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  • golden wrote: View Post

    I don't know if players really crumble in the playoffs... as much as their true talent/skill level/weaknesses get exposed ruthlessly & mercilessly.

    With Raptors DeRozan, they defended without fouling, packed the paint and trapped, which exposed his lack of 3-ball and not yet developed playmaking. With bubble Siakam, they took away his easy transition buckets which exposed the shaky 3-ball as well as handles/craft. With bubble FVV, they baited him to score at the rim, which exposed his slow footspeed and lack of finishing ability. With Simmons, it's obviously his shooting, even at the FT line. smh.
    What do you mean? They have a parallel universe twin of themselves, one in the regular season and the other in the playoffs.

    All three players, Simmons, Siakam and Derozan were regular season All Stars, they were picked based on their great performance in the reg season.

    Simmons passing the ball in lieu of a wide open dunk is a sign of mental weakness, nothing to do with talent and skill.
    #TradeVanVleet

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    • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post

      What do you mean? They have a parallel universe twin of themselves, one in the regular season and the other in the playoffs.

      All three players, Simmons, Siakam and Derozan were regular season All Stars, they were picked based on their great performance in the reg season.

      Simmons passing the ball in lieu of a wide open dunk is a sign of mental weakness, nothing to do with talent and skill.
      Are you forgetting Siakam's epic Game 7 meltdown in the 4th quarter? And DeRozan playing so bad vs the Pacers he got benched by his surrogate father, Casey? Again Game 7 / 4th quarter. Eventually, as the series drags on, the repeated failures (due to lack of talent / weaknesses being exposed) gets into your head. When did Simmons pass up the dunk? Game 7.

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      • Rudy Bargnani wrote: View Post
        Is Simmons a center in today’s NBA? Surround him with 4 shooters and let him bring the ball up in transition?

        Before the playoffs I thought golden state would be a good fit for him for Wiggins and the Minnesota pick. Now there’s no way I’m trading the Minnesota pick for Ben.

        Gonna be tough for Philly to get any value at all here.

        I love it. Lol
        Ya but then he cant handle the ball late in the game or has to be off the court. He really only can just stand in the dunkers spot if he isnt handling the ball. If he doesnt improve anything, he can only work with a team were the other big doesn't play in the paint. Who can shoot 3s and pass like Jokic. Jokic and murray work from the top of the key and simmions can just stand in the dunkers spot.
        To be the champs you got to beat the champs

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        • Rudy Bargnani wrote: View Post
          Is Simmons a center in today’s NBA? Surround him with 4 shooters and let him bring the ball up in transition?

          Before the playoffs I thought golden state would be a good fit for him for Wiggins and the Minnesota pick. Now there’s no way I’m trading the Minnesota pick for Ben.

          Gonna be tough for Philly to get any value at all here.

          I love it. Lol
          Genius new age GM Daryl Morey (who hasn't even been to the NBA finals) could have had Harden for Simmons. lol. Can a brother get a mulligan? And rumor is he could have had Lowry, but didn't want to include the extra 1st rounder that we wanted.

          Morey is a very good GM, but I never understood why he seems to be practically revered by some.

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          • golden wrote: View Post

            Are you forgetting Siakam's epic Game 7 meltdown in the 4th quarter? And DeRozan playing so bad vs the Pacers he got benched by his surrogate father, Casey? Again Game 7 / 4th quarter. Eventually, as the series drags on, the repeated failures (due to lack of talent / weaknesses being exposed) gets into your head. When did Simmons pass up the dunk? Game 7.
            golden…we can probably meet halfway on this and say…”when the lights shines the brightest” (4th quarter series clinchers), they crumbled because they lack true talent/skill level and are mentally weak .

            #TradeVanVleet

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            • golden wrote: View Post

              I don't know if players really crumble in the playoffs... as much as their true talent/skill level/weaknesses get exposed ruthlessly & mercilessly.

              With Raptors DeRozan, they defended without fouling, packed the paint and trapped, which exposed his lack of 3-ball and not yet developed playmaking. With bubble Siakam, they took away his easy transition buckets which exposed the shaky 3-ball as well as handles/craft. With bubble FVV, they baited him to score at the rim, which exposed his slow footspeed and lack of finishing ability. With Simmons, it's obviously his shooting, even at the FT line. smh.
              You are right that sometimes it's just that things get harder and teams hone in on you and make it difficult and expose weaknesses but sometimes teams and players collapse under the weight of pressure. I didn't see much of game 7 but I watched the second half of both those games where the Hawks came back and the Sixers looked tired, confused, panicked, rushed, disorganized and all-around out of sorts. That's what teams and players look like when they cave in on themselves.

