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  • Dvdvideo wrote: View Post
    I could maybe be convinced of trading for beal if you could make a case that he is any different than demar. Thier stats carreer wise are almost identical. Are you saying you would take demar for freddy?
    Regular Phenom Derozan vs. Beal

    Code:
                                                                                  
    Player           FG%  3P%  2P%  FT% ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV   PTS ORtg DRtg
    Bradley Beal    .455 .375 .497 .822 1.2 4.5 5.8 5.7 1.6 0.6 3.4  31.1  110  111
    DeMar DeRozan   .460 .281 .479 .833 1.1 5.4 6.5 5.7 1.5 0.4 3.1  30.1  111  111
    Provided by Stathead.com: View Stathead Tool Used
    Generated 11/2/2021.

    Code:
                                                                                        
    Player           PER  TS% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG%   WS WS/48 OBPM DBPM BPM VORP
    Bradley Beal    18.3 .562  6.5 19.5  1.6  0.9 10.8 27.4 47.4  .108  2.6 -0.9 1.7 19.9
    DeMar DeRozan   18.5 .545  7.3 18.8  1.5  0.7 10.0 27.0 75.7  .120  1.4 -0.8 0.6 19.7
    Provided by Stathead.com: View Stathead Tool Used
    Generated 11/2/2021.


    Playoffs Derozan vs. Playoffs Beal

    Code:
                                                                                  
    Player            FG   3P   2P   FT ORB DRB TRB AST STL BLK TOV  PTS ORtg DRtg
    Bradley Beal    .442 .347 .490 .829 1.5 4.3 5.8 4.8 1.9 0.8 3.1 29.9  109  109
    DeMar DeRozan   .418 .233 .438 .851 1.0 5.5 6.5 5.0 1.5 0.3 3.2 30.8  103  113
    Provided by Stathead.com: View Stathead Tool Used
    Generated 11/2/2021.


    Code:
                                                                                        
    Player           PER   TS TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG%  WS WS/48 OBPM DBPM BPM VORP
    Bradley Beal    17.6 .546  6.5 16.6  1.9  1.3 10.3 26.6 4.2  .111  3.0  0.1 3.1  2.3
    DeMar DeRozan   16.6 .503  7.3 18.0  1.5  0.5  9.5 29.8 2.3  .052  1.1 -1.0 0.1  1.1
    Provided by Stathead.com: View Stathead Tool Used
    Generated 11/2/2021.

    You cannot cancel me out dumb dumb, I will always be in that little nugget of yours camping like a mosquito https://forums.raptorsrepublic.com/c...ilies/wink.png

    When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers


    Comment


    • again, In a heartbeat…if he is available you make that move
      You cannot cancel me out dumb dumb, I will always be in that little nugget of yours camping like a mosquito https://forums.raptorsrepublic.com/c...ilies/wink.png

      When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers


      Comment


      • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

        I am usually in agreement with you but by comparison weren't you the one who suggested JV fits our team...
        Uh, yes. They would really benefit from JV being here. Mind you, they seem to want to try abandoning the concept of a C, but as Birch showed, they still really benefit from someone who can at least do a reasonable C impersonation.

        But JV always graded out as a good defender (because he is) and the rest of the roster leaves them quite capable of defending with him in there and making up for his specific limitations in specific defensive situations. Add his rebounding and scoring to this lineup, gosh that would be great.

        Beal, though, just takes a lot of primary possessions (good) but very likely hurts the defence (bad, and likely their priority) while probably needing the ball a lot (also bad, they seem to want to have everyone touch the ball, attack can come from anywhere), and for the cost of likely Fred plus a LOT more.
        twitter.com/dhackett1565

        Comment


        • planetmars wrote: View Post
          I'm kind of tired of this Beal thing. I don't think he leaves. Washington has a decent team. They made a Rudy Gay trade and so far it's paying off. Beal likes Washington. They like him. I think he sticks around.

