know that sounds incredible but it’s possible that he never develops as an offensive threat.
Keon, on the other hand, to me has flashes of premier scorer. He’s got a more developed offensive game with a solid dribble pull-up that is essentially unguardable because of the lift he gets, he just misses a lot. His shooting mechanics are pretty solid but need work. He can get to the rim at will and is a better finisher than expected. He’s aggressive offensively (the big difference between him and Ross) and his ultimate approach to the game is one of an alpha, the kind of pedigree this team needs. Defensively he’s as aggressive as he is offensively, and the way he gets after shows to me that he can be a plus defender in the NBA. He’s not as solid Springer but his upside is so high just because of his effort and athletic ability. He also has a playmaking side to him, but it’s mostly a switch he flips. He doesn’t have his head on a swivel and mostly makes a move to either pass or score, not both. He also gets to the line pretty effectively as well. Impact wise, he’s not quite as effective as Springer was for the Voles. My comp would be a shooting guard version of Ja Morant mixed with Terrence Ross.
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magoon wrote: View Post"Explosive" is one of those words which sounds dramatic but can mean all sorts of things. Devin Booker has been called an explosive scorer, for example, because he can score a shit-ton of points with very little assistance, but Devin Booker isn't super athletic or amazingly fast, he's just really good at shooting the ball.
Basically, when we say "explosive," we usually just mean "he can score a lot of points without help" and then the means of how defines said explosiveness.
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Watched some Jalen Johnson last night. Showed some flashes but definitely looked a little soft (for a power forward especially), while not really quick or fluid enough for a full-time 3. Shades of Rui Hachimura and Kyle Kuzma.
I think that's a pass.Last edited by SkywalkerAC; Thu May 20, 2021, 11:46 AM.
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big boi wrote: View Post
Keon is crazy good defensively. It's that and his offensive upside that makes him such an interesting prospect. If teams believe his shot mechanics and handle can be improved through coaching and hard work, and they believe he'll put in the work, you have a very high end prospect here.
All the other superstars like Durrant, Harden, Steph, Dame, Booker, Beal, Luka etc are elite, pure scoring types not known for defence....Durrant maybe, but only at times. Just takes too much energy to be elite on both ends of the floor unless you're a generation type LBJ, Jordan, Kobe.
One of those elite type scoring guys is what we badly need to get to the next level isn't it?
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LJ2 wrote: View Post
Raises the question, do we want yet another two-way player with this pick or do we want to shoot for a prospect which projects as an elite scoring type? There are maybe two guys in the league that can score and defend at the highest level (LBJ and Kawhi) and one of those guys needs to take large chunks of each season off for rest. PG hasn't proven he can do both in the playoffs so I left him off the list.
All the other superstars like Durrant, Harden, Steph, Dame, Booker, Beal, Luka etc are elite, pure scoring types not known for defence....Durrant maybe, but only at times. Just takes too much energy to be elite on both ends of the floor unless you're a generation type LBJ, Jordan, Kobe.
One of those elite type scoring guys is what we badly need to get to the next level isn't it?
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big boi wrote: View Post
Keon is crazy good defensively. It's that and his offensive upside that makes him such an interesting prospect. If teams believe his shot mechanics and handle can be improved through coaching and hard work, and they believe he'll put in the work, you have a very high end prospect here.
Keon might not be there at 7 though. He is now #6 on most mocks. Time for the Raptors to start hyping up Giddey - call him the next Luka Doncic or something.
Mamba Mentality
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SkywalkerAC wrote: View PostWatched some Jalen Johnson last night. Showed some flashes but definitely looked a little soft (for a power forward especially), while not really quick or fluid enough for a full-time 3. Shades of Rui Hachimura and Kyle Kuzma.
I think that's a pass.Mamba Mentality
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SkywalkerAC wrote: View Post
Keon's also got potential as a player that can aggressively hunt down and create his own shot - takes players in the post, elevate over everyone with his pull-up, etc. Otherwise he'd probably be nowhere close to the top 8 in this draft.
I'd be fine if they draft Keon, I'm just wondering if that is the type of player we need to get to the next level?
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LJ2 wrote: View Post
From everything I hear about him on this board it does sound like he has great two way potential. But I say again, there are very few guys that are elite two way players. I think it's safe to say Keon isn't going to be a LeBron or Kawhi, so do we want another good player or are we looking for an elite scorer like the guys I mentioned above?
I'd be fine if they draft Keon, I'm just wondering if that is the type of player we need to get to the next level?Twitter @WJ_FINDLAY
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