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'21-'22 Roster Construction

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  • It’s really hard to find Ben Wallace’s wingspan. He is listed at 6’9” but claims he’s closer to 6’7”. It’s really that 240 of pure muscle mass and athleticism.

    Precious is similar in height and has the frame that could put on a ton of muscle but he’s much leaner than Ben was. If Precious focus’s on being an NBA 5, then he could at least have body, and athleticism of Wallace. Wallace was all motor though, and that’s not teachable.

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    • grindhouse wrote: View Post
      Fred = mike James / Lindsay hunter
      Gary Trent jr = rip Hamilton
      pascal = Tayshawn prince
      Barnes = Rasheed Wallace or billups
      OG = Carlos Williamson
      precious = Ben Wallace ?
      OG could be a Rasheed, he has the shooting, can play multiple positions, and working on his overall game. Rasheed was awesome!

      Pascal is a more talented, stronger Prince.

      Gary Trent Jr. could be a Rip type player but has to learn to pass.

      That Pistons team was awesome... the Raps should be using that team as a mold. We definitely have similar pieces and well not physically imposing, we’re very strong on the Defensive side of the ball.

      Thanks for sharing that clip! It gives us something to look forward to.
      Last edited by saints91; Thu Sep 2, 2021, 01:36 PM.

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      • I think this is where Scottie can rub off on this team. He is a very in your face type of guy. We need that swagger, and toughness to rub off on OG and Pascal. Precious might already have it with the double pistol point after dunking.

        if we are going to have that defensive identity, then they also need to be pests on the court. Get in the other teams head. The 90’s Knicks, Bad Boys, and 2000’s Pistons, Grit and Grind pulled it off. I would love to cheer for a team like that again. (I was a huge Knicks fan prior to the Raptors existence, and before Isiah and James Dolan ruined them)

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        • grindhouse wrote: View Post



          all we need is our Ben Wallace
          Giving me goose bumps. Something like what I am hoping for this season.

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          • Primer wrote: View Post

            You're still not getting the system. Our offense isn't built to score few points. It's built to score a lot by getting easy buckets for everyone. Everyone on the team is expected to be moving on offense and looking for the open man to get easy buckets. That's why we want as many high level passers as possible on the floor not just the PG, and all high IQ guys who are looking for the open man not their own shot. We're not focused on iso or having 1 guy score a ton. We will still score a lot just differently than other teams.
            I get they are bringing in smart, high IQ guys, but you really think the addition of Scottie and the subtraction of Lowry equals a reinvention of their offense? Not sure if there are some stats out there which reflect Raptors are a good passing team but assist numbers seem to always be low with this team if that is any indication. Not a lot of smart passers and well, the majority of that roster is returning.

            What team do you thing the Raptors offense will look like if you had to pick one because to me it sounds like you are describing something similar to GS, but they have/had a team of historically great shooters which defenders had to stick with.

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            • grindhouse wrote: View Post
              Fred = mike James / Lindsay hunter
              Gary Trent jr = rip Hamilton
              pascal = Tayshawn prince
              Barnes = Rasheed Wallace or billups
              OG = Carlos Williamson
              precious = Ben Wallace ?
              You missed arguably the most important guy: Chauncey Billups. We had him.... but he's in Miami now. Scottie is not Billups.

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              • LJ2 wrote: View Post

                I get they are bringing in smart, high IQ guys, but you really think the addition of Scottie and the subtraction of Lowry equals a reinvention of their offense? Not sure if there are some stats out there which reflect Raptors are a good passing team but assist numbers seem to always be low with this team if that is any indication. Not a lot of smart passers and well, the majority of that roster is returning.

                What team do you thing the Raptors offense will look like if you had to pick one because to me it sounds like you are describing something similar to GS, but they have/had a team of historically great shooters which defenders had to stick with.
                Yeah it's all theoretical now. We don't have a classic go-to scorer, so it becomes "we'll score 'by committee' with lots of good passing and 'high IQ' guys creating easing buckets for others". That would be nice and fun basketball to see (reminds of the old spurs), but then again, it's all theoretical at this point. The reality is (a) our 2 best passers from recent years are gone (Lowry & Gasol), and (b) the team as whole has changed quite a bit, with lots of young guys needing to develop chemistry together in other for this passing, easy-buckets party to get going.

                It's not that I don't believe it's the direction they're headed or that it won't be effective, it's more as in it will take time. Our half-court scoring had trouble last year, and losing one of the best facilitators in the game (Lowry)is more likely to compound that than to help. Not a bad vision to have though, I'd personally rather watch a dynamic game where the ball moves and everyone gets involved than one guy trying for 40 every game while everyone takes a back seat.
                2019 NBA Champions. Glad to have doubted the doubters.

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                • inthepaint wrote: View Post

                  Yeah it's all theoretical now. We don't have a classic go-to scorer, so it becomes "we'll score 'by committee' with lots of good passing and 'high IQ' guys creating easing buckets for others". That would be nice and fun basketball to see (reminds of the old spurs), but then again, it's all theoretical at this point. The reality is (a) our 2 best passers from recent years are gone (Lowry & Gasol), and (b) the team as whole has changed quite a bit, with lots of young guys needing to develop chemistry together in other for this passing, easy-buckets party to get going.