          In terms of fit, he's an offensive producer, and we need that. But Masai/Bobby prefer 2-way players even if they are a bit flawed offensively. Hopefully Jalen Brown or Jayson Tatum ask out of Boston. Things don't seem to be so peachy keen right now over in Bean Town.
          He does not at all. It is purely hypothetical. The only "star" that wants out is simmons right now. I would do it for him but its risky as heck.. but if its only FVV I'd do it if thats the primary thing you are giving up. They should have done a sign and trade for lowry.

          Comment


          • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post
            again, In a heartbeat…if he is available you make that move
            Not really though, if Beal is made available it will be for a kings ransom, not straight up for FVV, and Beal isn't worth more than FVV straight up.

            If we're going to be paying a kings ransom to improve the roster I'd rather target Ayton or Towns.

            They actually fill a need in starting C, they fit our age timeline (23 and 25 years old), and they're tall and long fitting our new roster specifications.

            Beal is 6'3 and he's 28 and having an absolutely abysmal season so far. Gary Trent is taller, longer, and plays way better defense. So we don't have this pressing need for a 6'3 SG having a career worst season (I can't overstate how bad of a season Beal is having, just horrendous).

            Give it a few weeks and Gary will make you forget all about Beal.

            Comment


            • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

              He does not at all. It is purely hypothetical. The only "star" that wants out is simmons right now. I would do it for him but its risky as heck.. but if its only FVV I'd do it if thats the primary thing you are giving up. They should have done a sign and trade for lowry.
              I think the ship has sailed on Simmons. He'll be traded to a team like Minny or Sacramento or Indiana. I don't see him coming here. We might have dangled our #4 pick with Kyle early on but the asking price got too hot and we bailed. Or Kyle just preferred Miami.

              Stars become available out of the blue. But the spark is usually team drama. Boston is facing it right now. Indiana has not started off well. Phoenix and Milwaukee are scuffling but they were in the finals last season so not much drama there yet. Portland is faltering as well but Lillard doesn't want to leave Portland (or so he says).

              Just have to have patience. Someone will become available. May not be this season, but could be in a year or two. My bet is we're looking at OKC and Shai and waiting for him to become available. I bet that he'll get sick and tired of tanking every year. He'd be an amazing fit.


              Comment


              • planetmars wrote: View Post

                I think the ship has sailed on Simmons. He'll be traded to a team like Minny or Sacramento or Indiana. I don't see him coming here. We might have dangled our #4 pick with Kyle early on but the asking price got too hot and we bailed. Or Kyle just preferred Miami.

                Stars become available out of the blue. But the spark is usually team drama. Boston is facing it right now. Indiana has not started off well. Phoenix and Milwaukee are scuffling but they were in the finals last season so not much drama there yet. Portland is faltering as well but Lillard doesn't want to leave Portland (or so he says).

                Just have to have patience. Someone will become available. May not be this season, but could be in a year or two. My bet is we're looking at OKC and Shai and waiting for him to become available. I bet that he'll get sick and tired of tanking every year. He'd be an amazing fit.

                I like that last paragraph a lot. OKC seems to be in perpetual rebuild, they're like the Kansas City Royals or those baseball teams that you know are gonna trade their stars before they get mega pricey. SGA in a few years seems to fit this team PERFECTLY, as the heir to FVV


                It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

                Comment


                • Primer wrote: View Post

                  Not really though, if Beal is made available it will be for a kings ransom, not straight up for FVV, and Beal isn't worth more than FVV straight up.

                  If we're going to be paying a kings ransom to improve the roster I'd rather target Ayton or Towns.

                  They actually fill a need in starting C, they fit our age timeline (23 and 25 years old), and they're tall and long fitting our new roster specifications.

                  Beal is 6'3 and he's 28 and having an absolutely abysmal season so far. Gary Trent is taller, longer, and plays way better defense. So we don't have this pressing need for a 6'3 SG having a career worst season (I can't overstate how bad of a season Beal is having, just horrendous).

                  Give it a few weeks and Gary will make you forget all about Beal.
                  Lol…. I just don’t know why you keep re-inserting yourself in the conversation. Hahaha

                  The series of my responses about Beal all rooted from dvdvideo’s original statement that he won’t consider giving up Van Vleet for Beal straight up. We both agreed otherwise, it would take more than Van Vleet to convince the Wizards to listen if ever that time comes Beal is available.

