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  • Raptors Development

    The Raptors organization has had a reputation for developing players, but it really hit home last night watching them win over the Cavaliers. It was mentioned on the broadcast that the Raptors were playing with basically late pics. They mentioned Flynn was drafted 29th, Pascal was 27th, OG was drafted 23rd, but left out that Fred was undrafted, and Boucher was undrafted. Round that out with undrafted Birch, undrafted Gillespie, undrafted Watanabe and a definite trend seems apparent. (let us not forget Norm drafted 46th and traded to TO who then turned into Gary Trent and a couple of second round picks in the 40's).

    I have no clue what the average % of players on NBA team rosters are undrafted, but this would seem to be a Raptors strength. Also indicative of their high ranking performance over the last bunch of years. And of the difficulties they have faced attracting free agents. If not for high draft picks, and undrafted players, where would they be.

  • #2
    They would be in the same spot as MIN, CLE, SAC etc., perennially in the lottery hoping to land a generational talent to bail them out.

    That's why the prospect of the Raps landing a lotto pick is so exciting. They get to work with a high end talent which they so rarely get a chance to.

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    • #3
      LJ2 wrote: View Post
      They would be in the same spot as MIN, CLE, SAC etc., perennially in the lottery hoping to land a generational talent to bail them out.

      That's why the prospect of the Raps landing a lotto pick is so exciting. They get to work with a high end talent which they so rarely get a chance to.
      One just hopes they can pick as well at the upper end as they can at the bottom. :-)

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      • #4
        Imagine what our guys would have looked like with a proper G-league season?

        Flynn is doing the best he can but he too had covid, so it's pretty great to see him develop with little game time, playing behind two veteran point guards in the rotation. So his future definitely looks bright. He reminds me of a young Delon Wright. He plays with good pace, and is always looking to set guys up before taking his own shot.

        Yuta has been a pleasant surprise. It's his hustle game that seems to be contagious. His 3pt shooting is a surprise.

        I bet Harris will be a keeper too, just can't get any playing time since he's hurt.

        Although with that said, Terrence Davis looked like he had a lot of potential (even made the all rookie team), but floundered his opportunities this year. Matt Thomas didn't do much either (although had a much shorter leash). Stanley Johnson is most likely not going to be a keeper either. Bembry looks hot and cold, and wasn't great last night. Watson had that one big game, but usually disappears on the court (when he gets playing time). Gillepsie looks like a g-leaguer at times. Our bench depth cost us the game against NY and is a big reason why Cleveland made it a game going into half time.

        But yeah you can't really complain about how this team develops its guys. To have both Pascal and Fred have as much success as they've had speaks volumes. It's the modern day Spursian model. It's just too bad this team never had a generational player be part of the core (outside of Kawhi who came in as a mercenary).

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        • #5
          That's why I keep saying they've gotta nail this pick. The best chance they're going to get to get a FVV with size or a Pascal with b'ball IQ.

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          • #6
            It's hard not to love this young core, we're actually quite solid at each position - just short a starting centre, as Boucher is dynamite off the bench there. Lack of a superduperstar is a bit of an obstacle, but when really good pieces click together just right (Mavs, Pistons, even us) anything is possible (because you can also package your developing prospects).

            We knew we needed a systematic, foundational development program - up there with the likes of the Spurs - to compete in Toronto. Well, we've got it.

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            • #7
              I don't remember exactly but weren't they the first champion without a lottery pick on the roster? Or the first in X number of years?

              They traded a couple lotto picks to build that team, but still. The lotto picks got traded and the guys they kept were those late 1st/2nd round/undrafted guys.

              It is a bit of hope to hang onto moving forward here. They need some more of that magic now.
              "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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              • #8
                S.R. wrote: View Post
                I don't remember exactly but weren't they the first champion without a lottery pick on the roster? Or the first in X number of years?

                They traded a couple lotto picks to build that team, but still. The lotto picks got traded and the guys they kept were those late 1st/2nd round/undrafted guys.

                It is a bit of hope to hang onto moving forward here. They need some more of that magic now.
                The first and only team to win without lottery pick on a team
                Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

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                • #9
                  MixxAOR wrote: View Post

                  The first and only team to win without lottery pick on a team
                  Think this was a big part of the "Kawhi carried them" narrative. Lotto picks hit the league with a certain amount of cultural cache that they can hang onto their entire career. Casual and non-Raptors fans had no idea how good Lowry, Siakam, Fred, Norm, etc. were.
                  "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                  • #10
                    LJ2 wrote: View Post
                    They would be in the same spot as MIN, CLE, SAC etc., perennially in the lottery hoping to land a generational talent to bail them out.
                    Or a group of teams with no intention and very little chance of ever winning it all but have a franchise that still makes money every year for shareholders, taps into ever increasing shared TV deals, and franchise value that keeps rising steadily and handily beating the S&P 500

                    That's exactly where you don't want to land, just happy to have an NBA franchise......pssssst, just don't tell the fans

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                    • #11
                      S.R. wrote: View Post

                      Think this was a big part of the "Kawhi carried them" narrative. Lotto picks hit the league with a certain amount of cultural cache that they can hang onto their entire career. Casual and non-Raptors fans had no idea how good Lowry, Siakam, Fred, Norm, etc. were.
                      Nah. The "Kawhi carried them" narrative was because we kept exiting the playoffs in embarrassing fashion... i.e., sweeps and genuflecting to Lebron. It was re-inforced during the Sixers series, when everybody shrank at key moments, except Kawhi. Lowry and Gasol, in particular, became absolutely scared to shoot the damn ball. And FVV got benched. That rep was deserved at that point in time.

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                      • #12
                        golden wrote: View Post

                        Nah. The "Kawhi carried them" narrative was because we kept exiting the playoffs in embarrassing fashion... i.e., sweeps and genuflecting to Lebron. It was re-inforced during the Sixers series, when everybody shrank at key moments, except Kawhi. Lowry and Gasol, in particular, became absolutely scared to shoot the damn ball. And FVV got benched. That rep was deserved at that point in time.
                        Not sure it's an either/or, that's there too. Also it was a single superstar team in an era of Super Friends championship rosters. I get it, but a lot of people missed out on just appreciating a damn good basketball team.
                        "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                        • #13
                          MixxAOR wrote: View Post

                          The first and only team to win without lottery pick on a team
                          2004 Pistons didn't have an all-star playing for them I don't think. Not sure if there were in lottery picks in the lineup.

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                          • #14
                            Puffer wrote: View Post

                            2004 Pistons didn't have an all-star playing for them I don't think. Not sure if there were in lottery picks in the lineup.
                            Chancey was 3rd pick, Rip Hamilton 7th pick and Rasheed was 4th.
                            Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

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                            • #15
                              MixxAOR wrote: View Post

                              Chancey was 3rd pick, Rip Hamilton 7th pick and Rasheed was 4th.
                              I knew someone would be sure of the numbers. Thanks Mixx

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