              Contra, teams have game-planned Giannis for 3 years now and made life extremely difficult for him taking away everything he likes. But he still competes for 48 minutes, is productive and never quits. That's what has everyone down on Simmons after this series: he gave up. That's inexcusable.

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              • Everybody's real down on Simmons, huh? I have full faith the Raps could fix him.

                That said, if Masai can swing it so extra value is coming our way in a Lowry SnT rather than going their way, no complaints here! If the rest of the league is as down on Simmons as you guys, Raps could make out like bandits.
                twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post

                  golden…we can probably meet halfway on this and say…”when the lights shines the brightest” (4th quarter series clinchers), they crumbled because they lack true talent/skill level and are mentally weak .
                  I actually agree with you on the 'mentally weak' part. I'm more explaining how/why it gets to that point.

                  All 3 of those guys (DeRozan, Siakam, Simmons) got frustrated to the point where they started to make really uncharacteristically bad plays... you could see the 'quit' in their body language. Like slaw said... some guys (like Giannis, Kawhi) just deal with playoff failure better... shrug it off and move on to the next play. Some guys let it simmer and boil over at the worst possible time.

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                  • DanH wrote: View Post
                    Everybody's real down on Simmons, huh? I have full faith the Raps could fix him.

                    That said, if Masai can swing it so extra value is coming our way in a Lowry SnT rather than going their way, no complaints here! If the rest of the league is as down on Simmons as you guys, Raps could make out like bandits.
                    Well right now there's no way it costs Lowry, a potential starter or 6th man (Boucher) and a future 1st for Ben Simmons.
                    Everyone other team took their last offer off the table after yesterday.

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                    • G__Deane wrote: View Post

                      Well right now there's no way it costs Lowry, a potential starter or 6th man (Boucher) and a future 1st for Ben Simmons.
                      Everyone other team took their last offer off the table after yesterday.
                      Well I hope you are right. I don't know that that's actually the case. But if we're getting Simmons AND say Maxey or a 1st for Lowry and Boucher, giddy up. I'd be more hesitant to take Thybulle in this case, he's a tough fit beside Simmons.
                      twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                      • DanH wrote: View Post
                        Everybody's real down on Simmons, huh? I have full faith the Raps could fix him.

                        That said, if Masai can swing it so extra value is coming our way in a Lowry SnT rather than going their way, no complaints here! If the rest of the league is as down on Simmons as you guys, Raps could make out like bandits.
                        How would a team successfully use Simmons? I'm just having a hard time seeing it rn.

                        Not only can the guy not shoot, apparently he's actually righ handed but his dad made him shoot left as a kid. He genuinely does not know which hand he should shoot with. A couple guys recently tried swapping hands mid-NBA career, it really doesn't work. I can't see Simmons developing a jumpshot out of nowhere now.

                        And without a shot, a lot of "he could be _____" comps fall apart. Could he be a team's Draymond? Sure, defends great, moves the ball, could play a forward spot. Could he be a team's Giannis? Sure, great in the open court, really hard to handle going to the rim, has size and speed.

                        But - both those guys can shoot, sort of. Draymond can space the floor and in his best seasons be a reasonable 3 pt threat. Giannis can hit a 10-15 footer and at least 50% from the line.

                        Simmons absolutely cannot shoot at all. Not 30% from 3, not from 15 feet, not from 10 feet. He can go 30% on FTs for an entire playoff series - and as soon as that happens, hack-a-Simmons is an easy strategy for the other team. Arguably you do that for a guy shooting like Shaq or Giannis on FTs - Simmons is even worse and it's an obvious move. At that point? You won't be able to have Simmons on the floor in crunch time of the most important games of the season. I mean this just happened. And people are saying "well, if he just shoots a bit better it's okay." Yeah sure. And if Giannis' 3 pt % bumps up a bit, imagine that. Imagine DeRozan with a 3 pt shot. Imagine Gobert with a jumper. We can imagine things all day. Given his trajectory to date and as fundamental a screw up as this guy not even being sure which hand he should be shooting with - I have zero confidence Simmons suddenly comes up with even a passable shot. And if he doesn't? No matter what you do with him, you still risk having a $30m player you have to bench in crunch time in the playoffs. Just don't see how you avoid that unless you've got the roster construction to take a flier on this guy and just see what happens.
                        ​​​​​​
                        "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                        • DanH wrote: View Post

                          Well I hope you are right. I don't know that that's actually the case. But if we're getting Simmons AND say Maxey or a 1st for Lowry and Boucher, giddy up. I'd be more hesitant to take Thybulle in this case, he's a tough fit beside Simmons.
                          We could deal Thybulle to an offense-heavy 3rd team, like the Hawks, Nets or Nuggets maybe. Thybulle made the all-defense team and is still on his rookie contract.... that should have some value around the league, hopefully.

