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  • MixxAOR wrote: View Post
    Not that sneaky, pretty obvious.

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    • MixxAOR wrote: View Post
      Sneaky?

      Mamba Mentality

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      • The Great One wrote: View Post

        Sneaky?

        https://nbathlete.com/bsparq-hall-of-fame/
        Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

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        • golden wrote: View Post
          If you look at likely USG scenarios... whoever is our center will be a low-usage guy (10-15% range) by default. Pascal (~27%) and Fred (~23%) will be our highest usage guys and OG and GTJ will be looking to increase their usage to median levels (e.g. ~20%).That's typically a low-skilled center who gets garbage buckets and the occasional some finish as roller. That role fits Birch to a T.

          Boucher (20% USG) is much better off the bench, where he can change/keep momentum and shoot 3's with abandon. He's more passive in the starting lineup, which defeats the purpose of his natural tendency to bring energy and be fearless on both ends.

          Scottie could be kind of a waste in the starting lineup because he'll be stuck in the corner (as a non-shooter), standing around watching the 4 other higher USG guys. That won't do anything to develop his talent as a ball-handler. We saw that in Summer League.

          To inthepaint's point. Your 5 best players don't always start, e.g., Manu.
          Worth noting that Fred's usage is boosted by his bench lineups. In starting type lineups (I grabbed the Birch one from the end of the year as an example) he floats right at 20%. But Pascal does still carry the high primary option usage in those lineups. So you are looking for a 10-15% usage guy at C.

          I do agree that Birch fits great with the starters (heck, we saw how well that worked last year) as a low usage guy, and I also like Boucher as a scorer off the bench.

          Scottie in the starting lineup is less clear. As a primary roll man (with his ability to playmake 4 on 3 if defences load up on the ball handler), or PnR ball handler with a guy like Siakam as the roll man, he could be very useful offensively. You would certainly not want him clearing out to the arc. But we also have some nice runway on that decision - would love to see him get reps in the starting lineup (or with those players in transitional looks) while Pascal is out, and then we can judge whether he needs more of a primary playmaking role off the bench beside a finisher like Boucher, or whether he might make some sense in the starting lineup longer term (this season - obviously the idea is for him to start LONG long term).
          twitter.com/dhackett1565

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          • Once Siakam is back at least, Barnes will be a point-forward (4) off the bench that sometimes is going to be our biggest player on the court (e.g. next to Pascal or Boucher) - you can call that "centre" or not. But that's pretty much that.
            Last edited by SkywalkerAC; Wed Sep 22, 2021, 04:52 PM.

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            • I do expect at lot of 3/4 or 4/5 pick and rolls when Scottie and Pascal are on the court together.

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              • Just a point of clarification on my prior posts re starting Barnes instead of Birch: it doesn't mean Barnes would play Birch's role (C). That would be primarily Siakam, which have had success there, and it could work well if he's not getting his 3pt% up right away like we're expecting. The idea is to play your best frontcourt players, switching and actively throwing different looks at opposing wings, C's and guards when needed, with Barnes as point forward (not standing in the corner), Pascal doing work inside and out, and OG spotting up and cutting. it's not a knock on Birch, it's just that Barnes happens to be the better player.

                My guess is he'll start while Pascal is out, and do well. Then when Pascal is back, they'll have to decide who to send to the bench, Birch or Barnes, and it'll be hard to send Barnes to the pine if he earned that spot and made an impact, but we'll see. It's very early too, there may be other injuries, trades, people playing up or down etc.. that might affect that dynamic like every season
                Last edited by inthepaint; Wed Sep 22, 2021, 04:06 PM.

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                • inthepaint wrote: View Post
                  Just a point of clarification on my prior posts re starting Barnes instead of Birch: it doesn't mean Barnes would play Birch's role (C). That would be primarily Siakam, which have had success there, and it could work well if he's not getting his 3pt% up right away like we're expecting. The idea is to play your best frontcourt players, switching and actively throwing different looks at opposing wings, C's and guards when needed, with Barnes as point forward (not standing in the corner), Pascal doing work inside and out, and OG spotting up and cutting. it's not a knock on Birch, it's just that Barnes happens to be the better player.

