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Everything Scottie Barnes

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  • planetmars wrote: View Post
    David Thorpe raved about Barnes earlier on.. had him #2 on his board after Mobley (not Cade). Starts at about the 18m mark.

    David Thorpe is the guy who helped Masai get his big break into the NBA. Masai owes him a lot and you just know 100% that Thorpe gave Masai some intel that influenced the pick. And Thorpe admits he is biased on Barnes because his son (Max Thorpe, who did not play a single minute) is his Florida St. teammate. Thorpe also said he watched every minute of Barnes games this year

    Everything Thorpe raves about Barnes screams - high-end role player. That's, um.... nice. He believes Barnes offensive ceiling, 5 years from now, will be 18-20 ppg and he compares him with Giannis? Listening to what Thorpe values in player, you wonder if Steph or Luka would ever crack his top 30 draft board. They'd probably go un-drafted. lol.


    • Primer wrote: View Post

      There's a reason Draymond played 4 years of college ball. If we were getting Barnes 3 years from now and he had improved his shot and rebounding like Draymond did I'd be happy with the pick.
      I think the age thing is pretty important. He'll turn 20 in a few days but, as you suggest, you can't compare him to someone who spent 4 years in college working on their game every off season. It will be interesting to see how all of these guys look by late October, after Los Vegas, work with trainers they couldn't afford on their own and input from the Raptors developmental team. Then a full season in the G League. I remember being completely surprised by Harris when he finally got time on the floor at the end of the season. He looked like he had turned from being a nobody into a rotation guy. And we all saw the progress Flynn made.


      • So slept on it, and I'm still not a happy about the pick. The guy has no post game. No real face up game. He can't create his own shot. He's pass first over score first, and is 6'9. And he doesn't fit our team right now. I'd rather give minutes to Yuta because he can at least stretch the floor.

        The fact that he can bring the ball up the floor is nice I guess.. but RHJ and Stanley could do that as well.

        I think we really lost out on an opportunity to get someone special.

        Happy to be proven wrong on this one.. but if this doesn't work out like I think it will.. then we've taken a step back as a franchise here.


        • So, depending on how the offseason goes, I think there's a high chance Barnes is coming off the bench for his rookie season at least (unless he surprises and is great at C right away). The good news in that regard is that means if we can get decent minutes out of him, we can possibly have 48 minutes of having two of Pascal/OG/Barnes on the floor, which will just absolutely suck for opposing scorers.


          • saints91 wrote: View Post
            - If he magically grows 2-3 inches (presently 6’-7”without shoes) like some players have after being drafted, and up his free throw percentages, we have a good 5.

            - if he figures out to shoot and brings up his shooting percentages by 10% we have a good two way player

            - If improves his handle, and passing to be elite, and improves his shooting percentages by 10%, we might have a generational talent at PG.

            Obviously the height thing he can’t control but would be awesome if he turned into a legit 5. The other 2 scenarios will take a lot of work and some natural ability to get there.
            And I suspect they made the pick thinking there's a chance all three of the above can be accomplished. In which case it pays off big time.

            Of course, those are all huge improvements to make. Hardly the safest pick. But the upside is there, it's just a big leap to actually get there.


            • I keep forgetting that he has been a player on every USA Basketball team he was eligible for. That is not nothing. And had an opportunity to experience winning gold medals:

              "Gold Medals: 2019 FIBA U19 World Cup, 2018 FIBA U17 World Cup and 2017 FIBA Americas U16 Championship.

              As a member of the 2019 USA Basketball Men’s U19 World Cup Team, captured a gold medal with a 7-0 record at the FIBA U19 World Cup in Heraklion, Greece. Played in all seven games, averaged 20.4 mpg., 9.7 ppg., 4.9 rpg., 2.7 apg. and 1.0 spg. Shot 54.2% from the field. Recorded 16 points versus New Zealand; 16 points against Latvia; 13 points versus Russia; and 11 points and 8 rebounds in USA's win over Mali in the gold medal game. Played in both of the USA exhibition games and averaged 13.5 mpg., 7.0 ppg., 2.5 rpg. and 1.5 apg. while shooting 63.6% from the field."


              • I love the bolded part. I kept hearing it last night too...he's a culture setter, a worker, leadership skills, a winner. We got away from that a little bit lately with the Terrence Davis etc, this kid seems more like Kyle, Fred, OG, Pascal, Demar, Serge, etc. Culture setters, workers.

                One problem with Draymond comparisons is that few players in that mold are ever put in the same role he has in Golden State. There are so many centers in the NBA that it’s hard to find minutes at the position for smaller players. And few teams have the necessary floor spacing to create the passing and driving lanes that Draymond was so successful at exploiting.

                That’s what makes Barnes’s fit so intriguing on the Raptors. Toronto has a ready-made core around him, with four players who can shoot and defend in Fred VanVleet, Gary Trent Jr., OG Anunoby, and Pascal Siakam. The one thing the team was missing was a center, as it never truly replaced Marc Gasol and Serge Ibaka. It would be unfair to throw Barnes into the fire as a starting center as a rookie. But don’t be surprised if he’s soon closing games at the position.

                Barnes is the rare young player who should be able to defend at a high level early in his NBA career. He checks all the right boxes. He’s a smart player who has shown the ability to rotate as a weak-side defender and diagnose plays as they happen. He already has the size and strength to hold his own physically. Plus he has a reputation at both the college and high school levels for competing on that end of the floor. He should fit right in with the culture in Toronto.