                  And yes I also agree, the strong emergence of GTJ will no longer be something this franchise would consider if Beal is available.

                  But in general….if He is available, you can give up a Van Vleet in a heartbeat.

                  Now let me do a segway about your interest in Ayton or KAT, WHO would you give up from this current roster?
                  You cannot cancel me out dumb dumb, I will always be in that little nugget of yours camping like a mosquito https://forums.raptorsrepublic.com/c...ilies/wink.png

                  When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers


                  Comment


                  • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post

                    Lol…. I just don’t know why you keep re-inserting yourself in the conversation. Hahaha

                    The series of my responses about Beal all rooted from dvdvideo’s original statement that he won’t consider giving up Van Vleet for Beal straight up. We both agreed otherwise, it would take more than Van Vleet to convince the Wizards to listen if ever that time comes Beal is available.

                    And yes I also agree, the strong emergence of GTJ will no longer be something this franchise would consider if Beal is available.

                    But in general….if He is available, you can give up a Van Vleet in a heartbeat.

                    Now let me do a segway about your interest in Ayton or KAT, WHO would you give up from this current roster?
                    What? It's the RR forums man, the entire purpose is to converse with other fans. You want a private conversation use the DM feature. If it's in a thread it's fair game for anyone to respond to. None of these are just 2-way conversations. Although we do let you and Dan go at each others throats sometimes and just pretend it isn't happening, but that's just because you seem to be very specifically needling each other.


                    As for Ayton or KAT, I'd give up FVV, Flynn, Dragic, Boucher, Picks. That's what I'd try to use anyways.

                    Messed around with a 3-way trade last night between us, Dallas, and Minnesota where we get KAT, Minnesota gets FVV and Porzingis, and Dallas gets Dragic and Boucher (and rid of Porizingis contract). Likely need picks in there as well. Something like that would be great.

                    Comment


                    • Primer wrote: View Post

                      What? It's the RR forums man, the entire purpose is to converse with other fans. You want a private conversation use the DM feature. If it's in a thread it's fair game for anyone to respond to. None of these are just 2-way conversations. Although we do let you and Dan go at each others throats sometimes and just pretend it isn't happening, but that's just because you seem to be very specifically needling each other.


                      As for Ayton or KAT, I'd give up FVV, Flynn, Dragic, Boucher, Picks. That's what I'd try to use anyways.

                      Messed around with a 3-way trade last night between us, Dallas, and Minnesota where we get KAT, Minnesota gets FVV and Porzingis, and Dallas gets Dragic and Boucher (and rid of Porizingis contract). Likely need picks in there as well. Something like that would be great.
                      dont get too hypersensitive….you keep re-inserting to the conversation not knowing what it all rooted from and yet your responses are far off from what exactly was the original main point, that is what I am saying….but let’s move on lol

                      Getting KAT or Ayton may take a Siakam and not Van Vleet….

                      the offer you made for either two players ain’t a kings ransom as what you originally indicated

                      Last edited by The Claw Reborn; Tue Nov 2, 2021, 01:42 PM.
                      You cannot cancel me out dumb dumb, I will always be in that little nugget of yours camping like a mosquito https://forums.raptorsrepublic.com/c...ilies/wink.png

                      When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers


                      Comment


                      • If Raptors pull a trigger on a star it'll be a star like Kawhi. Offense and defense. No compromises.
                        Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

                        Comment


                        • planetmars wrote: View Post

                          I think the ship has sailed on Simmons. He'll be traded to a team like Minny or Sacramento or Indiana. I don't see him coming here. We might have dangled our #4 pick with Kyle early on but the asking price got too hot and we bailed. Or Kyle just preferred Miami.

                          Stars become available out of the blue. But the spark is usually team drama. Boston is facing it right now. Indiana has not started off well. Phoenix and Milwaukee are scuffling but they were in the finals last season so not much drama there yet. Portland is faltering as well but Lillard doesn't want to leave Portland (or so he says).

                          Just have to have patience. Someone will become available. May not be this season, but could be in a year or two. My bet is we're looking at OKC and Shai and waiting for him to become available. I bet that he'll get sick and tired of tanking every year. He'd be an amazing fit.