                  My guess is he'll start while Pascal is out, and do well. Then when Pascal is back, they'll have to decide who to send to the bench, Birch or Barnes, and it'll be hard to send Barnes to the pine if he earned that spot and made an impact, but we'll see. It's very early too, there may be other injuries, trades, people playing up or down etc.. that might affect that dynamic like every season
                  They could also send Trent to the bench and slide OG to SG as I've said many times. OG is lights out from 3 and can easily guard anyone at SG so no reason to not move him there if that makes the best fit.

                  I only see Birch going to the bench if Precious is replacing him.

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                  • I do see Barnes being a great option to slide to the "dunker" spot. And a good threat to roll off his picks. And not someone we want camping behind the 3-point line.

                    And not someone we really should put a positional label on whatsoever.

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                    • Yikes. A lot of bSPARQ superstars are big-time busts. Take Scottie off that list!


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                      • SkywalkerAC wrote: View Post
                        I do see Barnes being a great option to slide to the "dunker" spot. And a good threat to roll off his picks. And not someone we want camping behind the 3-point line.

                        And not someone we really should put a positional label on whatsoever.
                        I think you want him to be able to hit a spot up 3 but I also think where he is depends on who is on the floor.


                        LJ2


                        Question for you. Why are you seemingly adamant about trading one of OG or Siakam?

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                        • Primer wrote: View Post

                          They could also send Trent to the bench and slide OG to SG as I've said many times. OG is lights out from 3 and can easily guard anyone at SG so no reason to not move him there if that makes the best fit.

                          I only see Birch going to the bench if Precious is replacing him.
                          Yep. OG can totally slide to SG. That lineup would be very lengthy and strong defensively, which is good. The thing with that is Trent is also better/more impactful than Birch (albeit in different positions of course), and we're losing a lot of scoring with him sitting.

                          The fact remains that the 5 best players on this team are FVV, Trent, OG, Barnes & Siakam. Between them, they can cover all the duties of guards wings and bigs while providing the best combination of offence & defence. We obviously can't play that all the time, things need to rotate, but in my view in order to not start and have your 5 best players be the go-to lineup, there's gotta be a significant tactical advantage in doing otherwise (eg Manu in the old Spurs as pointed by Golden), and I personally don't see that here yet (but then again I might be wrong, the season hasn't even started yet)

                          Ultimately this is all very early, players will play up and down, get injured, Nurse will experiment etc.. so we can only speculate; I'll be curious to see how it unfolds and I'm glad with have enough depth to actually entertain these different possibilities.

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                          • inthepaint wrote: View Post

                            Yep. OG can totally slide to SG. That lineup would be very lengthy and strong defensively, which is good. The thing with that is Trent is also better/more impactful than Birch (albeit in different positions of course), and we're losing a lot of scoring with him sitting.

                            The fact remains that the 5 best players on this team are FVV, Trent, OG, Barnes & Siakam. Between them, they can cover all the duties of guards wings and bigs while providing the best combination of offence & defence. We obviously can't play that all the time, things need to rotate, but in my view in order to not start and have your 5 best players be the go-to lineup, there's gotta be a significant tactical advantage in doing otherwise (eg Manu in the old Spurs as pointed by Golden), and I personally don't see that here yet (but then again I might be wrong, the season hasn't even started yet)

                            Ultimately this is all very early, players will play up and down, get injured, Nurse will experiment etc.. so we can only speculate; I'll be curious to see how it unfolds and I'm glad with have enough depth to actually entertain these different possibilities.
                            Iguodala (Finals MVP) is another example of not starting your best 5. Having a big playmaker off the bench could be considered a tactical advantage, rather than underutilizing him in the starting lineup with other high usage guys.
                            Last edited by golden; Wed Sep 22, 2021, 08:13 PM.

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                            • SkywalkerAC wrote: View Post
                              Once Siakam is back at least, Barnes will be a point-forward (4) off the bench that sometimes is going to be our biggest player on the court (e.g. next to Pascal or Boucher) - you can call that "centre" or not. But that's pretty much that.
                              being a center goes beyond being the biggest player.

                              He is a point forward or a playmaker. That is different than just dumping it to gasol and having him work high low action grizzlies style.

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                              • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

                                being a center goes beyond being the biggest player.

                                He is a point forward or a playmaker. That is different than just dumping it to gasol and having him work high low action grizzlies style.
                                There’s no reason why he can’t play point forward/playmaker while guarding the biggest player on the court. If Kevin Durant isn’t too good for “center” then neither is Scottie.

                                i.e. there basically is no centre position in a positionless system.

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