                  It's not that I don't believe it's the direction they're headed or that it won't be effective, it's more as in it will take time. Our half-court scoring had trouble last year, and losing one of the best facilitators in the game (Lowry)is more likely to compound that than to help. Not a bad vision to have though, I'd personally rather watch a dynamic game where the ball moves and everyone gets involved than one guy trying for 40 every game while everyone takes a back seat.
                  Just as you say it would be great if Raps can pull off that type of offense with guys cutting and getting easy baskets but it's not easy to pull off without a guy that sucks in defenses like Duncan could for the Spurs or Steph does for GS. Was it Tyson that said everyone has a great plan until they get punched in the mouth? I think they go back to relying on Siakam and FVV to do the bulk of the scoring and they surround those guys with strong defenders. I go into every season thinking Raps are going to drop off but NN always has a plan... with last season being an understandable blip.

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                  • LJ2 wrote: View Post
                    ...it's not easy to pull off without a guy that sucks in defenses like Duncan could for the Spurs or Steph does for GS...
                    I think Pascal, OG and Fred all step up in terms of efficiency. I think Trent will surprise and several others will help create a monster good bench. The problem with a team where no one player can get you a basket, but anyone of 10 guys can is that you can't afford to double anybody. If everyone is ready to pass and everyone else is looking to set picks or cut, there is always a great shot available. And when your D can be counted on for steals and turnovers, you get possessions. Possessions win games.

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                    • LJ2 wrote: View Post

                      Just as you say it would be great if Raps can pull off that type of offense with guys cutting and getting easy baskets but it's not easy to pull off without a guy that sucks in defenses like Duncan could for the Spurs or Steph does for GS. Was it Tyson that said everyone has a great plan until they get punched in the mouth? I think they go back to relying on Siakam and FVV to do the bulk of the scoring and they surround those guys with strong defenders. I go into every season thinking Raps are going to drop off but NN always has a plan... with last season being an understandable blip.
                      Yeah every offence needs spacing. Doesn't matter the style. Spacing either comes from good distance shooters, from guys attracting doubles, or from skillful ballhandlers able to thread the needle on pick-and-rolls (eg Lowry, Chris Paul). If you don't have that, you can pass and cut all you want, it's gonna be tight.

                      The key to unlock things here is Pascal back to shooting at least 37% from 3 and start participating on pick and rolls when the defence is set (both as ballhandler and roller/popper). That, and playing your best players more (ie if he's earning, more minutes to Barnes instead of Birch).
                      Last edited by inthepaint; Thu Sep 2, 2021, 11:44 PM.
                      2019 NBA Champions. Glad to have doubted the doubters.

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                      • Puffer wrote: View Post

                        I think Pascal, OG and Fred all step up in terms of efficiency. I think Trent will surprise and several others will help create a monster good bench. The problem with a team where no one player can get you a basket, but anyone of 10 guys can is that you can't afford to double anybody. If everyone is ready to pass and everyone else is looking to set picks or cut, there is always a great shot available. And when your D can be counted on for steals and turnovers, you get possessions. Possessions win games.
                        The big question will be if any of our guys get better at penetrating off the dribble. Pascal has it in him, OG is athletic enough, and Fred is shifty enough, but until now none of them have been able to do it consistently enough to prevent us from having serious offensive droughts.

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                        • Maury wrote: View Post

                          The big question will be if any of our guys get better at penetrating off the dribble. Pascal has it in him, OG is athletic enough, and Fred is shifty enough, but until now none of them have been able to do it consistently enough to prevent us from having serious offensive droughts.
                          Yes. Have all the IQ and running around you want, if no one's an elite one-on-one threat or shot creator, if no one's bending the defence at will or putting pressure on the rim, good defences will be able to put the clamps on a bunch of guys running around and passing a lot. You don't get those easy buckets in the last 3 minutes and for that reason, and because a lot of the team is pretty young, I think half court offensive struggles are still a key theme this season. Especially when the game is on the line.
                          "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                          • S.R. wrote: View Post

                            Yes. Have all the IQ and running around you want, if no one's an elite one-on-one threat or shot creator, if no one's bending the defence at will or putting pressure on the rim, good defences will be able to put the clamps on a bunch of guys running around and passing a lot. You don't get those easy buckets in the last 3 minutes and for that reason, and because a lot of the team is pretty young, I think half court offensive struggles are still a key theme this season. Especially when the game is on the line.
                            That video of the old style Detroit team was quite instructive. If you are disrupting the passing lanes and getting steals and baskets in transition, the other team is missing opportunities to shoot. If you are getting more possessions than the other team, and getting transition baskets, you have a great opportunity to win ball games.

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                            • Puffer wrote: View Post

                              That video of the old style Detroit team was quite instructive. If you are disrupting the passing lanes and getting steals and baskets in transition, the other team is missing opportunities to shoot. If you are getting more possessions than the other team, and getting transition baskets, you have a great opportunity to win ball games.
                              Trying to win games using steals to generate transition buckets sounds great in theory, but it isn't a sustainable advantage. Even those Pistons team were never top 5 in generating turnovers (TOV% or TOV/100 differential). They won through great team defense, slowing the pace, protecting the paint and rebounding (i.e. Ben Wallace). They also got to the FT line a TON. If we want to replicate the Pistons, we'll need an elite rebounder & rim protector like Wallace, who was also a 4 time DPOY.

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                              • Our secondary break should be devastating with our ball handling bigs. If that doesn’t generate a great look you’ve got high pick and roll into drive and kick. Clock winds down we can iso or screen for one of our big forwards. That might all get clamped down on in the playoffs but regular season we’re going to get great looks.

                                Just need to be able to knock down open and semi-contested outside shots. And I think we’re underrated in that regard.

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