                          I don't even know if it will come from Shai's camp. He doesn't lineup with their massive stock pile of picks. He will be too good, too soon, and they will still be in build mode. They will use his new salary to take back an overpaid or an expiring player with some picks and add to their pile.

                          Maybe in the summer (as I don't think Shai can be traded this season), with Banton and Barnes showing their merit, we could move on from FVV attach a couple picks and potentially a player like Flynn and grab SGA. Which would be absolutely huge. OKC would move off, for them, a big contract and they would get a great player like FVV who they could use or trade for more picks. We would get a bonafide homegrown Canadian Star player that would fit pretty seamlessly with our young core.

                          SGA, Trent, Barnes, OG, Siakam starting core, with Banton and Precious off the bench would be a pretty exciting young team to watch.

                          SGA would be the type of player that I would move on from one of our established core pieces. (OG, FVV and Siakam). I think in terms of untouchables; I think only the young guys of Banton, Barnes, and Precious would fall into that category. Trent has shown to be more than most of us thought, he is also quite young which would fit with our young core.

                          It all depends though, if these guys click when Siakam gets back, we could just be running it back with whatever pick we end up with, and a few minor tweaks of using Dragic, Boucher, and Flynn as trade pieces at the deadline/offseason.

                          Comment


                          • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post

                            dont get too hypersensitive….you keep re-inserting to the conversation not knowing what it all rooted from and yet your responses are far off from what exactly was the original main point, that is what I am saying….but let’s move on lol

                            Getting KAT or Ayton may take a Siakam and not Van Vleet….

                            the offer you made for either two players ain’t a kings ransom as what you originally indicated
                            No I'm not in favor of any real kings ransom trade as it would create more problems than it fixes. I'm good with tossing in a bunch of picks for the right player, and picks might be enough to get Ayton since Phoenix is being cheap and that's the only reason he may be gettable. Minnesota doesn't need picks but they're horribly run so maybe they make the trade despite that. What Minnesota really needs is to dump Russell but I couldn't come up with any beneficial way for us to help them out of that jam.

                            Comment


                            • MixxAOR wrote: View Post
                              If Raptors pull a trigger on a star it'll be a star like Kawhi. Offense and defense. No compromises.
                              We ended up winning a championship so its all moot.. but I wonder if we were seriously looking at Jimmy Butler when he was trying to get out of Minnesota. Philly ended up getting him for Covington, Saric, Bayless and a SRP.

                              Jimmy was making $20M then. I wonder if we could have had him for Norm ($9M), Green ($10M) and a SRP. We probably would have had to include OG though.

                              Kyle/Butler/Kawhi/Pascal/Gasol starting line up would have been nasty.

                              Comment


                              • Shredder wrote: View Post

                                I don't even know if it will come from Shai's camp. He doesn't lineup with their massive stock pile of picks. He will be too good, too soon, and they will still be in build mode. They will use his new salary to take back an overpaid or an expiring player with some picks and add to their pile.

                                Maybe in the summer (as I don't think Shai can be traded this season), with Banton and Barnes showing their merit, we could move on from FVV attach a couple picks and potentially a player like Flynn and grab SGA. Which would be absolutely huge. OKC would move off, for them, a big contract and they would get a great player like FVV who they could use or trade for more picks. We would get a bonafide homegrown Canadian Star player that would fit pretty seamlessly with our young core.

                                SGA, Trent, Barnes, OG, Siakam starting core, with Banton and Precious off the bench would be a pretty exciting young team to watch.

                                SGA would be the type of player that I would move on from one of our established core pieces. (OG, FVV and Siakam). I think in terms of untouchables; I think only the young guys of Banton, Barnes, and Precious would fall into that category. Trent has shown to be more than most of us thought, he is also quite young which would fit with our young core.

                                It all depends though, if these guys click when Siakam gets back, we could just be running it back with whatever pick we end up with, and a few minor tweaks of using Dragic, Boucher, and Flynn as trade pieces at the deadline/offseason.
                                the best time to trade him would be off season with GTJ as a potential out going salary.

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