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                          • Philly will be their best if they have Embiid and 4 shooters. They really missed Danny Green. Their most effective lineups in the Embiid era have been lineups with shooters.
                            "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                            • golden wrote: View Post

                              The Gallo steal was also the final nail.

                              People around here need to re-evaluate the whole concept that you can't win with offense-first players. Trae Young, Collins, Gallo and Lou Will have been unanimously heralded as bottom-of-the-barrel of NBA defenders at various times in their career. Bogdonavich and Heurter aren't exactly perennial All-Defense candidates either. That's 6 out of 8 of their main rotation guys are non-defenders.

                              And yet, the Hawks seriously cranked up their defensive intensity for the last 4 games of the series and took out the #1 seed.... without their top wing defender (Hunter).

                              I really hope Nurse is watching the Hawks and taking notes. Sure, we'd all love to have a roster full of switchable 2-way defenders who can dribble, pass and shoot the 3. But you have to maximize the strengths of the players you're given and develop a defensive scheme that makes sense, and Nate McMillan has done that this year.
                              You know I agree with you about drafting a scoring winger or an offense type player right? The Hawks are not a team I want to model my team after though. They're not really a contending team. 1. they beat a non-playoff team in the first round. 2. in the 2nd round they beat a team who's best player was playing with one leg and their second best player was Steph Curry's brother. They're gonna get exposed in the next round by the Bucks. Bogdanovic, Gallo Lou etc...all these guys are gonna get exposed defensively.

                              To me the perfect team is the Suns. They have the most complete roster in the NBA. They have an elite scoring winger(most important position in basketball), they have a great PG(second most important position in basketball) and they have a bunch of 3D guys(3rd most important position in basketball). Having a great big like Ayton is a bonus. You don't need a great big to win in this league though.

                              The Raps have a great PG. They have one 3D guy(OG), they need a lot more than one. The big piece that they're missing is that scoring winger.
                              Mamba Mentality

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                              • S.R. wrote: View Post

                                How would a team successfully use Simmons? I'm just having a hard time seeing it rn.

                                Not only can the guy not shoot, apparently he's actually righ handed but his dad made him shoot left as a kid. He genuinely does not know which hand he should shoot with. A couple guys recently tried swapping hands mid-NBA career, it really doesn't work. I can't see Simmons developing a jumpshot out of nowhere now.

                                And without a shot, a lot of "he could be _____" comps fall apart. Could he be a team's Draymond? Sure, defends great, moves the ball, could play a forward spot. Could he be a team's Giannis? Sure, great in the open court, really hard to handle going to the rim, has size and speed.

                                But - both those guys can shoot, sort of. Draymond can space the floor and in his best seasons be a reasonable 3 pt threat. Giannis can hit a 10-15 footer and at least 50% from the line.

                                Simmons absolutely cannot shoot at all. Not 30% from 3, not from 15 feet, not from 10 feet. He can go 30% on FTs for an entire playoff series - and as soon as that happens, hack-a-Simmons is an easy strategy for the other team. Arguably you do that for a guy shooting like Shaq or Giannis on FTs - Simmons is even worse and it's an obvious move. At that point? You won't be able to have Simmons on the floor in crunch time of the most important games of the season. I mean this just happened. And people are saying "well, if he just shoots a bit better it's okay." Yeah sure. And if Giannis' 3 pt % bumps up a bit, imagine that. Imagine DeRozan with a 3 pt shot. Imagine Gobert with a jumper. We can imagine things all day. Given his trajectory to date and as fundamental a screw up as this guy not even being sure which hand he should be shooting with - I have zero confidence Simmons suddenly comes up with even a passable shot. And if he doesn't? No matter what you do with him, you still risk having a $30m player you have to bench in crunch time in the playoffs. Just don't see how you avoid that unless you've got the roster construction to take a flier on this guy and just see what happens.
                                ​​​​​​
                                It will require baby steps for Simmons, I doubt he will ever become a shooter. He should work on his free throws first, get his confidence up, get his aggressiveness up, have him be a scorer that way. Hack-a-Simmons really got to him in these Playoffs.

                                It doesn't help that he isn't a fit at all beside Embiid, who is used as a high/low post player. Perhaps small ball is the best for Simmons. Pascal at C, Simmons at PF, OG at SF, surround him with players who can shoot and are constantly moving. Raptors are already a heavy fast break team and that is something Simmons excels at.

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