                The best-case scenario for the Raptors is that Barnes, Anunoby, and Siakam become a dream of a small-ball frontcourt. They could fly all over the floor on defense and make plays for each other on offense while having just enough shooting between them to survive. This should be a one-time pit stop in the lottery. There’s no reason that Toronto can’t make a playoff run next season. The question is whether it can beat Joel Embiid or Giannis Antetokounmpo playing this way. But that would be a question even if it hadn’t taken Barnes.

                The Florida State product couldn’t have landed in a better spot to develop. So much of whether or not a young player succeeds in the NBA depends on the situation around him. Barnes would have been much worse off if the draft had gone according to plan and he landed in Orlando, which has a logjam at center and doesn’t have the shooting at other positions to open up the floor for him. Toronto is the perfect landing spot, but Barnes still has an uphill battle to be as good as Suggs.
                Last edited by KeonClark; Fri Jul 30, 2021, 10:13 AM.
                9 time first team all-RR, First Ballot Hall of Forum


                • He wasn't the exciting pick but hopefully he was the right pick.


                  • He's so young that he could end up being a lot of things. He landed in one of the elite development programs in the league though.


                    • Sounds like a gym rat too.

                      Mamba Mentality


                      • Whats up RR! Hadda come out of hiding for this one - absolutely loved this draft.

                        Watched Barnes during the season and generally subscribed to the consensus… right after the lotto I watched ~3-4 games of the prospects in our range and holy smokes did I love Barnes’ film. The guy is just so dominant on both ends, for every possession - hes relentless. What makes him nore than a high motor glue guy is him combines his incredible tools and motor with a reeeaallly good court awareness and and feel. Oftentimes on defense he’d track his guy, a cutter or two and the ball and effectively could cover them all because of how well he covers ground then can recover and make a play without losing control and becoming reckless. It obviously helps when you can effectively cover 1-5. This is the future of the NBA and how we run defense the freedom he had in school will immediately transfer.

                        Offensively his game isnt sexy, but he still makes plays. He does the little things that win games - cuts, screens, crashes the boards and moves the ball. I was surprised how well he can read a defense - his vision is legit. His game scales up so well with some more skill development and NBA spacing. Right now hes still more of a threat in transition with a loose handle a poor shot and a shallow bag. That can be said for all the guys that went in our range, I really didnt get why it was held over Barnes’ head… Suggs is not a good half court player yet. I think both guys get there, by all accounts high character, culture setters, incredible work ethic etc.

                        I could go on… have a flight today, I might try to cut up some film on Barnes and go a bit more in depth. Dont know much about the other guys but man their highlights are sick. Toolsy as hell with vision and skills. Love the direction of the team right now.


                        • The Great One wrote:
                          Some of the player comps here are just way off. PJ Tucker? Mbah a Moute? Another one is OG. The only similarities that Barnes and OG have is their height lol. NBA TV compared him to Scottie Pippen. Not sure about that as well. Barnes plays like a PG. My player comp is a Ben Simmons with an attitude/heart. Draymond Green obviously is another good comp. If Barnes develop a shot then I think he'll be able to create his own shot one day because he's got great handles.

                          Rich mans Lamar Odom? (as a ceiling, somewhere between Magic and Odom)
                          9 time first team all-RR, First Ballot Hall of Forum


                          • I dislike the Draymond comps. Draymond is like Rodman and to a certain extent Meta WP. Each of those guys are all wired a different way and because that attitude and motor they became elite at certain elements of the game. Those personalities made them be great. It’s not something you can project. They have a chip on their shoulder that they’ve harnessed in the perfect way.

                            You almost have to luck into it.
                            Last edited by saints91; Fri Jul 30, 2021, 11:09 AM.


                            • KeonClark wrote: View Post

                              Rich mans Lamar Odom? (as a ceiling, somewhere between Magic and Odom)
                              Lamar Odom is a great comp if he can approve the O


                              • The Ringer dubs us a winner in their "NBA Draft Winners and Losers":

                                I’d love to say the Raptors zigged when everyone thought they’d zag, but honestly, Barnes is such a Raptor: Like Kyle Lowry, who gave him the seal of approval months ago, he has the kind of infectious, unteachable energy that can start a positive feedback loop, as well as a hard-to-quantify but undeniable impact on winning (three gold medals, two state championships). Like Pascal Siakam and OG Anunoby and Chris Boucher, he covers enough space to make you feel like he’s in two places at once. He’s also going to need time to develop his jumper, and actually seems excited about it.

                                Barnes is 6-foot-8 with a nearly 7-foot-3 wingspan, a 39-inch vertical, and hands just half-an-inch smaller than Kawhi Leonard’s. He has the tools to be the best defender in this draft. More importantly, he wants to be the best defender.

                                A lot of versatile forwards can pick up point guards. Few instinctively pick them up full court without being asked. He doesn’t block a lot of shots because he’d rather get stops. Watch this video of him breaking down his game with ESPN’s Mike Schmitz. Barnes knows the scouting report. Cold.

                                Like Patrick Williams, who also went no. 4 last year, Barnes won ACC Sixth Man of the Year with Florida State. He’s a natural playmaker, the multi-outlet plug in Florida State’s connected offense. He turned down Duke and Kentucky to play for Florida State, where his size and athleticism thrivedon a roster filled with similar players.

                                His fit might seem redundant on a team with Siakam, Anunoby, and Boucher, but let the Bucks, who just built a spider web around Chris Paul and Devin Booker, be a lesson: long arms feed off of each other. With Barnes, the Raptors doubled down on defense, they doubled down on their developmental program. They doubled down on themselves. Ten years from now, it might turn out they were really just feeling themselves. But I’m betting the synergy pays off.