Everything Gary Trent Jr.

[3inthekeon]

I didn't interview the guy or write the tweet. If you think Gery Woelful is full of shit and purposefully taking things out of context to make a point then so be it.

Originally I thought it was Gery, but Gery didn't take it out of context at all. He asked the exec one simple question and posted the response. Read Gery's original tweet.

It was @NBACentral, a totally different person, who claimed the exec said something he didn't say.

[DanH]

Originally I thought it was Gery, but Gery didn't take it out of context at all. He asked the exec one simple question and posted the response. Read Gery's original tweet.

It was @NBACentral, a totally different person, who claimed the exec said something he didn't say.

This is why we shouldn't follow or quote from these aggregator accounts. Always have to click through or search for the original report. Aggregators are in the engagement farming business - they'll misquote or misinterpret on purpose to drive clicks.

[Primer]

This is the actual tweet, rather than the aggregation posted:

Note that the context is specifically a grade of his defence, not the signing. In fact the context around the signing was that he filled a very real need at starting SG - but that it didn't address the existing issue from last year - the Bucks' backcourt defence being a disaster.

I read the tweet but the guy who wrote the tweet said it was a bad signing and used the quote from an NBA exec to back it up. If you want to interpret that as the NBA exec thought it was a good signing then I can't argue with it but that's not how I take it.

[Primer]

Right. The guy who can shoot was a complete disaster last year on defence, dramatically worse than Gary (-2.9 DEPM - literally only 5 worse grades than that league wide). Maybe he's way better this year! But that's a hope. If he's remotely the same defender as last year it's going to be a big step back on that end.

The other guys who might be similar (average-ish, maybe a little below, maybe a little above) defenders to Gary are Bruce and Ochai, both of whom will be a huge step down in terms of shooting. Hence my "and can shoot" note added. And probably worth noting that last year at least Gary graded out as a significantly better defender than Bruce (-0.2 DEPM vs -1.6 for Bruce), so even that is being generous and banking on some of that being attributable to injury. Ochai was comparable (0.0 DEPM) and could have some upside there if he improves.

You can quote DEPM until you're blue in the face I don't take it as gospel as who is a good defender or bad defender. Guys switch teams and their DEPM changes a lot and it's the same guy. I like to watch the games to judge defense I don't think any stats do a good job of capturing it.

Based on EPM Hartenstein was the 14th best player in the NBA. Can't just blindly use stats.

[DanH]

You can quote DEPM until you're blue in the face I don't take it as gospel as who is a good defender or bad defender. Guys switch teams and their DEPM changes a lot and it's the same guy. I like to watch the games to judge defense I don't think any stats do a good job of capturing it.

Based on EPM Hartenstein was the 14th best player in the NBA. Can't just blindly use stats.

EPM doesn't measure how good a player is. It measures their impact on their team. Guys can impact different teams with different needs and systems in different ways. It's part of why I'm optimistic about Mitchell's defensive impact here - I think he provides a skillset our defence needs so I don't expect his poor defensive EPM from last year to carry over. Similarly, the Knicks are probably going to hurt more from losing Hartenstein (who is not the 14th best player in the NBA) than you'd expect, because although he was not that good, he WAS that important to their success on the court.

Gary didn't hurt our defence last year (or most prior years) - didn't help either, but still. He'd still be here with the same teammates beside whom he didn't hurt us in the past so shouldn't expect that to change. Gradey really, really badly hurt our defence last year. Maybe he won't next year. That would be great - whether it's because he makes a big improvement personally or he finds himself in a better context to not hurt the team as much. But hardly something we can rely on right now.

I also watch the games to judge defence and based on the eye test alone I am confident that we will see a defensive drop off in the starting lineup (though a leap from Gradey, IQ or Scottie on that end could definitely help). But me saying that won't convince anyone, so I prefer to jump that and present some evidence.

[golden]

This is the actual tweet, rather than the aggregation posted:

Note that the context is specifically a grade of his defence, not the signing. In fact the context around the signing was that he filled a very real need at starting SG - but that it didn't address the existing issue from last year - the Bucks' backcourt defence being a disaster.

That's woeful reporting.

[3inthekeon]

I read the tweet but the guy who wrote the tweet said it was a bad signing and used the quote from an NBA exec to back it up. If you want to interpret that as the NBA exec thought it was a good signing then I can't argue with it but that's not how I take it.

The guy (NBACentral) who wrote the tweet DID NOT say it was a bad signing. He did not offer HIS opinion at all. NBACentral claimed the exec was not a fan of the signing. The exec did NOT offer an opinion of the SIGNING, just Gary's defence. That's all.

[The Claw Reborn]

Always a class act.